Topic: Motorcycle for New Rider

[Angry Chicken]

My wife and I have accepted the inevitable.  We know our 19-year-old 2nd year university daughter is going to be riding a motorcycle, if not this summer, next summer.  I'm not really comfortable with the idea and honestly I think the mix of youth, two wheels and a surfeit of power is a dangerous combination.  That's another thread and I would be interested in hearing peoples' views on that, but not in this thread.  No famous CTC tangents here!    .  My being uncomfortable doesn't mean that I don't know how to let go.  She's an adult in the eyes of the law, and though we are still helping her with university costs, I also know that that doesn't mean we get to dictate all her purchases.  She's a responsible driver and I have no reason to believe she wouldn't be a responsible rider. 

But here's the thing.  I DON"T HAVE A CLUE about motorcycles.  I'm mechanically inclined.  I have competed at an advanced level in four-wheel toys but have never even ridden a motorcycle.  Ever.  Not even as a passenger.  Freud would have a field day with me.

Is there such a thing as a good, safe bet for a beginner rider?  I would like to help her (Shhh, don't tell her!) with a new motorcycle.  Something with a good warranty and from a reputable maker....same criteria as anyone would have with a new car, I suppose.  What displacement should we be looking at?  Ergonomics and sitting position would be important too.  She'd have to be able to carry her university books with her and workout gear.  Would a backpack suffice or are there bikes (we're talking <= $8000) which have built in stowage in the seat area?  She's not very tall, so a heavy bike that you'd have to wrestle with to get on/off the stands wouldn't work.

I will do some research (of course) but I'm interested in getting a sense of direction before I go madly off in all directions? Are the questions that I've asked so far a good start?

[dorin]

The best bet would be a used 500cc or less "standard" bike such as a Honda Nighthawk/Rebel.  They're cheap, low on power, and it won't hurt too much when (notice I said when, not if) she drops it (likely not with her on board).

If she can afford a new bike and is willing to live with the likelihood of having to repair some cosmetic damage when she will drop it, then the Kawasaki Ninja 250 is the best choice out there.  It's cheap enough, it's light, it handles well (a lot better than the aforementioned old bikes), it's short and it's powerful enough to be fun but not too powerful.

edit: http://www.kawasaki.ca/model/ninja-250r:1156

[dorin]

As for the carrying stuff around, a backpack is fine for short trips (i.e. in town) but the best thing is to get an accessory rack and put on a locking box on the bike.  It's also quite easy to buy a $10 bungy net and strap down any bag/backpack/etc. over the rear seat.  Most bikes come with built-in attachment points for bungys anyway and the net makes securing a bag super-easy.

[Cord]

A cheap used bike is a good idea for a new rider. She will drop it so there's not much sense in buying a brand new sport bike with expensive body work. A 600cc sport bike seems to be considered a "beginner bike" these days. But nothing could be further from the truth. These machines have huge power (but seem docile until you twist the throttle a little more than intended. They have horrid ergonomics for riding on the street and in combination with almost universally useless mirrors really make it tough to keep tabs on what's around. Cruiser type bikes have their own ergonomic challenges and they weigh a ton.

As suggested above, a standard or naked style (no fairings) is best and a modest displacement is recommended. I'd avoid anything over 500cc.

Also, when coming up with a budget don't forget to factor in the cost of a training course (this should be manadatory) and the cost of good gear. At a minimum this should include a good leather jacket (made for motorcycling), gloves, boots, and a helmet. A quality set of this minimum gear can easily run $1500+.

I would recommend that you have a talk with her and determine what her reasons for riding are. For example, is she attracted to the sporting aspect? Is she interested in taking long highway trips? Does she just want to save money on gas? Does she just think a bike would look cool with the leather boots she saw? Then you can be a more helpful guide in helping her get started in the right direction.

[rrocket]

That scooter that LasPalmas has is a very good option, to be honest.  They go 95 km/h (she won't be allowed on highways as a beginner IIRC), has underseat storage, looks good and gets great gas mileage.  And insurance will be cheap since it's only 50cc.  Add in the fact the licensing procedure is easier than a true bike and it's the way to go.  All for about $4000.

If she really wants a "true" motorcycle, the new Honda CBR125 gets my vote.  Cheap to insure, cheap to buy, very light, very stylish, good on gas (2L/100km)...and here's the best part.  If you buy it new, they have a new rider thing.  You get protective gear with your purchase.  Helmet, jacket and gloves.  Very nice.  I've ridden one to try, and must say, it's a VERY good package for a beginner.  So easy is this package to ride, they have a race series for riders UNDER 16 years old.  Again...all for under $4000.  Get a nice armoured backpack, and she'd be all set to carry her books.

But my personal favorite is some kind of dual sport.  Essentially a street legal dirtbike.  I like these for very new riders because you can beat the living crap out of them, drop them, crash them, and they just don't break much.  A Suzuki DR125 or Yamaha XT would fit the bill.  Again...very cheap to operate and insure.

Whatever you decide on, enroll her in a motorcycle training course.  THIS IS A MUST.  NON-NEGOTIABLE.  The course is VERY, very good.  They teach you on bikes in a HUGE parking lot on easy to ride bikes.  It's invaluable, and some insurance companies insist on this.  I insist on this because she will learn sooo much.  YOu want her learning in a parking lot for the first little while, not on a road.  FWIW, I was a fill-in instructor for the MTO course in Windsor.  Here's a list of colleges that provide the course: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/gradu/motocourse.shtml

So you have a few options here.  Motorcycle training course is a must first.  Insist that she take the course if she wants your help in purchasing the bike. Again..IMO, this should be non-negotiable.  She either takes the course, or no bike. PERIOD.

If her riding is only in town use though...My vote is for a scooter.  Below is a pic of the Honda.

CBR125:  

[vdk]

 

RR knows this stuff. 

[johngenx]

Any chance of getting her on dirt first?  I rode motocross for years before hitting the street, and it really helps with learning to control a motorcycle.

With RR on the training.  Even good riders send their kids for training.

[Guy]

Fully agree with RR and Dorin, better to start small and trade up every couple of year as she gain experience. Training is an absolute must! The dual purpose bike is a great suggestion. If she is looking for a street bike, the Honda 125 or Kawasaki 250 are good bikes. Around here all training schools seem to be using the Suzuki 500. http://moto.suzuki.ca/Product%20Lines/Cycles/Products/GS500F/2009/GS500.aspx The Kawasaki Ninja 500 is also a good choice. http://www.kawasaki.ca/model/ninja-500r:1127

[ktm525]

Any chance of getting her on dirt first?  I rode motocross for years before hitting the street, and it really helps with learning to control a motorcycle.

With RR on the training.  Even good riders send their kids for training.

I agree with this. I spent 14 years in the dirt before I took my first street skills school. Items like what to do if the front lcoks up will not faze you one bit. Out in the dirt I lock my front 10's of times during a hard ride.

How about a Suzuki DR200? Should hold up to a few drops.

[Mitlov]

I was going to post something, but rrocket already said everything I wanted to say, and better.

[PJungnitsch]

A lot of good info here already.

To add:

Scooters are great to learn on, auto clutch makes shifting easy, they are light and nice to handle. Often have storage under the seat for books, helmet, etc. If she gets one make sure she wears gear. Scooter riders seem to be especially prone to riding with a t-shirt, no gloves, shorts and sneakers, etc. As a result many I know get banged up, skidding on the pavement on their bare hands is especially common. A mesh jacket and kevlar-lined jeans are a big step up in safety and not too hot in summer.

Dirt-type bikes are great in that they don't usually break when tipped over, however they are also often tall, which can be a problem for women, especially if shorter.

While mid sized bikes are good in that you can grow into them, even my 650 weighs 550lbs wet loaded up. I tipped mine over last week and pulled something in my chest getting it back level again.

Hi-Viz gear makes a huge difference to safety, especially in heavy traffic. I like a mesh vest I can put on for the evening commute.

[initial_D]

How do you guys winterize & store the bikes when the snow comes down?

[ktm525]

How do you guys winterize & store the bikes when the snow comes down?

Change the oil
Place on center stand to get the tires off the ground
full gas tank with fuel stabilizer
remove battery and put in my basement
put battery on tander once in awhile

done.

The dirtbike gets a set of studded tires.

[PJungnitsch]

That's pretty much it. Would add draining the carb if a carbed bike, and throwing on a cover if left outside (both for element protection and theft/vandalism protection, no one seems to want to touch a dirty bike cover).

[Angry Chicken]

Thanks everyone for the detailed, thoughful and generally great feedback.  I plan to do my own due diligence in getting the right ride for my daughter.  Just so everyone is clear, my daughter *will* take professionally-led motorcycle rider training.  This is mandatory.  I particularly like the comments about proper protective attire and not skimping on that part of the purchase equation too.

I think the moderator should consider making this thread a sticky.  I don't think any purchase decision will be made (at least for us) this year but there was a lot of valuable advice given and methinks that there are probably lots of lurkers on this particular forum that could also take advantage of the information.

Thanks again!

[dorin]

I would encourage your daughter to register for the course asap.  IIRC the courses fill up fast and don't start until fairly late in the year (end of May, beginning of June).  She might as well get properly trained and licensed this year, then buy gear on sale in the fall, then be ready to ride next year. 

[ktm525]

Thanks everyone for the detailed, thoughful and generally great feedback.  I plan to do my own due diligence in getting the right ride for my daughter.  Just so everyone is clear, my daughter *will* take professionally-led motorcycle rider training.  This is mandatory.  I particularly like the comments about proper protective attire and not skimping on that part of the purchase equation too.

I think the moderator should consider making this thread a sticky.  I don't think any purchase decision will be made (at least for us) this year but there was a lot of valuable advice given and methinks that there are probably lots of lurkers on this particular forum that could also take advantage of the information.

Thanks again!

Start her in the dirt on a track. Motorcross lessons.

[Guy]

One thing I forgot, once she has her bike, fit it with a proper horn. Visibility of the motorcycle is always an issue with motorist, so if they won't see her, they will hear her. She should also ride on high beam in daytime to get more noticed.

I've always fitted twin Fiamm horns on my bikes for safety as stock horn are usually useless. On my current bike, I fitted a Stebel Nautilus and this thing sounds more like a train! It comes with a relay and wiring is easy. Cheap too, only $50.

Available in Canada here: http://www.aviciouscycle.ca/klrhorn.html

[wing]

There are a TON of used bikes in Ottawa.

Check out usedottawa.com  Bikes under 500cc
http://www.usedottawa.com/classifieds/motorcycles-under-500cc

Wow almost new!
http://www.usedottawa.com/classified-ad/8266143



EDIT: http://www.usedottawa.com/classified-ad/8720893  $3000 buys you a new CBR125R

[Iso Octane]

CBR125:  

I've been lurking/perusing the CBR125R around the net and it's the top of my list for a first bike (maybe next year or two).  The low price point and "real bike look" is seriously appealing.