Author Topic: Serious accident  (Read 1610 times)

Offline rrocket

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2017, 10:34:02 pm »
I mean, Mmret was just asking for general information after all....knowing this is an auto forum and not a legal forum.

This forum is quite a cast of characters who often have deep subject matter expertise on a variety of topics.

Of course I can totally understand why he wants to bring it to PMs and I respect that.

Yes..lotsa good info can be gleaned from this forum.  But it's not always right.....but it's also no wrong for someone who's just trying to help to speak up.

As far as the PM?  Fine.  If that's how he chooses to disseminate his expertise...I'll respect that.

But I don't respect him essentially telling someone to STFU, who tried to answer a question with the best of intentions.  Who does he think he is to be able to say that?  If AS is wrong, fine.  Correct him.

But telling him not to speak?  F-that.
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Offline rrocket

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2017, 10:35:20 pm »
^^^ I would agree with anyone else, but AS wades in with so much hyperbole when it comes to legal matters that it's a face-palm moment.

Which is my point exactly.  You wouldn't base your legal brief on what AS said.   ;D

But AS was also not being malicious to mmret by saying what he said.

There's a big difference IMO.

Offline mmret

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #22 on: November 15, 2017, 10:46:58 pm »
I mean, Mmret was just asking for general information after all....knowing this is an auto forum and not a legal forum.

This forum is quite a cast of characters who often have deep subject matter expertise on a variety of topics.

Of course I can totally understand why he wants to bring it to PMs and I respect that.

Yes..lotsa good info can be gleaned from this forum.  But it's not always right.....but it's also no wrong for someone who's just trying to help to speak up.

As far as the PM?  Fine.  If that's how he chooses to disseminate his expertise...I'll respect that.

But I don't respect him essentially telling someone to STFU, who tried to answer a question with the best of intentions.  Who does he think he is to be able to say that?  If AS is wrong, fine.  Correct him.

But telling him not to speak?  F-that.

Oh I quite agree. I wasn't referring to JGX's post really.

I feel AS in general "knows stuff" so I do quite appreciate his input even if it is not strictly his area of expertise.
You can't just have your characters announce how they feel.
That makes me feel angry!

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Offline No-san

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2017, 11:02:56 am »
And guess what?  Everyone here with half a brain knows the feedback we're getting...in an auto forum...on the internet...isn't the stuff you "take to the bank" without further investigation.
I am particularly cautious about placing legal advice, free or not, in public areas where same can be misunderstood or misconstrued.  Many lawyers have been sued for it.  Even if the claims made against those lawyers are completely groundless, responding to law society complaints is a very labourious and time consuming task and responding to lawsuits would cost a $5,000 professional misconduct deductible whether the suit was proper or not.  I don't think it unreasonable to try and avoid it.

At some point, we might find ourselves in a similar situation and Noah genuinely might have very helpful info
For the majority of you on this forum, I will absolutely help anyone on here where I can, but legal details will be done via PM or telephone/in person so as to ensure that the information provided is tailored to each individual issue.  Where it is beyond my expertise, I will attempt to refer you to someone I know (if I do) and will in most cases not charge/ask for any sort of remuneration (unless Shane asks for something, then I want that unobtainium beer ;) ).

To your point, Ron, about my manner in which I spoke to Steve, you're not wrong.  It was my time of the month and I was perhaps more snippy than usual.  Steve, you have my apologies in that regard - you were trying to be helpful.

2.  She'll need to have a fracture or complete muscle/ligament tear or she get the usual Minor Injury Treatment Protocol.  :P   Not like the old days before no fault.  If she has not "bought" up her coverage she'll get $400 per week for missing work.  :P

Partially correct.  The Minor Injury Guideline is more complex than what is stated above and does very much depend on the individual's prior medical history.  You neglect to discuss the potential for psychological injury as well - and no, one does not have to have "Accident Induced Schizophrenia" (note the cockeyed way in which that is typed...).  There are plenty of diagnosable and temporary conditions for which your accident benefits will provide coverage outside of the Minor Injury Guideline. 

You are also partially correct regarding optional coverage, which I have advocated for profusely on this site previously.


3.  Generally 2 years to file any lawsuit in Ontario.  Up to 6 in certain situations.  There is a $37K deduction on any court award.   

Yes, generally 2 years - but no, not "up to 6 in certain situations."  There are some VERY EXTREME situations where that period can be extended, but assume that that will be the seldom-used exception rather than the rule or even a potential.  Always assume 2, and a lawyer can assist you with attempting to commence an action or application beyond the two year presumptive limitation period if absolutely necessary.  Do not wait until the last minute to commence an action.

Bottom line one needs to be quite seriously injured to gain benefits from a civil court action.

That's also not necessarily true, and would dissuade legitimately injured people from commencing an action.  The deductible you refer to (it changes Jan 1 of each year, indexed with inflation) is for general, non-pecuniary damages only.  Pecuniary damages are not subject to a deductible. 

Whether or not a civil court action is "beneficial" is something that you can only determine with a full appreciation of the specific facts of each individual person's case.


PPL wanted low rates so they got low rates (questionable) but crappy insurance coverage.

That's not specifically correct, but I am declining to engage in that discussion in this thread.  I don't think that Ontario's insurance coverage is crappy at all.

As for "personnel injury" lawyers aka ambulance chasers [snip] ("we don't paid till you do") et al;  their clients are just fodder.

I would not engage in such libel.  There are some very reputable lawyers out there who legitimately care about their clients, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with contingency fee arrangements when properly implemented.  I've experienced far more clients getting overcharged because they pay by the hour than a lump-sum held-back from a settlement.  The law society requires that retainer agreements provide a party to choose either "contingency" or "pay by the hour" options.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 10:29:04 am by No-san »

Offline rrocket

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2017, 05:43:51 pm »


To your point, Ron, about my manner in which I spoke to Steve, you're not wrong.  It was my time of the month and I was perhaps more snippy than usual.  Steve, you have my apologies in that regard - you were trying to be helpful.




Online kevlar

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Re: Serious accident
« Reply #25 on: December 23, 2017, 01:23:19 pm »
And guess what?  Everyone here with half a brain knows the feedback we're getting...in an auto forum...on the internet...isn't the stuff you "take to the bank" without further investigation.
I am particularly cautious about placing legal advice, free or not, in public areas where same can be misunderstood or misconstrued.  Many lawyers have been sued for it.  Even if the claims made against those lawyers are completely groundless, responding to law society complaints is a very labourious and time consuming task and responding to lawsuits would cost a $5,000 professional misconduct deductible whether the suit was proper or not.  I don't think it unreasonable to try and avoid it.

At some point, we might find ourselves in a similar situation and Noah genuinely might have very helpful info
For the majority of you on this forum, I will absolutely help anyone on here where I can, but legal details will be done via PM or telephone/in person so as to ensure that the information provided is tailored to each individual issue.  Where it is beyond my expertise, I will attempt to refer you to someone I know (if I do) and will in most cases not charge/ask for any sort of remuneration (unless Shane asks for something, then I want that unobtainium beer ;) ).

To your point, Ron, about my manner in which I spoke to Steve, you're not wrong.  It was my time of the month and I was perhaps more snippy than usual.  Steve, you have my apologies in that regard - you were trying to be helpful.

2.  She'll need to have a fracture or complete muscle/ligament tear or she get the usual Minor Injury Treatment Protocol.  :P   Not like the old days before no fault.  If she has not "bought" up her coverage she'll get $400 per week for missing work.  :P

Partially correct.  The Minor Injury Guideline is more complex than what is stated above and does very much depend on the individual's prior medical history.  You neglect to discuss the potential for psychological injury as well - and no, one does not have to have "Accident Induced Schizophrenia" (note the cockeyed way in which that is typed...).  There are plenty of diagnosable and temporary conditions for which your accident benefits will provide coverage outside of the Minor Injury Guideline. 

You are also partially correct regarding optional coverage, which I have advocated for profusely on this site previously.


3.  Generally 2 years to file any lawsuit in Ontario.  Up to 6 in certain situations.  There is a $37K deduction on any court award.   

Yes, generally 2 years - but no, not "up to 6 in certain situations."  There are some VERY EXTREME situations where that period can be extended, but assume that that will be the seldom-used exception rather than the rule or even a potential.  Always assume 2, and a lawyer can assist you with attempting to commence an action or application beyond the two year presumptive limitation period if absolutely necessary.  Do not wait until the last minute to commence an action.

Bottom line one needs to be quite seriously injured to gain benefits from a civil court action.

That's also not necessarily true, and would dissuade legitimately injured people from commencing an action.  The deductible you refer to (it changes Jan 1 of each year, indexed with inflation) is for general, non-pecuniary damages only.  Pecuniary damages are not subject to a deductible. 

Whether or not a civil court action is "beneficial" is something that you can only determine with a full appreciation of the specific facts of each individual person's case.


PPL wanted low rates so they got low rates (questionable) but crappy insurance coverage.

That's not specifically correct, but I am declining to engage in that discussion in this thread.  I don't think that Ontario's insurance coverage is crappy at all.

As for "personnel injury" lawyers aka ambulance chasers [snip] ("we don't paid till you do") et al;  their clients are just fodder.

I would not engage in such libel.  There are some very reputable lawyers out there who legitimately care about their clients, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with contingency fee arrangements when properly implemented.  I've experienced far more clients getting overcharged because they pay by the hour than a lump-sum held-back from a settlement.  The law society requires that retainer agreements provide a party to choose either "contingency" or "pay by the hour" options.

i sign a waiver every time i put on my boxer shorts.....   my advice, get a good lawyer and make sure the insurance company doesn't screw you...because they will try...
« Last Edit: December 23, 2017, 01:24:53 pm by kevlar »