Author Topic: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt  (Read 23945 times)

Offline EV-Light

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Re: Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #20 on: August 14, 2014, 11:24:58 am »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there the Prius Plug in that would compete with the Volt fairly well?  That's the one I think I would have.  But if I wanted performance and space I might go for the Honda Accourd Hybrid plug in thingy.  That seemed like a pretty decent electric car.
The Prius plug-in doesn't have close to the electric range as the Volt or i3.
Actually, the bigger issue is that the Prius's gasoline engine continues to power the driven wheels, whereas in the i3 and the Volt, it's electric-only propulsion, even when the range extender is active.

...that's why these two are the only real 'true' competitors, though to the casual consumer, yes, a plug-in hybrid is a plug-in hybrid and the C-Max and Prius come into play.


The Volt does drive the wheels...so it could be very well considered a plug-in hybrid.
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2010/10/gm-admits-chevy-volts-gasoline-engine-can-power-the-wheels-so-is-it-still-special.html

Offline Noto

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #21 on: August 14, 2014, 12:18:50 pm »
This is a car for urban folks who have short to medium daily trips and may go around 100km to the cottage on weekends...  or something like that.
I think the idea is to get rid of range anxiety - the extra 7L tank is a safety net to ensure that if you're driving around the city, you can always get to a gas station, even if you're pushing the e-charge to near-zero.  It's sort of akin to the orange light (holy f*ck I'm almost out of gas, dude!) given the varying range of any given state of charge (i.e. 10% of battery charge remaining will get you anywhere from 5-10km, or something).

...calling it a "range extender" is kind of dubious - it's really a safety net and not meant to take the i3 out of town.

Offline Noto

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Re: Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #22 on: August 14, 2014, 12:23:53 pm »
The Volt does drive the wheels...so it could be very well considered a plug-in hybrid.
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2010/10/gm-admits-chevy-volts-gasoline-engine-can-power-the-wheels-so-is-it-still-special.html
well, then, I'm a little pissed about being misled, but I agree with the conclusion (from the article):
"A pure electric vehicle it might not be in the strictest sense of the word, but a technological innovation it most certainly still is."

I still like it, even if they lied to me a bit. 

Offline Great_Big_Abyss

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #23 on: August 14, 2014, 12:24:43 pm »

har!

The Volt does seem to be the North American hybrid, able to get a fellow from Winnipeg to Regina and then Regina to Calgary. Might need to stop once for fuel on the 'peg to Regina run, but then most cars do, picking up fuel in Brandon.

We're doing a road trip in November from Winnipeg to Calgary in the Altima.  I think I have a 800km range on the highway in that car (massive 75L tank, but haven't emptied the whole thing in one shot on the highway yet), so my plan would be to stop once on the way there for gas, likely somewhere in the middle of Saskatchewan.

Unfortunately, we'll be convoying with my BIL and his family, and he'll be driving his older Pathfinder which is a greedy bugger indeed.  Therefore, I think we'll be stopping a LOT more than we would were we on our own.

Offline Silverbird

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #24 on: August 14, 2014, 12:25:23 pm »
Re the small 7L gas tank on the i3.  Blame that one on the EPA.  The European version has a 9L tank.  The first batch that landed at the port had to be retrofitted. (not that 2L is going to make a huge difference

This was changed for the NA versions so that the "extended" range added by the generator would be less than the Battery only range, allowing it to still be classed as a BEV.

You'll notice the Electric range is 130km, the extender adds 110 to get to a total range of 240km.  I guess they slightly underestimated the EPA electric range and had to tweak the tank size.

I think they are marketing it for people that once an a while need to get into 150-200km long trips.  $4k is a bit steep for just a safety net.


Offline Fobroader

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2014, 12:25:47 pm »
The Volt is actually a decent looking car.....that BMW...man, talk about a face only a mother could love. The Volt I could actually see at some point end up in my garage.....as a 4th or 5th car. As Noto said, 155/70 19.....yeah, the tire guy would be very excited as he bent you over....or even worse, told you it would be a week to get certain tire from the states up to Buffalo Narrows where you had a flat tire.

That's moot point as you would never make to Buffalo Narrows in the first place with your tiny 100kms of range.

har!

The Volt does seem to be the North American hybrid, able to get a fellow from Winnipeg to Regina and then Regina to Calgary. Might need to stop once for fuel on the 'peg to Regina run, but then most cars do, picking up fuel in Brandon.

Thats the thing, I could never own a vehicle that has to be plugged in for a few hours to go maybe 100km.....thats just useless in the prairies......

Imagine being stuck in Saskatoon with a vehicle that can only go 100KM before needing fuel. You would only be able to travel during the day time outside the city, because at night the only gas stations open are in the city, small towns, not a chance.

Might as well buy a Horse instead, same range.

 :laugh: :laugh:

Lighten up Francis.....

Offline EV-Light

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2014, 12:26:47 pm »
The Volt is actually a decent looking car.....that BMW...man, talk about a face only a mother could love. The Volt I could actually see at some point end up in my garage.....as a 4th or 5th car. As Noto said, 155/70 19.....yeah, the tire guy would be very excited as he bent you over....or even worse, told you it would be a week to get certain tire from the states up to Buffalo Narrows where you had a flat tire.

That's moot point as you would never make to Buffalo Narrows in the first place with your tiny 100kms of range.

har!

The Volt does seem to be the North American hybrid, able to get a fellow from Winnipeg to Regina and then Regina to Calgary. Might need to stop once for fuel on the 'peg to Regina run, but then most cars do, picking up fuel in Brandon.

Thats the thing, I could never own a vehicle that has to be plugged in for a few hours to go maybe 100km.....thats just useless in the prairies......

Imagine being stuck in Saskatoon with a vehicle that can only go 100KM before needing fuel. You would only be able to travel during the day time outside the city, because at night the only gas stations open are in the city, small towns, not a chance.

Might as well buy a Horse instead, same range.

Haha...the point of the i3 is to be used in a more urban environment. If I had an electric car, I'd literally never use gas...and I mostly drive in the city so the fact that BMW will let me rent a 3-series for longer trips is perfect.
I do have winter concerns about the BMW - being RWD and I am sure it'd be impossible to find winter tires for it.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2014, 12:28:31 pm by Tauri13 »

Offline jpd

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2014, 12:43:05 pm »
Nice paper! Those green cars are quite expensive though!  I use my electric drive Smart as a city car only!  And Micheal, that would be nice if you could after having recently tested the Nissan Leaf, BMW i3 and the Volt make a test drive of the 2014 Smart electric drive! Many thanks in advance!

Offline Silverbird

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2014, 12:47:24 pm »

Haha...the point of the i3 is to be used in a more urban environment. If I had an electric car, I'd literally never use gas...and I mostly drive in the city so the fact that BMW will let me rent a 3-series for longer trips is perfect.
I do have winter concerns about the BMW - being RWD and I am sure it'd be impossible to find winter tires for it.

Good luck with any tires for the i3.  Tirerack has 1 choice, hope you like Bridgestone Ecopia.

Nice sporty staggered setup too: 155/70R19 Front & 175/60R19 rear. :rofl2:
or perhaps an upsize to 155/60R20 F 175/55R20 R.  Also only 1 choice of tire

Offline Fobroader

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2014, 12:49:59 pm »

Haha...the point of the i3 is to be used in a more urban environment. If I had an electric car, I'd literally never use gas...and I mostly drive in the city so the fact that BMW will let me rent a 3-series for longer trips is perfect.
I do have winter concerns about the BMW - being RWD and I am sure it'd be impossible to find winter tires for it.

Good luck with any tires for the i3.  Tirerack has 1 choice, hope you like Bridgestone Ecopia.

Nice sporty staggered setup too: 155/70R19 Front & 175/60R19 rear. :rofl2:
or perhaps an upsize to 155/60R20 F 175/55R20 R.  Also only 1 choice of tire

That right there would be a huge turnoff toward any car.

Offline whaddaiknow

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2014, 01:03:30 pm »

Imagine being stuck in Saskatoon with a vehicle that can only go 100KM before needing fuel. You would only be able to travel during the day time outside the city, because at night the only gas stations open are in the city, small towns, not a chance.

Might as well buy a Horse instead, same range.

FFS, quit slamming the car for what it doesn't claim to be. It is a city dweller, not a Prairie explorer.
Same as criticizing development companies for building 600sq.ft condos without a backyard downtown Toronto because there is plenty of empty land is Sask.

Offline nlm

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2014, 01:11:35 pm »
The Volt vs i3 comes up often in my circle, with the Volt being the preferred vehicle.

One of the big reasons is the limited range of the i3 despite the 7L reserve tank and the limited sign ups for a real car. While most will make do just fine with 7L and 10 uses for a real car when needed, much like off-road capability, power, and awd there are a lot of drivers that tend to want something just-in-case-they-need it.

There's also the conveinence thing. It's not like whenever you stop and get out of the car you're going to get all your 130km range back. Even if you find a L3 charger you need 30min to get 80%. Who has 30min to wait for this thing to charge? So it has a 7L gas motor but if its only good for 100km you may find you'll be filling it up more often than you think. It kind of raises a spectre of an issue; even though you'll be fine 90% of the time as a commuter you can't help wonder if it will be annoying to get juice the remaining 10% of the time in the city. Whether its unfounded or not...that's why its a spectre of an issue and it can be unattractive to some people. See above for existing 'just-in-case-they-need-it' mentality.

Also clamshell doors = super annoying ingress/egress in a parking lot.


Offline Noto

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2014, 01:26:42 pm »
FFS, quit slamming the car for what it doesn't claim to be.
But that's just it - we're not slamming the i3 BEV, we're slamming the i3 REx.  It's not a "range extender" in the true-sense, it's (and I maintain) a safety net - solely there to ensure you have a wee little reserve to putter on home in case you overestimated your range needs.  No way it was designed to extend the range to the point of distance driving - but just to calm people's "holy f*ck I'm not going to make it" anxiety.

$4k?  Sure as d!ck that's steep - but it's worth it if you don't trust the range of a BEV.  That's why the Volt/extended i3 make some sense - they tackle the genuine concern of range anxiety...albeit the i3 doesn't really tackle it well enough for North Americans.  In Europe, probably.

Offline EV-Light

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2014, 02:53:54 pm »

Haha...the point of the i3 is to be used in a more urban environment. If I had an electric car, I'd literally never use gas...and I mostly drive in the city so the fact that BMW will let me rent a 3-series for longer trips is perfect.
I do have winter concerns about the BMW - being RWD and I am sure it'd be impossible to find winter tires for it.

Good luck with any tires for the i3.  Tirerack has 1 choice, hope you like Bridgestone Ecopia.

Nice sporty staggered setup too: 155/70R19 Front & 175/60R19 rear. :rofl2:
or perhaps an upsize to 155/60R20 F 175/55R20 R.  Also only 1 choice of tire

Yeah they only offer OEM all season...can you imagine OEM+RWD+Winter? LOL

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2014, 03:07:24 pm »
I can't warm up to the i3's styling.

We looked at the Volt, and I had the whole family in it as well as my daughter's wheelchair. It seemed roomy enough for our needs. The lack of AWD and ground clearance knocked it off our radar at the time. The Volt's due for replacement, so I'd hold off to see what the new one brings.
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Offline me_2

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2014, 08:30:05 pm »
This is a car for urban folks who have short to medium daily trips and may go around 100km to the cottage on weekends...  or something like that.
I think the idea is to get rid of range anxiety - the extra 7L tank is a safety net to ensure that if you're driving around the city, you can always get to a gas station, even if you're pushing the e-charge to near-zero.  It's sort of akin to the orange light (holy f*ck I'm almost out of gas, dude!) given the varying range of any given state of charge (i.e. 10% of battery charge remaining will get you anywhere from 5-10km, or something).

...calling it a "range extender" is kind of dubious - it's really a safety net and not meant to take the i3 out of town.

I agree about the safety net, more commonly known as "Plan B" in case you overestimate your electric range, I see that being a good concept ... and the best part of, it is an option: You want one, put a checkmark on you list, you don't, leave it blank. Thanks.

ps: I like the style and the "lightweight carbon-fibre reinforced plastic (CFRP) body panels", I'm still a Saturn owner after all but not sure about the coach doors..  :shuffle:
« Last Edit: August 14, 2014, 08:50:59 pm by me_2 »
Gone but not forgotten in chronological order: 2019 Volt, 2013 Volt, 2014 Spark EV, 2012 Volt and many others before...

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2014, 10:58:42 pm »
I find it interesting that companies throw out the corporate design program for EV and some hybrid cars. I hope this leads to some nifty new design era. I think we're still in transition with EV design (sheet metal that is).

Offline blotter

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2014, 05:46:29 pm »
I find it interesting that companies throw out the corporate design program for EV and some hybrid cars. I hope this leads to some nifty new design era. I think we're still in transition with EV design (sheet metal that is).

my guess is since the EV cars are still rare, it's partly to make a design statement.


Offline Rupert

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2014, 01:34:48 pm »
   Whenever you get into your car and drive somewhere; you always have to think about how much gas there is in the tank. The thing is, that aspect is all people want to think about other than plugging in and un-plugging from your high performance charger plug. So, until gas operation alone will give adequate range and performance, (whatever that is) these things are too much of a nuisance. Local use only...remember which car you are in. Yet for some with minor usage a boon no doubt. Not many I think and the lesser hybrids might also be better for the same few, even though minor battery range is present.
   I think that the Volt is closer to being volume viable here but a higher body closer to the BMW style might be more appropriate. Forget the Gull Wing doors and AWD is not indicated for an ecco electric vehicle I think. From what I read here, even the volt is not a preferred vehicle for the highway.
   I am thinking that the electric charge should be a bonus and not the be-all of the system. Other than plugging in perhaps, you don't want to have to think about it...you get whatever is in the battery. Mostly a lot but sometimes a little.  Whatever, the car still has to be viable sans charge.
   Getting electric charge out of the windmills and into the car batteries overnight is the thing to aim for and only volume usage will be enough. Which means affordably priced equipment.
   
« Last Edit: August 19, 2014, 08:47:02 am by Rupert »

Offline Ex-airbalancer

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Re: Quick comparison: 2014 BMW i3 vs Chevrolet Volt
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2014, 05:35:09 pm »
The question is why wouldn't tesla put a generator in their cars
That would make it interesting car