Topic: 2018 Camry

[alishahessle]

Nice and stylish...

[dkaz]

My sis in law and her boyfriend put regular in their Infiniti FX45. I'm guessing there are lots of people don't care.

I saw a lot of articles pulled the mention of premium fuel. I wonder if Toyota has rushed back to the drawing board to get regular to work in the engine and asked the media to pull any mention in the meantime. Mazdas run 13:1 compression on regular just fine but 14:1 on regular would be a first.

[Jaeger]

Can't wait to see some performance numbers on this thing.  Should be interesting.

[dougjp]

A much more detailed article than autoblog or tfl, including more specifications, pricing and competitive comparisons (US). The autoblog article doesn't even say what kind of transmission the car has (found out elsewhere its an 8 speed auto for both the 4 and 6 cyl., cvt for the hybrid).

https://www.topspeed.com/cars/toyota/2018-toyota-camry-ar175089.html

As seems to be standard fare with new car announcements, nobody will reveal a car's weight.

Here's another review that isn't as complementary as the others;

http://www.thecarconnection.com/review/1108238_2018-toyota-camry_performance_3

[Noto]

My guess is the 91 octane is a way to get the hp numbers up.  The engine will likely happily chug away on 87, but performance will proportionally drop.  Most won't notice either way.  I'm not sure whether the engine will actually say "91 OCTANE REQUIRED" or "RECOMMENDED".

e.g. ES350 (from the Owner's Manual):

Fuel type Unleaded gasoline only
Octane Rating 87 (Research Octane Number 91) or higher
Fuel tank capacity
(Reference) 17.0 gal. (64.35 L, 14.2 Imp.gal.)

http://drivers.lexus.com/t3Portal/document/om-s/OM33C68U/pdf/OM33C68U.pdf

Interestingly, for the GS350:

Select premium unleaded gasoline with an octane rating of 91 (Research
Octane Number 96) or higher required for optimum engine performance
and fuel economy.
If the octane rating is less than 91, damage to the engine may occur and may
void the vehicle warranty.

http://drivers.lexus.com/t3Portal/document/om-s/OM30F82U/pdf/OM30F82U.pdf

[dkaz]

My Sienna with the 3.3L 3MZ-FE recommends premium. People noted there could be a drop of up to 15 HP (from 230 to 215) with regular if the knock sensor detects knock and retards timing. I've only put premium so far but might try a couple of regular tanks when road trip season is done and the minivan sees more city use. For highway driving on mountain overpasses though, I do want that extra HP.

My older Sienna with the 3.0L 1MZ-FE had a less reliable knock sensor and was over conservative with the retardation of timing as a result. It wasn't just the loss of HP, the engine just didn't seem to run as smooth on regular fuel. I think the 3MZ-FE will run a lot better on regular with the more advanced knock sensor that can reliably monitor things in real time. As for fuel consumption, I didn't notice a difference. So it was mostly to make the engine run smoother and somewhat to get better performance.

But I wonder if the compression ratio is the culprit here at 13:1 for the base engine and 14:1 for the hybrid engine. I've noted before that Mazda Skyactiv engines can run at 13:1 compression ratio on regular fuel although the 14:1 compression ratio Skyactiv engines overseas require premium fuel. Apparently the Ferrari 458 has a 14:1 compression ratio engine that can run on regular thanks to knock sensors although it'll run a lot better on premium. So Toyota should be able to do the same, and they should.

[rrocket]

Good point No-san. Would using regular fuel cause a drop of 23hp?

It might.

[EV Dan]

Another reason the Li-Ion situation seems strange is that the Prius uses Ni-Mh for the base trim and Li-ion for the upper two. Which makes perfect sense to me. While FE is the same regardless of the battery pack. So my suspicion is once the official specs are out we'll see the same thing with the Camry, although the FE drop is likely due to wider and stickier tires as well as extra weight.
https://www.toyota.ca/toyota/en/vehicles/prius/models-specifications

[rrocket]

Another reason the Li-Ion situation seems strange is that the Prius uses Ni-Mh for the base trim and Li-ion for the upper two. Which makes perfect sense to me. While FE is the same regardless of the battery pack. So my suspicion is once the official specs are out we'll see the same thing with the Camry, although the FE drop is likely due to wider and stickier tires as well as extra weight.
https://www.toyota.ca/toyota/en/vehicles/prius/models-specifications

No. Only the LE gets li-ion in the Camry. Their thinking is the people buying the sporty model (SE) and the full on luxury model (XLE) place a bigger priority on sporty driving and luxury content than on all out fuel economy.

[johngenx]

^^^ Penny pinchers will buy the base model to keep the initial costs low, and indeed they're the ones interested in the best fuel economy.

[rrocket]

^^^ Penny pinchers will buy the base model to keep the initial costs low, and indeed they're the ones interested in the best fuel economy.

Ya, that's what I understood.

[Noto]

That was my understanding as well, but it seems odd...I suspect it has to do more with manufacturing capacity for the NiMH vs LiIon.

[ltruong]

I quite like the new Camry.  Yes the front grill bottom feeder is pretty bad but overall it's nice looking....Maxima ish..?

[dkaz]

That was my understanding as well, but it seems odd...I suspect it has to do more with manufacturing capacity for the NiMH vs LiIon.

I think you nailed it, although one would expect the LE to be their hybrid volume seller.

[Noto]

Perhaps that's the point...the NiMH isn't harming many folk in the "sporty hybrid" trims

...but the XLE Hybrid I would have thought as focusing on better battery tech...I guess not.

[johngenx]

I agree that supply issues are probably causing Toyota to install two types of batteries.  Then it becomes a case of understanding consumer needs as well as average fuel economy.  I understand the base hybrid is the volume seller, so installing the most efficient battery in the highest selling model, you max your avg economy ratings.

[EV Dan]

 



Accord Hybrid runs 13:1 on recommended regular. Could they go higher and claim even better MPG? Perhaps, but someone there has known that hybrid buyers are a special breed who look for greenness, MPG and MP$. I suspect recommended 91 grade will become a major turn-off for a lot of potential customers. 

[EV Dan]

Toyota chief engineer explanation regarding the hybrid batteries. I'll take it with a grain of salt and say they've got a ton of Ni-MH packs lying around and obviously they are cheaper.
https://youtu.be/-3dslFuNie8?t=39m50s

[EV Dan]

BTW I saw in one of the reviews that the engine takes 0W-16. Nope, not a typo    Seems they've used every trick in the books to get to 52MPG.

[ArticSteve]

Definitely trending to be a wait and see story.