Topic: Buying a 10-12 year old car in Montreal - need advice!

[stasveselyi]

Hello forum members!

First of, I want to thank everyone who contributes to the forum. I have already gotten so much help from all of you! Really appreciate all the time you put into it.

I am not an experienced car owner/driver, got my license in November 2022. Slightly before that, got a 2022 Rav4 (my wife was driving it for the first several months). Had an accident this past December, the car was deemed a total loss by my insurance company. Going with the used option this time around, and leaning more towards a car than truck/SUV.

My budget is up to $15k. I am planning to keep the car for 2-3 years, accumulate some money, then sell it and either get something newer (and keep it longer), or have enough for down payment on a new so that the monthly payments are not too high. So trying to choose a 8-12 year old car that will not depreciate too much while I am keeping it, and not become a money drain.
The car will be shared by wife and me. We drive around 18-20k per year, 2/3 highway, 1/3 city. The driving experience is not really a factor, I feel like anything would be more exciting or as boring as Rav4, which we lived with just fine. Realiability is a big factor for me, as I do not know much about cars and can't really do anything on it myself. I do have a realiable mechanic that's been recommended to me.

As of now, these are the options I found (can't post links yet, so please ask if any necessary info is missing).
1. 2012 Honda Civic, 140k on the odo, $11500
The car is sold by the second owner, she's kept it in immaculate condition inside and out, has all the service records, car drives great. Reason for selling - she's buying a 2021 Civic.
2. 2015 Lexus ES350, 230k on the odo, $15000
Also second owner, also has all the service records, pretty good condition as far as I can tell (very little superficial rust on the underbody), drives great. Reason for selling - owner can't keep 3 cars, he has a Rav4 as well and that one's more practical for him.

I am taking the Civic for inspection on Thursday, will also try to get Lexus inspected the following week.

Tomorrow I am also looking at:
2015 Civic with 70k on the odo, asking price $14000
2013 Accord with 147k on it, for $12300
Can't say anything about the rust on those yet, or how they drive, but the pictures look pretty good.

Out of these four options, what do you guys think would be best for reliability and depreciation in 2-3 years? Provided of course nothing pops up at the inspections.
I really like the Lexus. However, I am worried about possible service costs. If it starts breaking down, I will not be able to just throw money at it and fix things. The only reason I am considering it is because it's supposed to be very reliable, based on the information I could find.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

[ktm525]

Lexus

[rrocket]

Lexus.

Or try finding a Toyota Avalon

[JohnnyMac]

I'm going to go a different way.  That 2015 Honda Civic with lower kms, it's the last year of that generation so all the bugs should be worked out or at the very least weak points will be known.  It's fuel efficient, reliable, due to the lower kms and your projection for usage and years, it should still be worth a very good amount at the end and will be easier to sell then a used Lexus with high mileage.  I know the Lexus guys won't agree, but the general public have a mental block where once a car crests the 200,000+km mark they automatically cross it off the list and thus that impacts the price, and that's why the Lexus you are looking at is so reasonably priced.

[stasveselyi]

I'm going to go a different way.  That 2015 Honda Civic with lower kms, it's the last year of that generation so all the bugs should be worked out or at the very least weak points will be known.  It's fuel efficient, reliable, due to the lower kms and your projection for usage and years, it should still be worth a very good amount at the end and will be easier to sell then a used Lexus with high mileage.  I know the Lexus guys won't agree, but the general public have a mental block where once a car crests the 200,000+km mark they automatically cross it off the list and thus that impacts the price, and that's why the Lexus you are looking at is so reasonably priced.

I know exactly what you mean about the 200k+ mark, I feel that mental block even as I'm typing this message 
Thanks, I have to look at that 2015 Civic still, but appears to be in good shape. The owner appears to be a host in a Tunisian Youtube auto channel, maybe that's why the mileage is so low (coz he gets to drive all the cars being reviewed, kinda like Ryan from Driving Sports TV).

[stasveselyi]

Lexus

Short and sweet) Thanks!

[stasveselyi]

Lexus.

Or try finding a Toyota Avalon

Yeah, looking for Avalons as well, but nothing in my price range so far. Thanks!

[PJungnitsch]

2015 Civic with 70k on the odo, asking price $14000

For me this would seem to be the obvious winner on the face of it, condition etc being equal. Cheap to run and fix, and still would have reasonable mileage when you go to sell in a couple years

Our neighbor has an older ES350 and loves the thing, the drivetrain is all Toyota and should be bulletproof and easy/cheap to fix, but if that controller screen system goes out that's a $3000 to $5000 hit. I guess the only thing is bigger generally=safer if prone to accidents

[stasveselyi]

2015 Civic with 70k on the odo, asking price $14000

For me this would seem to be the obvious winner on the face of it, condition etc being equal. Cheap to run and fix, and still would have reasonable mileage when you go to sell in a couple years

Our neighbor has an older ES350 and loves the thing, the drivetrain is all Toyota and should be bulletproof and easy/cheap to fix, but if that controller screen system goes out that's a $3000 to $5000 hit. I guess the only thing is bigger generally=safer if prone to accidents

That's what worries me about Lexus. Rationally, I understand that 230k is fine for this drivetrain. But potential screen/electrical issues are not likely to be identified in an inspection, and for me $3-5k is a considerable amount of money.
Thanks for the advice! Still have time to think and look around. Will be sure to let everyone know how the 2015 Civic looks in person)

[ktm525]

Rolling in a Civic vs a Lexus.  Whatever floats your boat.

[quadzilla]

Living in Montreal I'd' pick the one you won't mind getting your bumpers rubbed by other cars.

[PJungnitsch]

But potential screen/electrical issues are not likely to be identified in an inspection, and for me $3-5k is a considerable amount of money.

Yeah, and they can fail out of the blue. Our 2017 RX head unit (which controls the climate) cost us $3000, and that was a rebuilt part. They mentioned they'd just replaced the screen on an older RX for $5000

Ironic as the mouse based infotainment system is the worst part of otherwise great vehicles, but you really can't do without it

Just to put it in perspective I sold my old Pontiac Vibe to a couple from Ukraine for $3000 last year (similar to you, he just wanted something to get him around for a couple years until he gets more established) and he's been driving that all over the place

[rrocket]

Just to put it in perspective I sold my old Pontiac Vibe

There was a "stop driving" order on these a couple weeks ago or so.

[PJungnitsch]

Just to put it in perspective I sold my old Pontiac Vibe

There was a "stop driving" order on these a couple weeks ago or so.

Just a few of them, most were done already. Mine was done already twice (for some reason)

[rrocket]

Just to put it in perspective I sold my old Pontiac Vibe

There was a "stop driving" order on these a couple weeks ago or so.

Just a few of them, most were done already. Mine was done already twice (for some reason)

....

[Blueprint]

I also vote for the 2015 Civic. Keep the rust at bay and will go on for another 10 years. The Lexus is probably more $$ to insure too, and the rear seatback is fixed, so it's not as flexible when it's your only car. Larger more expensive tires too.

[stasveselyi]

Update.

2015 Civic came from Newfoundland and has some rust, both underbody and driver's door/step. No service records at all, no summer tires, the guy who's selling bought it as a temporary car while waiting for ordered Corolla, had it for 4 months.
2013 Accord - also rust, only the underbody though. Also no service records, the owner claims to having paid cash with a purpose of dodging the taxes and making it cheaper.
Both cars seem to drive well, but no service history does not inspire confidence.

Taking the 2012 Civic to inspection tomorrow morning, and going to look at some more cars this week.

[stasveselyi]

I also vote for the 2015 Civic. Keep the rust at bay and will go on for another 10 years. The Lexus is probably more $$ to insure too, and the rear seatback is fixed, so it's not as flexible when it's your only car. Larger more expensive tires too.

Oh, I didn't know that back seats don't fold on a Lexus, thanks. The insurance would be expensive, yes.

[Blueprint]

Update.

2015 Civic came from Newfoundland and has some rust, both underbody and driver's door/step. No service records at all, no summer tires, the guy who's selling bought it as a temporary car while waiting for ordered Corolla, had it for 4 months.
2013 Accord - also rust, only the underbody though. Also no service records, the owner claims to having paid cash with a purpose of dodging the taxes and making it cheaper.
Both cars seem to drive well, but no service history does not inspire confidence.

Taking the 2012 Civic to inspection tomorrow morning, and going to look at some more cars this week.

Humm... A couple of red flags there.

Since this will be an intermim vehicle, another trick is to look for vehicles that most people here don't really want - namely domestics and anything with a stick, provided you can both drive one. Avoid automatic Fiesta/Focus at all cost, the DCT transmissions were never "right" and they all blow up. Avoid all older Kyundai products with either the 2.0 or 2.4 litre engines, or early CVT/DCT-equipped ones.

A well-maintained Mazda3 is nearly as good as a Civic and plentiful on the market. Sentras are often pretty clean older folks cars, but look for the extended warranty on a CVT.

[stasveselyi]

Update.

2015 Civic came from Newfoundland and has some rust, both underbody and driver's door/step. No service records at all, no summer tires, the guy who's selling bought it as a temporary car while waiting for ordered Corolla, had it for 4 months.
2013 Accord - also rust, only the underbody though. Also no service records, the owner claims to having paid cash with a purpose of dodging the taxes and making it cheaper.
Both cars seem to drive well, but no service history does not inspire confidence.

Taking the 2012 Civic to inspection tomorrow morning, and going to look at some more cars this week.

Humm... A couple of red flags there.

Since this will be an intermim vehicle, another trick is to look for vehicles that most people here don't really want - namely domestics and anything with a stick, provided you can both drive one. Avoid automatic Fiesta/Focus at all cost, the DCT transmissions were never "right" and they all blow up. Avoid all older Kyundai products with either the 2.0 or 2.4 litre engines, or early CVT/DCT-equipped ones.

A well-maintained Mazda3 is nearly as good as a Civic and plentiful on the market. Sentras are often pretty clean older folks cars, but look for the extended warranty on a CVT.

Yeah, I am not going to buy either of those.

Wife can drive the stick, I can't Got my first license less than 2 years ago and only learned the automatic. I would consider a well-maintained Grand Marquis or the like, but wife absolutely hates the look of these cars. The newet domestics don't inspire confidence in terms of realiability, at least from what I read/watched.

Mazda has a reputation of constantly breaking down (and costly for repairs) in Ukraine where I'm from. A couple of my friends back there owned Mazdas, and they've just been in and out of the shop constantly. They seem to be pretty reliable here, but I also don't really like their design. Look- and feel-wise, Honda appeals the most to me.
Nissan and their CVT have a scary reputation, but I'll pay attention to Sentras, thanks.

Just looked back on this thread and realized  I am awfully picky for someone who is not a car guy. Oh well, maybe my lack of knowledge/experience is the reason why.