Topic: Re: Etching and Nitrogen Fees

[nifty6]

I believe you are wrong? dealers can not sell you something you don't want, if an option is not offered by the factory and a dealer tries to sell you something you don't want you can report the dealer to OMVIC.
Show us where it says on the OMVIC web site that states we have to take what the dealer says is mandatory, with no choice. Do you work for a dealer?

so what you are saying is a dealer can add anything it wants, mandatory and expects us to pay for it? .... $400 floor mats, etching, nitrogen, bug deflector, rust proofing, fabric protection, and so on, pay for all of this or buy the car some where else where does it stop, give me a break...

[nifty6]

I believe you are wrong? dealers can not sell you something you don't want, if an option is not offered by the factory and a dealer tries to sell you something you don't want you can report the dealer to OMVIC.
Show us where it says on the OMVIC web site that states we have to take what the dealer says is mandatory, with no choice. Do you work for a dealer?

This has happened to me and no, I'm not wrong. I have clarification of this in writing from OMVIC. Their position is as I described it above.

nifty6, I suggest you email OMVIC yourself if you doubt me. And no I don't work for a dealer.

Please post what you find out!!!!!

from OMVIC

http://www.omvic.on.ca/pdf/OMVIC%20bulletin%20-%20November%202005-2.pdf

Tell us about your experience and also e-mail the following person at OMVIC for a clarification. Let us know what she tells you..read the first post #1 same info is there but I will re post for your benefit. see my reply #22


marlene.wildman@omvic.ca

[nifty6]

otown where are you? you trolling somewhere else?

[Wheelboy]

otown where are you? you trolling somewhere else?

Shhhhh, he's selling a car.

[safristi]

..enuf with tha K'VETCHING.................und da Nicegen fleas...fer heavens sakes..a lil  bite ize good NO!!!

[No H2O]

...salesman...told me that etching and nitrogen were "mandatory".  At that point I walked and had an apologetic e-mail waiting for me when I returned home.  He'd spoken to the sales manager and was told that the "mandatory" fees were now not mandatory and if I returned they would "accommodate" me.

That industry in my books ranks amongst the bottom of the barrel where you find SCUM trying to SCAM you.

Obviously a large percentage of consumers are not the sharpest tools in the shed if they go for that crap.

When I shopped and bought a Yaris for my mom, it came with "Protector Plus"...a bunch of labels that are stuck to each body panel. What utter garbage! How is that going to get my car back in the event it is stolen...like the thief will leave those on there instead of peeling them off.

If sales people do not want to be abused by consumers, I'd suggest they wise up.

[Wheelboy]

Obviously a large percentage of consumers are not the sharpest tools in the shed if they go for that crap.

The big problem is that until they do their 7-year car buying ritual they have never heard of this stuff.  And then ALL they have to go off is the salesman's well-polished presentation.  How many people will do what they need to do - back off and do their own research?  None?

When I shopped and bought a Yaris for my mom, it came with "Protector Plus"...a bunch of labels that are stuck to each body panel. What utter garbage! How is that going to get my car back in the event it is stolen...like the thief will leave those on there instead of peeling them off.

I'm sure the joyriders ALSO have never heard of Protector Plus!  Nor would they give a rat's buttocks if they had.  And I would not want a stolen car back anyway.  But ProtectorPlus is not about getting a car back or making a payout.  It's about maximizing dealership profits.  Anyone, on both sides of the sales desk, should know that.

If sales people do not want to be abused by consumers, I'd suggest they wise up.

I've had no problems abusing a couple of them in the past few months of car shopping.  Treat ME with respect and they get respect back.  On the other hand...............

[No H2O]

How many people will do what they need to do - back off and do their own research?  None?

No research needed. All one needs is smarts....but then, that is a rarity.

[Wheelboy]

It's as much HOW they try to sell something as WHAT they sell.  I've now walked out of one VW dealership twice (one for a car for my daughter, once for myself) because they were adamant that their protector plus (and the last time - their nitrogen) was mandatory.  THEY LET ME WALK.  So you can bet your life, if they're going to let one potential customer walk, then most customers are believing what they're told.  If most customers did as I did, they would soon change their tactics.

And it's what they try to sell too.  WHY don't they tell us that winter tires are mandatory with their cars?  Then at least I would have some slight iota of an impression that they knew what was best for me.

[2JDM]

It's as much HOW they try to sell something as WHAT they sell.  I've now walked out of one VW dealership twice (one for a car for my daughter, once for myself) because they were adamant that their protector plus (and the last time - their nitrogen) was mandatory.  THEY LET ME WALK.  So you can bet your life, if they're going to let one potential customer walk, then most customers are believing what they're told.  If most customers did as I did, they would soon change their tactics.

And it's what they try to sell too.  WHY don't they tell us that winter tires are mandatory with their cars?  Then at least I would have some slight iota of an impression that they knew what was best for me.

Because a lot of uninformed buyers will most likely pay $400 or whatever, rather than $1000.

[Power2Weight]

Over the last few years I have made a habit of stating right up front I won't pay admin fees, I don't want and won't pay for etching, Scotchguard, nitrogen or anything else not supplied originally by the manufacturer.
At that point they can decide if they want to sell me a car.

Also I love when they send me in to see the "business manager" or secondary salesman, or the bad guy who told the poor salesman they couldn't possibly pay that much for your trade in..
Again I start off with, your salesman has just spent the last couple of hours convincing me this car is the most technologically advanced, safest, most economical, efficient and quality built vehicle in the world. Despite this you have just tagged on an exorbitant sum to re-check this vehicle was assembled correctly, how can I possibly need under seal, paint protection, extended warranty etc. 

Generally they just grin and say "sign here", at which point ask for the free mats and tint job

[Petzy]

With OMVIC rules the way they are a dealer cannot advertise or even put a price hanger in the car without it including all manadatory charges. This includes etch, admin, and any other upsell.

If you go to a dealership and they have a sign hanging in the window for $10,000 and then you get to the office and it is $10,000 + Etch + Admin then they are viloating OMVIC rules and could be penalized.

My dealer does have etch and admin fees but they are included in all our prices on the auto-trader, ads and windows hangers. That means if you go in to buy a car advertised for $10,000 and you agree on that price your bill of sale will actually show sale price: $9522 + 299 + 179. Most people would ask why have them then? The simple reason is because since sales people and managers get paid on the percentage of the profit. These do not include etch + admin fees so he/she gets to pay the staff less.

So if you ask any salesperson out there what they think of admin fees and etching I can promise you that they hate them more then you do.

On the other hand though I have had the pleasure of arranging cheques for $2500 - $5000 after a vehicle was stolen.

[Wheelboy]

On the other hand though I have had the pleasure of arranging cheques for $2500 - $5000 after a vehicle was stolen.

And if an insurance actuary worked out the cost of this "insurance" versus the payout he would die laughing.

I don't want to bother getting out my insurance policy for my $40,000 Vette but I'll bet the theft premium for the whole car (not just the few $ what Globali offers) is a fraction of the exorbitant charges for this "etching" insurance.  Mark, some of us know who benefits the most from this massive profit-maker.

And what really are the odds of getting the car stolen?  And isn't this why most of us carry (reasonable cost) theft protection?

[Petzy]

On the other hand though I have had the pleasure of arranging cheques for $2500 - $5000 after a vehicle was stolen.

And if an insurance actuary worked out the cost of this "insurance" versus the payout he would die laughing.

I don't want to bother getting out my insurance policy for my $40,000 Vette but I'll bet the theft premium for the whole car (not just the few $ what Globali offers) is a fraction of the exorbitant charges for this "etching" insurance.  Mark, some of us know who benefits the most from this massive profit-maker.

And what really are the odds of getting the car stolen?  And isn't this why most of us carry (reasonable cost) theft protection?

Dont focus too much on the last line of my post. I am not a fan of the etching programs.

I dont understand why dealers still have them since I dont believe it is profitable under the new OMVIC regulations. If I advertise a $40,000 Vette for sale and you agree to pay me $40,000 + 13% tax = $45,200. Since it is against OMVIC rules to then add etch to that I dont unerstand where the profit is coming from. In my opinion the dealer is just taking money out of his "Left Pocket" and putting it in his "right pocket".

[Wheelboy]

Dont focus too much on the last line of my post. I am not a fan of the etching programs.

No problem.  But I did look at my policy for the 'theft' coverage.  It's $180.  Which makes a mockery of the "value" of the etching/theft fee ($200 - $400?) for approx $4K of potential payout.

[KGCCS]

Is the Globali sticker in any way supposed to prevent theft?

Anyone?

Globali is not a scam at all. Whether or not you want to pay for it is entirely up to you. There are instances where dealers charge too much for it however. With the Globali Registration Program Theft ID stickers are placed on certain areas of the vehicle, namely the inside of the front fenders, hood, b-pillars, trunk deck lid, and exterior doors. The sticker has what is called a 'Theft ID' which is a police-tracable number that is registered into their databank. The sticker leaves behind a UV blacklight trace IF removed, so that even without the stickers the vehicle theft ID can be traced by police. It's simple - if the vehicle is stolen and not recovered, Globali pays you up to $4000 maximum benefit towards the purchase of your next vehicle. In addition, most insurance companies will provide you with a premium discount if you have this product installed on your vehicle.

The reason that MANY dealers have it on their vehicles already and factory the cost of it into the vehicle MSRP or selling price, is that as a dealer they are protected under the same program with the same benefits that we 'consumers' would have. For example, if the vehicle is stolen off the dealer's lot and not recovered, then Globali pays the dealer up to $4000. Again, some insurance carriers also provide insurance breaks for vehicles that have this product installed. If anyone is familiar with commercial and business insurance, you can take a good guess at what the annual insurance cost is for the average new/used car dealership with X amount of inventory in stock.

Just some food for thought before more people post up here about how much of a scam it is before they've actually done their homework.

[nifty6]

Is the Globali sticker in any way supposed to prevent theft?

Anyone?

Globali is not a scam at all. Whether or not you want to pay for it is entirely up to you. There are instances where dealers charge too much for it however. With the Globali Registration Program Theft ID stickers are placed on certain areas of the vehicle, namely the inside of the front fenders, hood, b-pillars, trunk deck lid, and exterior doors. The sticker has what is called a 'Theft ID' which is a police-tracable number that is registered into their databank. The sticker leaves behind a UV blacklight trace IF removed, so that even without the stickers the vehicle theft ID can be traced by police. It's simple - if the vehicle is stolen and not recovered, Globali pays you up to $4000 maximum benefit towards the purchase of your next vehicle. In addition, most insurance companies will provide you with a premium discount if you have this product installed on your vehicle.

The reason that MANY dealers have it on their vehicles already and factory the cost of it into the vehicle MSRP or selling price, is that as a dealer they are protected under the same program with the same benefits that we 'consumers' would have. For example, if the vehicle is stolen off the dealer's lot and not recovered, then Globali pays the dealer up to $4000. Again, some insurance carriers also provide insurance breaks for vehicles that have this product installed. If anyone is familiar with commercial and business insurance, you can take a good guess at what the annual insurance cost is for the average new/used car dealership with X amount of inventory in stock.

Just some food for thought before more people post up here about how much of a scam it is before they've actually done their homework.

I don't think its a scam, its all about the dealer forcing it on buyers, saying they have to have it done, a dealer requirement and charge you for it, thats what makes it a scam. Thieves will steal the car with or without the etching on glass or body panels. For the first 2 years my insurance will pay full value if the car is stolen and not recovered or written off because of an accident. So the cost of the etching is expensive for what it does.

[toolatecrew]

Is the Globali sticker in any way supposed to prevent theft?

Anyone?

Globali is not a scam at all. Whether or not you want to pay for it is entirely up to you. There are instances where dealers charge too much for it however. With the Globali Registration Program Theft ID stickers are placed on certain areas of the vehicle, namely the inside of the front fenders, hood, b-pillars, trunk deck lid, and exterior doors. The sticker has what is called a 'Theft ID' which is a police-tracable number that is registered into their databank. The sticker leaves behind a UV blacklight trace IF removed, so that even without the stickers the vehicle theft ID can be traced by police. It's simple - if the vehicle is stolen and not recovered, Globali pays you up to $4000 maximum benefit towards the purchase of your next vehicle. In addition, most insurance companies will provide you with a premium discount if you have this product installed on your vehicle.

The reason that MANY dealers have it on their vehicles already and factory the cost of it into the vehicle MSRP or selling price, is that as a dealer they are protected under the same program with the same benefits that we 'consumers' would have. For example, if the vehicle is stolen off the dealer's lot and not recovered, then Globali pays the dealer up to $4000. Again, some insurance carriers also provide insurance breaks for vehicles that have this product installed. If anyone is familiar with commercial and business insurance, you can take a good guess at what the annual insurance cost is for the average new/used car dealership with X amount of inventory in stock.

Just some food for thought before more people post up here about how much of a scam it is before they've actually done their homework.

I don't think its a scam, its all about the dealer forcing it on buyers, saying they have to have it done, a dealer requirement and charge you for it, thats what makes it a scam. Thieves will steal the car with or without the etching on glass or body panels. For the first 2 years my insurance will pay full value if the car is stolen and not recovered or written off because of an accident. So the cost of the etching is expensive for what it does.

Members of the Insurance bureau of Canada task force on theft confirm that exemtially all modern vehcicles have SEVERAL points on a vehicle other than the regualr places (windshield and door post) where the vin is recoverable. Which means even if a vehicle has the vin on the door and windsheild removed or changed they can still identify the vehcile. Heck even if they cop a vehcicle for parts there are still ways to identify some (not all obviously) of those parts.

Vin etching is a scam.

The etching itself can be replicated for a kit under 50$ (not that it gives you any benifit over what is already on the car)

[Triple Bob]

I have the Globali stickers all over my car but I didn't pay anything for the service. Just refused.

[Schmidty]

Do you know if there is any legal documents like the one shown here for B.C.? I think its just another add on that they force on you.