Author Topic: DIY seasonal wheel changeover  (Read 32309 times)

Offline Noto

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13563
  • Carma: +774/-2131
  • This forum is making me almost as bitter as SirO
    • View Profile
  • Cars: '23 Mazda CX-50 Turbo; '11 Fozzie XT

Offline tortoise

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 14973
  • Carma: +235/-453
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2017, 12:40:00 pm »
FYI, the manual in my car specifically states that you can use the middle jack points.

But I agree, check the manual to find yours.
Only the slow and dim know where they're going in life, and seldom is it worth the trip. - Tom Robbins.

Offline Fobroader

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 35380
  • Carma: +1424/-2114
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2022 Honda Ridgeline, 2021 Lexus GX460, 2018 Kawasaki Versys X300
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2017, 12:40:27 pm »
Honestly man, go to Canadian tire for tools, just for ease of replacement.
Lighten up Francis.....

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2017, 12:44:33 pm »
So it's better to raise and lower each corner than to raise half the car at a time?

And the trolley jack is sufficient - no need for the stands?


If you jack one corner at a time, you don't need jackstands.  If you're jacking the middle points at the front and the rear, you'll need jackpoints.  Honestly, if you have a floor jack, they're easy enough to use that you can just jack each corner without too much hassle.

Jackstands are required if you're ever going to go underneath the car, or if it will be in the air for an extended amount of time (like a brake job).  Hydraulic jacks can fail, but generally the amount of time the car is in the air for you to change a wheel over, the risk is negligible. 

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2017, 12:45:20 pm »
Honestly man, go to Canadian tire for tools, just for ease of replacement.

That.  AS mentioned before, ironclad replacement guarantee.  If it says Mastercraft on the side, they'll replace it no questions asked.

Offline blur911

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13629
  • Carma: +242/-779
  • Nasty Weasel
    • View Profile
  • Cars: and bikes by age:BMW, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Suzuki, Mazda, Jaguar, Kawasaki, Porsche, GMC, Suzuki
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2017, 12:45:31 pm »

This is seeming to be not such a simple task.  Next someone will say I should get a brush to clear off rust/debris, and then some sort of grease before re-applying the nuts?  ;)

My understanding is that if I get the set for $99 at CT (for example), I could hoist one side of the car at a time, put the two jack stands in place, and then do the other side so I'm not doing 4 separate hoists (just two) per vehicle. 

I didn't know that I needed a separate wrench ("breaker bar"?) to remove the nuts - but I am reading more and more to not use the torque wrench to do it - why is that -- to protect the other wrench?

And yes, I figured out that I'd need two sockets, which isn't a big cost.

Let me rephrase:
What items will I need to do the changeovers with relative ease and without breaking the bank. 

Changeovers will likely be free on both the Mazda and the RX - just the Forester at $80/year.  The purpose of the DIY is to avoid the hassle of having to book appointments, drop off the cars, pick them up, etc.  The $ savings are only relevant if I'm not spending as much to buy the equipment and then doing the work myself. 

It looks like in the torque wrench, breaker bar, and sockets, I'll be spending $97 (amazon), and then another $80-$100 for the lift and stands (unless I buy separate things for 2 ton instead of 3 ton).  Somehow, I'm at $200 and I have to do the work myself. :-\

At this point, it looks like it'll take 2 years to pay off (assuming nothing breaks) from a strictly financial standpoint.

Most cars don't have a jacking point to lift the whole side, smaller cars yes, the SUV, probably not.  Sometimes it's easier to go front/rear than side to side, providing you have proper jacking points.

You don't really need anything more than what came with the car to change wheels, it just makes the job easier when you're doing it to have the tools.  As mentioned, you don't really need jackstands to change wheels, as long as you're not sticking your bits under the car you won't use them.   You don't really need a torque wrench if  you have a good idea about how much torque you are applying, but as you have no experience, well, get a torque wrench.
 Not using it to remove nuts is indeed to protect it,  a click type should also only be used in the range before the click, tightening more after the click can damage the calibration.  When removing nuts nobody remembers to dial up the torque setting and  it clicks immediately, you loosen the nuts, now it's out of calibration.  That's why it's a good idea to only use it for the actual final torque setting.

Buy tools on sale, never pay full price unless you really need it.  Most hand tools go on sale for 50% off at some point.
Mr Pickypants

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2017, 12:47:24 pm »
So it's better to raise and lower each corner than to raise half the car at a time?

And the trolley jack is sufficient - no need for the stands?

i.e. I should just buy this?

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/certified-hydraulic-trolley-jack-2-ton-0091039p.html

and then the Amazon stuff:
Breaker bar:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00VPPK0E0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1WGV8EKMX9P1U&psc=1

Torque Wrench:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00C5ZL0RU/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

21mm socket:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B000NPR4CE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

19mm socket:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B000NPXKD6/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

...and that's all?

Those are impact sockets, meant for impact guns.  While they will still work fine for non-impact applications, you're spending more money for no reason.

Offline Fobroader

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 35380
  • Carma: +1424/-2114
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2022 Honda Ridgeline, 2021 Lexus GX460, 2018 Kawasaki Versys X300
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2017, 12:50:29 pm »
I would hold out for a Canadian tires sale and get a full set of wrenches and sockets on sale. No point in only getting 3 tools....but thats just me.

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #28 on: March 24, 2017, 12:54:31 pm »
Keep it simple. 

Get a beam-type torque wrench.  They're cheaper, and can't be damaged by forgetting to unload them when storing them.
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/beam-type-torque-wrench-1-2-in-0588660p.html#srp

Get a tire iron for breaking nuts loose, and for spinning them off/on.  Use the torque wrench only for the final tightening (once they're hand tight).
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-3-way-lug-wrench-20-in-0091512p.html#srp

And then a couple of sockets.

Or, this tremendous deal: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/mastercraft-universal-socket-set-174-pc-0589461p.html#srp

With a set like that, you could disassemble an entire lawnmower.  Or replace an alternator in your driveway.  or a waterpump.  Or install gate hardware.  Or take apart your washing machine to diagnose and replace a control module (speaking from experience).  As a homeowner, it's an almost essential toolset.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 12:56:34 pm by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline blur911

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13629
  • Carma: +242/-779
  • Nasty Weasel
    • View Profile
  • Cars: and bikes by age:BMW, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Suzuki, Mazda, Jaguar, Kawasaki, Porsche, GMC, Suzuki
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #29 on: March 24, 2017, 01:01:37 pm »
So it's better to raise and lower each corner than to raise half the car at a time?

And the trolley jack is sufficient - no need for the stands?

i.e. I should just buy this?

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/certified-hydraulic-trolley-jack-2-ton-0091039p.html

and then the Amazon stuff:
Breaker bar:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00VPPK0E0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1WGV8EKMX9P1U&psc=1

Torque Wrench:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00C5ZL0RU/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

21mm socket:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B000NPR4CE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

19mm socket:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B000NPXKD6/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

...and that's all?

Splurge and buy a socket set that includes those sizes in 1/2" drive.  Buying single sockets is horribly expensive, sometime in your life you'll need tools.  Like AS said, buy local for service.  Don't buy junk tools, you'll regret it.

Offline Noto

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13563
  • Carma: +774/-2131
  • This forum is making me almost as bitter as SirO
    • View Profile
  • Cars: '23 Mazda CX-50 Turbo; '11 Fozzie XT
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #30 on: March 24, 2017, 01:02:22 pm »
Honestly man, go to Canadian tire for tools, just for ease of replacement.
I will definitely buy the trolley jack at CT, but for the wrench/breaker bar/sockets, why not get off Amazon? The sockets are only $10 a piece and the wrench/bar are both cheaper and simple - I can't imagine they'll break.  That, and CT, at least online, doesn't seem to have 19mm or 21mm sockets individually - just in a big set.

So the consensus is that a 2-ton trolley jack is sufficient and stands aren't necessary?

Any thoughts on the $40 trolley jack at CT?
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/certified-hydraulic-trolley-jack-2-ton-0091039p.html

Get a beam-type torque wrench.  They're cheaper, and can't be damaged by forgetting to unload them when storing them.
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/beam-type-torque-wrench-1-2-in-0588660p.html#srp
Is there any functional difference between that and the other type of torque wrench?  Why would anyone not get this type?

Get a tire iron for breaking nuts loose, and for spinning them off/on.  Use the torque wrench only for the final tightening (once they're hand tight).
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-3-way-lug-wrench-20-in-0091512p.html#srp
Why this instead of a breaker bar?

Or, this tremendous deal: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/mastercraft-universal-socket-set-174-pc-0589461p.html#srp

With a set like that, you could disassemble an entire lawnmower.  Or replace an alternator in your driveway.  or a waterpump.  Or install gate hardware.  Or take apart your washing machine to diagnose and replace a control module (speaking from experience).  As a homeowner, it's an almost essential toolset.
Does this have a torque wrench?  I.e. would it have everything I need to do the wheels if the only other thing I buy is a trolley jack?

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #31 on: March 24, 2017, 01:08:09 pm »
Honestly man, go to Canadian tire for tools, just for ease of replacement.
I will definitely buy the trolley jack at CT, but for the wrench/breaker bar/sockets, why not get off Amazon? The sockets are only $10 a piece and the wrench/bar are both cheaper and simple - I can't imagine they'll break.  That, and CT, at least online, doesn't seem to have 19mm or 21mm sockets individually - just in a big set.

So the consensus is that a 2-ton trolley jack is sufficient and stands aren't necessary?

Any thoughts on the $40 trolley jack at CT?
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/certified-hydraulic-trolley-jack-2-ton-0091039p.html

Get a beam-type torque wrench.  They're cheaper, and can't be damaged by forgetting to unload them when storing them.
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/beam-type-torque-wrench-1-2-in-0588660p.html#srp
Is there any functional difference between that and the other type of torque wrench?  Why would anyone not get this type?

This is simpler.  It's simply a bar that has been calibrated to bend when applying certain torques.  It's not as precise as the click-type, but for installing lug-nuts you really don't need to be that precise.  It's not like you're installing cylinder head bolts or anything super complicated.  You just need to get in the ballpark of the specified torque.

The click-type torque wrenches are much more complex.  They have springs inside them.  You have to set them to the desired torque, use them, then remember to 'unload' them, i.e. set them back to zero.  If you store them while they are still set to a torque, you can do damage to them.  they are also more expensive.

Get a tire iron for breaking nuts loose, and for spinning them off/on.  Use the torque wrench only for the final tightening (once they're hand tight).
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-3-way-lug-wrench-20-in-0091512p.html#srp
Why this instead of a breaker bar?


A cross-tire-iron because it's cheaper than a breaker bar, and you can pull with one hand as you push with the other.  It also makes 'spinning' the nuts off easier and quicker.

Or, this tremendous deal: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/mastercraft-universal-socket-set-174-pc-0589461p.html#srp

With a set like that, you could disassemble an entire lawnmower.  Or replace an alternator in your driveway.  or a waterpump.  Or install gate hardware.  Or take apart your washing machine to diagnose and replace a control module (speaking from experience).  As a homeowner, it's an almost essential toolset.
Does this have a torque wrench?  I.e. would it have everything I need to do the wheels if the only other thing I buy is a trolley jack?

That set does NOT have a torque wrench.  Torque wrenches typically don't come in sets, and are usually sold separately.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 01:12:07 pm by Great_Big_Abyss »

Offline RX7heaven

  • Learner's Permit
  • *
  • Posts: 74
  • Carma: +2/-5
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: '98 Forester,'09 Impreza
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #32 on: March 24, 2017, 01:08:51 pm »
I've been paying $100/year to change over snows on a 2009 Impreza so I have been collecting tools to try it myself. I worked in a shop 40 years ago but the job should be much the same. I would recommend floor jacks ( at least placed loosely in case the jack slips) and wheel chocks ( if lifting both fronts or rears at the same time). I got a  breaker bar on sale at Canadian Tire and pretty winter rims from Tire Rack. Impact guns might have led to premature wear and rusting on the Impreza lug nuts. I have a torque wrench to tighten to 66 lb./ft. I bought new lug nuts for the Impreza and used the old ones on my '98 Forester. I once bought cheap lug nuts that began to rust 1 year later! The jack points are ridges so I'm wondering if I need an adapter for the floor jack or if a piece of notched wood would work. Safety first - beer later. :skid:
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 01:25:52 pm by RX7heaven »
"If it's hard to do, it's not worth doing" - H. Simpson

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 13752
  • Carma: +267/-457
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Mazda CX-5
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #33 on: March 24, 2017, 01:10:43 pm »
I've been paying $100/year to change over snows on a 2009 Impreza so I have been collecting tools to try it myself. I worked in a shop 30 years ago but the job should be much the same. I would recommend floor jacks and wheel chocks as well as a breaker bar which I got on sale at Canadian Tire. Impact guns might have led to premature wear and rusting on the Impreza lug nuts. I have a torque wrench but will need to get the specs. I bought new lug nuts for the Impreza and used the old ones on my '98 Forester. I once bought cheap lug nuts that began to rust 1 year later! The jack points are ridges so I'm wondering if I need an adapter for the floor jack or if a piece of notched wood would work. :skid:

You can just apply the round head of the jack to the ridge of the jackpoint on your car.  Should be fine.  I've done it lots without any problems.

Offline HeliDriver

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 10806
  • Carma: +175/-235
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2023 Crosstrek Sport 6MT; 2011 Yukon XL 2500
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #34 on: March 24, 2017, 01:15:50 pm »
Don't know about other cars, but my VW has the jacking points right on a substantial pinch weld. If you just use the jack without a notched adapter, you will bend the pinch weld. Don't ask me how I know.  >:(

Also, No-san will definitely not be needing a tire iron. Not unless he's planning on mounting tires on rims, anyway.  ;)

Offline tpl

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 23908
  • Carma: +298/-675
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2022 Taos
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2017, 01:28:40 pm »
Don't know about other cars, but my VW has the jacking points right on a substantial pinch weld. If you just use the jack without a notched adapter, you will bend the pinch weld. Don't ask me how I know.  >:(

Also, No-san will definitely not be needing a tire iron. Not unless he's planning on mounting tires on rims, anyway.  ;)

A hockey puck with a groove cut into it is ideal to protect a pinched weld like that.


In this context 'tire iron' is one of those multi sockets wrenches.   

The most radical revolutionary will become a conservative the day after the revolution.

Offline HeliDriver

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 10806
  • Carma: +175/-235
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2023 Crosstrek Sport 6MT; 2011 Yukon XL 2500
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #36 on: March 24, 2017, 01:34:33 pm »
Don't know about other cars, but my VW has the jacking points right on a substantial pinch weld. If you just use the jack without a notched adapter, you will bend the pinch weld. Don't ask me how I know.  >:(

Also, No-san will definitely not be needing a tire iron. Not unless he's planning on mounting tires on rims, anyway.  ;)

A hockey puck with a groove cut into it is ideal to protect a pinched weld like that.


In this context 'tire iron' is one of those multi sockets wrenches wrong.

Fixed.  :)

Offline tpl

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 23908
  • Carma: +298/-675
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2022 Taos
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #37 on: March 24, 2017, 01:41:08 pm »
No-san.   I used to do both cars, on my driveway in about 40 minutes with sockets, extension ( that bodywork thing) and a trolley jack.     

Now I am older and stiffer I just have Ted's in Guelph do all that and store the offseason tires.
Ted's guys inspect the tires for uneven wear, sidewall damage etc. and put them on the balancer if they see a weight missing. And, being a regular customer ( I buy tires there as well) if I get a tire pressure warning light I get seen to right away even when they are busy.

This takes longer than the driveway thing as I have to make 4 trips on the Hanlon to do it and costs money, I have written off the cost of my tools a decade ago.


I mentioned in my previous post ' antiseize ' compound. You mentioned grease.  Although AS compound has a grease base it is NOT grease it is a compound where grease is just a carrier for finely divided metal fragments  to prevent surfaces from corroding into each other especially in winter when the salt water forms quite a good electrolyte.  You use it on the wheel to hub join NOT on the bolts or studd.   Comes in small cans or tubes from CT.  A small can will last years and if one of these wheels gets stuck before using that and you spend some time hammering and kicking to get it of the hub...you'll thank me the next time after you have used the stuff.

Offline aquadorhj

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 7605
  • Carma: +271/-265
    • View Profile
  • Cars: MB SLK 55, Lexus NX, E46 M3, Honda Fit, VW Jetta, VW Rabbit, Saturn SC, Nissan NX,
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #38 on: March 24, 2017, 03:21:14 pm »
anti seize is this stuff :


they sell this at Crappy tire.  never goes on sale, just buy it.  get the smallest can they sell.   don't get one in a tube, you will run out in 2 wheel switch overs.

this is for the wheel HUB.  not the lug nuts.

Driving thrills makes my wallet lighter.. and therefore makes me faster because i'm shedding weight... :D

Offline Gurgie

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 14254
  • Carma: +308/-516
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2019 Honda Passport Touring, 2006 SLK 55 AMG
Re: DIY seasonal wheel changeover
« Reply #39 on: March 24, 2017, 03:52:49 pm »
 :banghead:  :banghead:

Bring your car over to my place, I'll get my 13yr old to show you what tools you need & then he'll teach you how to change the tires  :stick:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :run:
You live everyday. You only die once....