Topic: Quick Spin: 2012 Dodge Grand Caravan R/T

[PJ]

Is it possible in the reviews of all vehicles to include where applicable the length, width, height, the cargo volume, the passenger volume and fuel economy etc. in Imperaial measurements in addition to the Metric figures?

Nope, time to force you into the present.

Tell that to the Americans.

[bombastic]

810 - Second annoyance - no adjustment on rear seat back angle (which is critical for those couple of centimetres to close the liftgate with the aforementioned suitcases (or anything else). Third annoyance - having to flip out the headrest EVERY time after tumbling the 2nd row seat forward for access to 3rd row (there was 7 of us).

Your lack of knowledge does not speak about the car more that your lacks. What you are saying is simply not true. No adjustment on rear seat back angle? My kids are using it all the time when we travel. Tumble the 2nd row seat forward? Why would you do that. The seats in the second row can be moved back and forward without the need to tumble them.
Stow & GO really works. And is quite well designed

[810]

My lack of knowledge! It's a frigging rear seat, it is supposed to be intuitive! Why does my sienna have 2 (count them!) belts to pull - one to fold the back, the other to drop the seat in the cavern, and YOUR GC has FOUR!. It's a friggin algorithm there, and if you do not follow it, the seat does not fold, and you start over..... I should not need to read a manual to fold a seat. Heck, I DIDN'T for the sienna, nor for a sedona I had as a rental last year.....

As for tumble - perhaps you are right, except to get an adult into the 3rd row, moving the seat does not seem to be enough. We needed to tumble them. And just because we did, this still does not explain why the headrest chooses to fold every time.

As for stow and go, it is a compromise. Yes, you do not have to take the seats out, but the seats are quite thinly padded, and the butt angle is wrong. Also, you cannot put proper carpeting in there (e.g. Weathertech) with all the foldy carpeting bits. Yes, the folding mechanism is quite well designed, but I am not sure how long it will be before it seizes due to all the sand / salt / muck that invariably gets in there.

And I notice there is no contra-argument to the fact that it is still narrow in the rear.

What I stated was were _observations_, based on my own experience of putting one of these through its paces on hwy, sand, in pouring rain and with 7 people on board for 2 weeks.

[bombastic]

810 -
It's a frigging rear seat, it is supposed to be intuitive! Why does my sienna have 2 (count them!) belts to pull - one to fold the back, the other to drop the seat in the cavern, and YOUR GC has FOUR!.
- Well in fact it has 3 buttons, the fort one is just the strap to pull the seat into the cavern. What is more than Siena is the strap to fold down the headrest. Not too difficult to learn, eh?
Here is the video to show how easy it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spCuatXKe7A&feature=related

And just because we did, this still does not explain why the headrest chooses to fold every time.
- So it chooses to fold because of stow and go. So you don't kill your headrest because you forgot to fold it. Not quite the same for Siena since it does not have this at all. You have to remove the chairs.

 And I notice there is no contra-argument to the fact that it is still narrow in the rear.
-  were you expecting a contra-argument? My intention was to point to the obvious missinterpretation from your post. What is right, is right. No point on debating that.

For me as you said for GC you get what you paid for. For Siena you get less than you paid for 

[tooscoops]

minvan fight!!!!

whatever. i think the features on the gc are great... but if you aren't used to them  (and therfore used to something else) you are bound to find that the GC is "wrong"...

the stow n go is definitely a compromise. you give up seat comfort and possibly durability for it, but for people who take those seats out a few times a year even, its worth it. and if folding a headrest up is that big of a deal, i guess we are just different people. the added second of flipping the headrest up is a fine trade considering how much extra space flipping the seat gives you to get to the back. plus, its a one handed operation to flip it... judging by the "confusion" of the folding rear seat, the simple tumble 2nd row must be nice.

i find people want to bash all vans for something. overall, they are practical. space for gear, space for stuff, nice ride height, decent gas consumption, decent power, not totally hideous, inexpensive to purchase...

in ANY segment, you are bound to find more compromises from the initial idea with any chosen model.

i say kudos.

[810]

"whatever. i think the features on the gc are great... but if you aren't used to them  (and therfore used to something else) you are bound to find that the GC is "wrong"..."

Agree. Which is why I did not point the single control stalk on the GC (as opposed to 2 in most anything Japanese), and the unusual shifter position. Not wrong, just different. Ditto for doubleclick to open power sliding doors.

I liked the sliding plastic curtain covers on the console.

To each his / her own.

To: bombastic
As for "For Siena you get less than you paid for"  - not necessarily, if you negotiate well  . n Also, for us, we had to have an 8-seater. Unless I am mistaken, you cannot get a GC in that anyway...

[Spec5]

You both suck - we bought an Odyssey! I actually would have gone for either the Sienna or the Odyssey but there's just so many little things that they thought of with the Odyssey - like hinges that aren't IN the bottom of the floor where all the dirt/sand accumulate. More soft touch surfaces on the Ody as well. But in the end my wife preferred the look of the Ody vs. anything else. My only gripe with the Ody is the banging into gear it seems to do somtimes from park. Seems to be common if not "normal". The odd time as well you can "catch" the tranny trying to either upshift or downshift suddenly in slower corners - nothing upsetting just weird.... Just odd to see that from a company so well known for NOT having to deal with those kinds of complaints.

GC does have amazing features though for the money. As for VALUE? I know more people that have had serious issues with Caravans than with any other vehicle. And thats all I'm gonna say about that. Of course I paid just under $40k for my Oddy out the door when we could have had a GC with MORE features for at least a few grand less.

Who in their right mind thinks a Caravan is more attractive than either a Sienna or an Oddy?! I guess even ugly minivans need love! 

[PJ]

Who in their right mind thinks a Caravan is more attractive than either a Sienna or an Oddy?! I guess even ugly minivans need love! 

So you actually like that bizzare zig in the belt line?  Really?  No accounting for taste I guess but as long as you're happy.

[Oldsguy]

You both suck - we bought an Odyssey!
 <snip>

Of course I paid just under $40k for my Oddy out the door when we could have had a GC with MORE features for at least a few grand less.

Anyone who buys an Ody automatically pays way too much.

[Rupert]

I think that the proof of the pudding is in the eating anyway. I have not measured it but think that the width of the inside of the Caravan is designed to at least take a 4’x 8’ sheet of plywood or drywall. No metrics there. Come to think of it I believe that I saw drywall being loaded in one at Home Depot. Middle seats…yes a trade off for utility against padding. Having ridden in a middle seat for a fair distance one time I would say the comfort level was acceptable. Come to think of it we only have one middle seat up, the vast majority of the time and the rear seat has never been used. This gives us a large bin, where the middle seat folds into, to store incidentals out of sight…air pump, a few tools, trailer hitch bar and such. Love it. For us the trailer package was a requirement and at the time none of the other vans offered this at all at any price that we could find and the prices were not competitive. This includes far more than a receiver on the back. In fact it does not include that at all. In the package are great Nivomat rear strut/dampers, and heavy duty rad and transmission cooling at a very reasonable price. Albeit that a higher level model with 3.8 engine had to be chosen. None of this makes the Caravan ride like a truck. In fact the Nivomats provide a superior ride even when lightly loaded.
Durability…well…the tow package has taken us on road journeys totaling 30,000 km now with the trailer hitched. I suspect that this is more than the general tow mileage for most people. We wondered about the durability of this package for such continuous duty, but so far so good. We do not push the tow capacity though and stay well within the other requirements…GCWR and hitch loads etc. We also treat our equipment with respect.
I don’t know, the current shape has been around for four or five years now and I still think it looks better than the latest competition. Then again it’s all personal choice. I prefer it’s elegant design and hope they don’t change this aspect too much. I like the position of the gear lever and although I have found no use whatsoever for the auto-stick
facility on previous vehicles, we did use it in hilly terrain with the trailer. You can anticipate the need to downshift to hold the revs up. The shift lever is close enough to the steering wheel, to be able to be operated with the fingers without taking your hand from the wheel. Only a sideways lever movement is needed.. Other than that the lever stays in 5 when towing and D when not. I believe that the latest model has improved seat folding but the early units were ok. The rear seats are ok to do…you have to read the instructions.
The trick with the middle ones is to make sure the headrest is down and the front seats are right forward. No probs then…ah well.

[Spec5]

You both suck - we bought an Odyssey!
 <snip>

Of course I paid just under $40k for my Oddy out the door when we could have had a GC with MORE features for at least a few grand less.

Anyone who buys an Ody automatically pays way too much.

You're probably right - but then again you could probably say the same thing for any Honda - hell any MB, BMW or Lexus for that matter. My standard response to the minivan heckling I get is "Hey, if MB or Lexus built a minivan - this would be it!". Surprisingly though everyone seems to love it - most seem to find it the most attractive van out there and nobody argues with the versatility. We'll see how I feel about it in 4 years.

Oh and as for the lightening bolt - I don't even notice it anymore to be honest. Its supposedly there to allow more light in to the cabin which is excuse enough for me to "accept" it. Another nice feature though is EVERYTHING lights up in it. I mean every single switch that has a function is illuminated which is really nice - looking for PDL or windows. Didn't really notice that because its light till like 9:30pm it being summer and all. But how many haters out there have their power mirror selector (drivers/passenger) light up at night?! Its a little thing but like I've been saying there's just so many little things.

[whaddaiknow]

You both suck - we bought an Odyssey!
 <snip>

Of course I paid just under $40k for my Oddy out the door when we could have had a GC with MORE features for at least a few grand less.

Anyone who buys an Ody automatically pays way too much.

You're probably right - but then again you could probably say the same thing for any Honda - hell any MB, BMW or Lexus for that matter. My standard response to the minivan heckling I get is "Hey, if MB or Lexus built a minivan - this would be it!". Surprisingly though everyone seems to love it - most seem to find it the most attractive van out there and nobody argues with the versatility. We'll see how I feel about it in 4 years.

Oh and as for the lightening bolt - I don't even notice it anymore to be honest. Its supposedly there to allow more light in to the cabin which is excuse enough for me to "accept" it. Another nice feature though is EVERYTHING lights up in it. I mean every single switch that has a function is illuminated which is really nice - looking for PDL or windows. Didn't really notice that because its light till like 9:30pm it being summer and all. But how many haters out there have their power mirror selector (drivers/passenger) light up at night?! Its a little thing but like I've been saying there's just so many little things.

Wholeheartedly agree with all of the above.
We too picked the Ody as it was the most family friendly of the bunch. Sure, some may prefer being able to tow and never use the third row but then a cargo van would probably be a better choice.
Just a couple of weeks ago I picked up a couple of 3/4" sheets of plywood from Home Depot. 4x8'? No problem! Fits right in. You have to keep the outside edge up until the sheet is fully in before lowering it, though, since the opening is a hair narrower at the bottom.
For me, the second row has 3 car seats, so Stow'n Go option is useless. Sure the Ody is not perfect but it's darn near luxury, and I don't regret paying for it. 5 years down the road, it will command a MUCH better resale compared to the GC, though, and that's a given.

[810]

Spec5:
"More soft touch surfaces on the Ody as well."

We have the 09 Sienna, which has all soft surfaces, not the 10+, which is a rubbermaid queen 

Tastes do vary. I liked the 09 Sienna more than the 09 Ody at the time, plus the real 8th seat sealed it for us. We use the 2nd row for the 3 kids, and the 3rd row only comes up once a year for 3 weeks, when the in-laws visit.

I am not too big on either sienna or ody today, but I did like them both in 09.... 

[Vanstar]

[/quote]

Anyone who buys an Ody automatically pays way too much.
[/quote]

There are obviously many people who disagree with you.

[Rupert]

Resale values are relative. If you don't pay the money up front a lower resale value is a wash. Soft touch...who cares.