Topic: Best real-world winter vehicle

[blur911]

Your list is all trade offs. If you want clearance and great AWD and ridiculous anywhere ability, the Limited trim 4Runner is one of the best poor condition vehicles on the planet. It has a true 4x4 system as well as AWD

Add in Toyota reliability and insane resale, and the high purchase price isn't as bad as it looks.

That's a great choice.

Well, if you can handle the fuel mileage of a 4Runner, then a Cayenne is back on the list. 

[EV-Light]

If money is not a problem...Ford Raptor is the obvious answer.

On a budget I'd likely go Subaru Outback or something with terrain management system that allows you to refine the operation of AWD

Forget Audis, unless you go for older models...the new ones are FWD and only kick the rear when sense grip.

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[theonlydt]

Your list is all trade offs. If you want clearance and great AWD and ridiculous anywhere ability, the Limited trim 4Runner is one of the best poor condition vehicles on the planet. It has a true 4x4 system as well as AWD

Add in Toyota reliability and insane resale, and the high purchase price isn't as bad as it looks.

That's a great choice.

Well, if you can handle the fuel mileage of a 4Runner, then a Cayenne is back on the list. 

I can't handle the fuel mileage of a Prjus C - but in this world of trade offs a 4runner is not completely unreasonable.

What makes the Cayenne so good? I know the original toureg it was based on was surprisingly good off road.

What about cars no longer on sale? Suzuki SX4? Saab? I was impressed by the venerable Chevvy Trailblazer (switchable to full time 4wd).

Surprised no one has said wrangler?

[quadzilla]

Forget Audis, unless you go for older models...the new ones are FWD and only kick the rear when sense grip.

You sure about that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTtVa7WSCFc

[Scaerio]

Your list is all trade offs. If you want clearance and great AWD and ridiculous anywhere ability, the Limited trim 4Runner is one of the best poor condition vehicles on the planet. It has a true 4x4 system as well as AWD

Add in Toyota reliability and insane resale, and the high purchase price isn't as bad as it looks.

That's a great choice.

Well, if you can handle the fuel mileage of a 4Runner, then a Cayenne is back on the list. 

Made in Japan proven reliablity versus FGC Made in Slovakia timebomb...   

[blur911]

Your list is all trade offs. If you want clearance and great AWD and ridiculous anywhere ability, the Limited trim 4Runner is one of the best poor condition vehicles on the planet. It has a true 4x4 system as well as AWD

Add in Toyota reliability and insane resale, and the high purchase price isn't as bad as it looks.

That's a great choice.

Well, if you can handle the fuel mileage of a 4Runner, then a Cayenne is back on the list. 

I can't handle the fuel mileage of a Prjus C - but in this world of trade offs a 4runner is not completely unreasonable.

What makes the Cayenne so good? I know the original toureg it was based on was surprisingly good off road.

What about cars no longer on sale? Suzuki SX4? Saab? I was impressed by the venerable Chevvy Trailblazer (switchable to full time 4wd).

Surprised no one has said wrangler?

Everyone should have a Cayenne     
You never mentioned age or budget, but seriously though, they are decent bang for the buck if bought used, and they are fairly reliable.   For winter travelling they have seat heaters and heated steering wheels, Porsche Stability Management,  lockable differentials and low-range transfer case.    Very quiet on the highway, very little wind noise, great stereo, comfy seats.
Why not?

I've also wondered about the SX4, I like the look of them. 
My ex-brother-in-law swore by his old Suzuki Sidekick, he drove it all over the maritimes for work for years in all sorts of weather.

[johngenx]

Let me bolster my case for the 4Runner.

1. Low running costs despite fuel economy issue.  The 4Runner depreciates slowly.  Service and maintenance costs are Toyota, not German or British.

2. SUVs are far more comfortable than trucks for most people.  Enclosed cargo spaces are nicer for most people unless you need to carry a leaking  motorcycle engine or building materials.

3. The Raptor is cartoonish and massive.  The 4Runner is sensible, park-able, and you don't look like a douche driving one.

I would have suggested a Highlander as my own HL is an unstoppable winter driving beast. But, I can't vouch for the new AWD system Toyota is using in the newest Highlanders - it's different from the full time AWD in my own older model.

[theonlydt]

Your list is all trade offs. If you want clearance and great AWD and ridiculous anywhere ability, the Limited trim 4Runner is one of the best poor condition vehicles on the planet. It has a true 4x4 system as well as AWD

Add in Toyota reliability and insane resale, and the high purchase price isn't as bad as it looks.

That's a great choice.

Well, if you can handle the fuel mileage of a 4Runner, then a Cayenne is back on the list. 

I can't handle the fuel mileage of a Prjus C - but in this world of trade offs a 4runner is not completely unreasonable.

What makes the Cayenne so good? I know the original toureg it was based on was surprisingly good off road.

What about cars no longer on sale? Suzuki SX4? Saab? I was impressed by the venerable Chevvy Trailblazer (switchable to full time 4wd).

Surprised no one has said wrangler?

Everyone should have a Cayenne     
You never mentioned age or budget, but seriously though, they are decent bang for the buck if bought used, and they are fairly reliable.   For winter travelling they have seat heaters and heated steering wheels, Porsche Stability Management,  lockable differentials and low-range transfer case.    Very quiet on the highway, very little wind noise, great stereo, comfy seats.
Why not?

I've also wondered about the SX4, I like the look of them. 
My ex-brother-in-law swore by his old Suzuki Sidekick, he drove it all over the maritimes for work for years in all sorts of weather.

There is no budget - it's merely an academic exercise. I'm old enough to be divorced, living in two cities, driving a minivan and broke.

Does sound like the Cayenne's a decent option if you can afford running costs and purchase price.

SX4 was only slip and grip - but did have a lock mode that would stay in operation until 40kmh.

[theonlydt]

Let me bolster my case for the 4Runner.

1. Low running costs despite fuel economy issue.  The 4Runner depreciates slowly.  Service and maintenance costs are Toyota, not German or British.

2. SUVs are far more comfortable than trucks for most people.  Enclosed cargo spaces are nicer for most people unless you need to carry a leaking  motorcycle engine or building materials.

3. The Raptor is cartoonish and massive.  The 4Runner is sensible, park-able, and you don't look like a douche driving one.

I would have suggested a Highlander as my own HL is an unstoppable winter driving beast. But, I can't vouch for the new AWD system Toyota is using in the newest Highlanders - it's different from the full time AWD in my own older model.

So what capability do you give up going for a Highlander over a 4runner (transfer case and ground clearance?).

[tortoise]

Budget and reliability weren't requirements in the original post.

Hence the answer is still Range Rover. Or Cayenne.

[Ex-airbalancer]

Gmt400 era GMC/Chevrolet K1500 with a set of studded Goodyear Duratracs. Reliable as a chunk of granite, cheap and easy to fix if anything ever goes wrong, good ground clearance and the vast of them came with a Gov-Loc rear locker.

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GMT 400, had one, new generation are nicer

[Gurgie]

Grand Cherokee diesel is what I'd get or Pentastar if not doing much mileage.

Mine has treated me well and has been a beast in the snow with the winter tires installed. Also, very comfortable place to spend hours at a time.

[BritWRX]

So many options.  I would like to do it in style and comfort in a Range Rover/Range Rover Sport but reliability and running costs may be an issue.  Grand Cherokee diesel and 4Runner are a good shout.  Maybe a Missan Murano or Infiniti QX70?  If you want something smaller then a Jeep Cherokee V6 Trailhawk or Ford Escape 2.0 Ecoboost might work too.

A truck also has appeal too though.  Maybe a Colorado/Canyon diesel, Ram 1500 Ecodiesel or F150 2.7 Ecoboost if you're economy-minded and don't have to do any really heavy towing.

More on the fun spectrum.  Focus RS, WRX, Golf R, Audi S3, MINI Countryman Cooper S AWD?  I would lean more towards the RS or WRX of that group.  Subaru's AWD system is second to none and having owned an older WRX, it was mighty and a blast in inclement weather.  Re Audis, only the A3 (and possibly Q3) have slip and grip AWD.  A4 and bigger have a Torsen diff, so something like an S4 might work well.

Nothing wrong with the Crosstrek/Outback but the 2.0/2.5 doesn't have much power and I don't think the Crosstrek has proper Subaru symmetrical AWD.  If going down the Subaru route, I would sacrifice some ground clearance and get a WRX if you wanted a manual or if you could live with an auto (and I hear that Subaru's CVT is really good), go for a Forester XT that has some decent power.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

3.6R Outback

[carcrazed]

3.6R Outback

This.

I like my MDX with SH-AWD on Blizzaks very much, though.

[blur911]

Does sound like the Cayenne's a decent option if you can afford running costs and purchase price.

Running costs have been pretty decent.

I bet if you were shopping used, a 10 year old 4Runner would cost more than a 10 year old Cayenne.  Depreciation is a bad thing if buying new, great if  you are buying used.

[johngenx]

I bet if you were shopping used, a 10 year old 4Runner would cost more than a 10 year old Cayenne.

Yup.  Buying new, the Porsche is a ridiculous purchase.  It's priced considerably higher than the 4Runner to start and ends up worth much less.  The Cayenne is a great used buy if you're willing to gamble on the service costs.

[rrocket]

The older RAV4 with the full time AWD were pretty unstoppable in snow too. Ditto the RX300 which used the same awd as the older Highlander

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[wing]

Lx570 is amazing in deep snow.  Don't even notice it's there.  Drive through ditches whatever.

[johngenx]

The older RAV4 with the full time AWD were pretty unstoppable in snow too. Ditto the RX300 which used the same awd as the older Highlander

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The 2001-2005 RAV, the RX and the 2001-2013 Highlanders all use the same basic AWD system.  It's a full time 50:50 F/R system with varying degrees of electronic intervention and LSD-mimicking depending on the year.  Starting in 2004, all the systems came with traction control, yaw control and front and read LSD mimicking.  It's also found in the Sienna AWD van.

It's a great system.  The Highlander is at least the equal to our Forester in terms of traction and ability to get through nasty conditions.  The Forester is a tad more fun to drive thanks to it's lower CG and complete lack of nannies, but has no more true capability.

It's expensive to manufacture.  Toyota kept it in the more pricey Highlander and RX after dropping it in the RAV - the slip/grip is less costly to make and has fewer packaging issues.

The LX570 has AWD as well as 4x4.  Amazing vehicle as well (it's a Land Cruiser, after all) and along with the manual trans FJ Cruiser, the limited trim 4Runner (lower trims don't have full time AWD) and the Lexus GX, Toyota makes some pretty great poor-condition vehicles.  If you can live with lower clearance, the IS350AWD is a nice winter machine - power and RWD-biased AWD.