Topic: FCA Lemonade!!

[rrocket]

This is a true story.     But I'm just some guy on the internet so take it for what it's worth.  But this is 100% true.

We have a local guy who comes around to all the tool shops.  Without divulging his name, he's known as the "hot dog guy".  He comes around with snacks, hot dogs, beverages, etc.  50 cents for a hot dog, 50 cents for a pop , $1 for peanuts etc.  Cheap snacks.  He's been doing this forever...like 30+ years.

When I first started in the trade, he used to have a 70s VW Beetle.  He drove it into the ground and it had like a bazillion KMs on it.  It used be be stacked roof to floor with his snacks.

Next, he wanted more room, so he bought a new PT Cruiser.  Shockingly, it lasted a long time relatively problem free. He decided to get rid of it after a succession of electrical issues and a toasted transmission.  It had 300,000Kms on it.

Before he bought his next car, he asked me what I thought he should buy because I'm "the car guy".  I suggested a Prius V.  Lotsa room for his stuff, cheap on gas, reliable, no need for E-test, etc.  He said "he wasn't sure" because he never owned a Toyota before...and he kinda thought he'd like to stay FCA since he had success with the PT.  So what would I suggest from FCA he asked? "Nothing" I told him.  Reliability and economy is important to him...no car, no selling of snacks.  So I didn't want to recommend any FCA product to him...knowing they might crap the bed.  Finally in a "gun pointed to my head" scenario, I reluctantly said "Minivan".

A day later, he told me he'd bought a Journey.  I immediately said "You're going to regret that decision".  This was 15 days ago. 

Fast forward to today. I've been off from work the last 2 weeks, so I was pretty shocked to see him in a fully loaded Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (he's a frugal guy).  I asked WTF??

Journey #1 lasted 3 days before continually stalling and not wanting to run.  He'd be driving along..and it would just die.  The dealer tried to "fix" it by replacing every electrical component they could.  No good.  So they gave him another Journey.

Journey #2 lasted a couple days longer.  He was at a stop light and the car decided to blow the rad and empty the contents on the road.  The dealer then gave him Journey #3.

Journey #3 seemed good at first.  But then all the idiots lights went off and the car refused to shift properly.  Transmission seemed to become possessed and had a mind of it's own.

At this point, he said NO to the Journey.  And to the dealers credit, they decided to work with him because of all the BS in his purchase. So they gave him the Cherokee while they sort out the details.  Looks like he's getting a base minivan now.

15 days, 4 different FCA vehicles.

It's so crazy, I can't even make it up.   

[Allen]

Sounds about right for FCA

[sailor723]

No surprise here.

[rrocket]

No surprise here.

Come on....even you have to be a bit surprised by 4 cars in 15 days 

[johngenx]

That is very surprising.  After Journey #3, I would have wanted to walk away and buy another brand.  Well, after Journey #1 bit the dust I would have wanted to get away from any and all FCA products.

[EV Dan]

Every time I saw that $19,999 ad I wondered how bad could the car really be. A stranger on the internet has answered my question 

Too bad he didn't at least test drive the V. Could be a much happier person now.

[rrocket]

Every time I saw that $19,999 ad I wondered how bad could the car really be. A stranger on the internet has answered my question 

Too bad he didn't at least test drive the V. Could be a much happier person now.

I just thought it made sense once he told me how much he spent a week on gas.

[Gurgie]

That's gotta be ridiculous bad luck!! Were they all brand new?

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[EV Dan]

Every time I saw that $19,999 ad I wondered how bad could the car really be. A stranger on the internet has answered my question 

Too bad he didn't at least test drive the V. Could be a much happier person now.

I just thought it made sense once he told me how much he spent a week on gas.

And it would likely make to to half a million km, based on what taxi drivers get out of their toyota hybrids. But the reason so many brands and makes are out there is that ppl don't use math or logic alone when it comes to car shopping. 

[Rupert]

   I have had my Caravan for almost 10 years and apart from rear brake issues (damned annoying) everything works just fine still, even after pulling a 2000Lb trailer for most of it's mileage. I have never had a better running vehicle that handles and starts so well. It has the 3.8 engine and trailer tow package which includes heavy duty rad and oil cooler and fantastic Nivomat load leveling shock/suspension on the rear.
   I see that the brakes have been revised now and although we don't tow anymore I am thinking that a new one might be in order just for it's great versatility...which we would miss. The Caravan is a stronger van than the others in my opinion and had a 3600LB tow rating then and now, which the others did not seem to offer at the time.
   I don't know why those things went wrong and can't think why he would choose a Journey over a Caravan...makes no sense considering the use.

[tooscoops]

to be frank... i'd want to know more before believing it 100%

people bash the journey and by golly, does it have weak spots... brakes, underpowered 4 cyl, crap fuel economy, pre 2011 sucked huge...

but this is not only not common failures, it is just unbelievable to me as the journey probably makes up about 15% of my sales... so just in the last three years say, 90-100 journey's.... i can go back further if you want, but i think that sample size is decent...

i have never had a rad go... i have literally not had a complaint regarding any v6 powered ones and the only things i hear are people with 4 bangers that regret not going to 6.

the other issues i bet i can explain... journeys were off-loaded to dealers in huge quantities, and the blacktops in particular were given with the intention of being demo'd... they then have to either sit on the lot or be driven for 3 months or so prior to sale. i bet the batteries were pooched. sitting on a lot kills them in the journey specifically... we replace the batteries here, but most dealers will just give it a charge. while it give a bad impression of the car, it is an issue that is a perfect storm as it were. it's really the dealers fault more than the car.

anyway... definitely a way to get a bad impression though!

[Seafoam]

to be frank... i'd want to know more before believing it 100%

people bash the journey and by golly, does it have weak spots... brakes, underpowered 4 cyl, crap fuel economy, pre 2011 sucked huge...

but this is not only not common failures, it is just unbelievable to me as the journey probably makes up about 15% of my sales... so just in the last three years say, 90-100 journey's.... i can go back further if you want, but i think that sample size is decent...

i have never had a rad go... i have literally not had a complaint regarding any v6 powered ones and the only things i hear are people with 4 bangers that regret not going to 6.

the other issues i bet i can explain... journeys were off-loaded to dealers in huge quantities, and the blacktops in particular were given with the intention of being demo'd... they then have to either sit on the lot or be driven for 3 months or so prior to sale. i bet the batteries were pooched. sitting on a lot kills them in the journey specifically... we replace the batteries here, but most dealers will just give it a charge. while it give a bad impression of the car, it is an issue that is a perfect storm as it were. it's really the dealers fault more than the car.

anyway... definitely a way to get a bad impression though!

A lot of people bash them . Over in Brit's thread there have been a few good reviews. They can't all be bad. My dad drove mostly dodge -chrysler vehicles. He had mostly good luck with them.
The Journey to me is fairly good looking. Most of the suv's and cuv's out there all look the same.
Any reliability issues however would drive me crazy. I have no tolerance for trips to the dealer.Don't care if it's a 20,000 or 100,000 dollar's.
If it's not reliable I wouldn't have it in my driveway for very long.

[rrocket]

Update: Showed up with his new minivan...a nice red/garnet color. No issues yet. Dealer went absolutely out of their way to retain him as customer.

No worries if you don't believe me Scoops. I hardly believed it myself. But it's the truth.

I'll keep this post updated...But I don't think he'll have any big issues with his new ride....But you never know!

[G.Bombay]

Sounds like the dealership also went through a lot of BS. Nice to see that they've stepped up to the plate for their customer.

[tooscoops]

Update: Showed up with his new minivan...a nice red/garnet color. No issues yet. Dealer went absolutely out of their way to retain him as customer.

No worries if you don't believe me Scoops. I hardly believed it myself. But it's the truth.

I'll keep this post updated...But I don't think he'll have any big issues with his new ride....But you never know!

meh, it's not that i don't believe you rocket... it's that the situation might not be 100% as he has explained, that's all. could be all facts, but maybe it took 3 weeks... the second one might have actually been the same one as the third, they just attempted to fix it... the rad might have actually been a power steering hose...

just that kind of stuff. again, there are better cars out there... but they aren't as crap as people will lead you to believe.

i deal with people telling me "fish tales" all day long about their cars... be it servicing, purchasing or history... hardly any is all factual, there is always a bit of storytelling involved. so no offense meant rocket.

[rrocket]

Update: Showed up with his new minivan...a nice red/garnet color. No issues yet. Dealer went absolutely out of their way to retain him as customer.

No worries if you don't believe me Scoops. I hardly believed it myself. But it's the truth.

I'll keep this post updated...But I don't think he'll have any big issues with his new ride....But you never know!

meh, it's not that i don't believe you rocket... it's that the situation might not be 100% as he has explained, that's all. could be all facts, but maybe it took 3 weeks... the second one might have actually been the same one as the third, they just attempted to fix it... the rad might have actually been a power steering hose...

just that kind of stuff. again, there are better cars out there... but they aren't as crap as people will lead you to believe.

i deal with people telling me "fish tales" all day long about their cars... be it servicing, purchasing or history... hardly any is all factual, there is always a bit of storytelling involved. so no offense meant rocket.

No, it only happened over 2 weeks...he comes to the shop 2X a week.  So we see him weekly. 3 different color Journeys....obviously 3 different vehicles (unless painting is part of the fixing process!!).  I can ask the color of the liquid it spewed...but he said "coolant everywhere and all over the road".

Either way....still has the garnet minivan, so all is well.  His only complaint thus far is "it feels big" and "it's a bit thirsty".  He quite likes the sliding doors for loading his stuff though!

[carcrazed]

Minivan is the answer for someone like the guy described.
My parents' 2001 Grand Caravan last until this year with close to 350K.
Not bad for a FCA car that wasn't exactly maintained to be in tip-top shape.  I believe it was the first model year for it, too.

[tooscoops]

Update: Showed up with his new minivan...a nice red/garnet color. No issues yet. Dealer went absolutely out of their way to retain him as customer.

No worries if you don't believe me Scoops. I hardly believed it myself. But it's the truth.

I'll keep this post updated...But I don't think he'll have any big issues with his new ride....But you never know!

meh, it's not that i don't believe you rocket... it's that the situation might not be 100% as he has explained, that's all. could be all facts, but maybe it took 3 weeks... the second one might have actually been the same one as the third, they just attempted to fix it... the rad might have actually been a power steering hose...

just that kind of stuff. again, there are better cars out there... but they aren't as crap as people will lead you to believe.

i deal with people telling me "fish tales" all day long about their cars... be it servicing, purchasing or history... hardly any is all factual, there is always a bit of storytelling involved. so no offense meant rocket.

No, it only happened over 2 weeks...he comes to the shop 2X a week.  So we see him weekly. 3 different color Journeys....obviously 3 different vehicles (unless painting is part of the fixing process!!).  I can ask the color of the liquid it spewed...but he said "coolant everywhere and all over the road".

Either way....still has the garnet minivan, so all is well.  His only complaint thus far is "it feels big" and "it's a bit thirsty".  He quite likes the sliding doors for loading his stuff though!

i feel dumb that i keep saying anything because it doesn't matter whatsoever, but so far, i've heard that it was two weeks... that you see him twice a week... you saw him in three journeys in that 15 day period, plus the grand cherokee.

but then that you had the last two weeks off.

AGAIN, just saying take every car failure (or success) story with a grain of salt is all. we are usually hearing from a guy who heard the story from a person with a vested interest and bias who also doesn't know what is actually happening behind the scenes (or under the hood as it were).

hope his van works like the vw did! good chance as long as he doesn't abuse it. also a fan of the red on those.

[rrocket]

i feel dumb that i keep saying anything because it doesn't matter whatsoever, but so far, i've heard that it was two weeks... that you see him twice a week... you saw him in three journeys in that 15 day period, plus the grand cherokee.

but then that you had the last two weeks off.

It's ok! I personally saw 2 vehicles with my own eyes. Journey #1 and GC.

After you posted about the colors thing last night, I merely walked over and asked the shop foreman (everyone on shift knows about the debacle).

He confirmed 3 different colors.

It's ok if you don't believe me.

[Ex-airbalancer]

Out of curiosity, who has ever experienced a dealership substituting one brand new vehicle for another simply b/c there was a problem with the first?  That sounds dubious to me.  I cannot help but think the response 10 times out of 10 will be for the dealership to repair (under warranty) the defect.

Maybe ask sailor