Author Topic: 737 MAX in the news again  (Read 2506 times)

Offline sailor723

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737 MAX in the news again
« on: January 06, 2024, 06:41:16 am »
Just saw this on this morning's news...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-67899564  Scary stuff! Apparently high seating density models of this aircraft have an additional emergency exit installed here to meet evacuation standards. This aircraft was regular seating capacity and had a plug with window installed in the fuselage and that's what blew out.

Googling for more info brought up this other recent news about Boeing and the 737 MAX

 https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-wants-faa-to-exempt-max-7-from-safety-rules-to-get-it-in-the-air/

It's a little disconcerting to read that other MAX models currently in service also have this deicing issue and have continued to fly since it was discovered months ago.  :-\

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Offline tortoise

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2024, 07:23:41 am »
Crazy!

I recently flew on a 737 Max from Vancouver to Ottawa and was pretty impressed with it.  It was quiet, the seats were comfortable (I have a long torso and the Airbus on the way there didn't fit me).
Only the slow and dim know where they're going in life, and seldom is it worth the trip. - Tom Robbins.

Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2024, 09:35:31 am »
Crazy!

I recently flew on a 737 Max from Vancouver to Ottawa and was pretty impressed with it.  It was quiet, the seats were comfortable (I have a long torso and the Airbus on the way there didn't fit me).

I've only ever flown a short hop on one (Van to Calgary)  Seemed decent enough ( I was flying on points in Business so seat comfort and pitch wasn't an issue)  but I do agree with the criticisms about how cramped the toilets are.

I guess if the FAA doesn't consider this overheating of the deicing system dangerous enough to ground 737 MAX 8s or 9s maybe it's not unreasonable for Boeing to want to introduce the 7 to service with the same potential issue?   :-\  I do worry a little about pilots having to remember to turn it off after a certain time without any kind of timer or automated warning reminder. Icing conditions are often during climb out after takeoff or descent before landing when pilots are at their busiest.

Having that plug blow out in flight certainly does raise some questions.  I guess the big question is was this a one off assembly error or a design issue in all non high seating density 737MAX's that have this extra emergency exit plugged? This aircraft is only three months old so if it was a design flaw you would think it would have occurred on older air craft before now.

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2024, 11:17:45 am »
Well they’ll likely get grounded again if another blows apart. At the very least the entire fleet with this cutout needs a thorough inspection.

Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2024, 11:28:42 am »
Yes, it will be interesting to see of the FAA orders inspections of all 737 MAX of this type and/or if other airlines do it voluntarily. I expect we'll hear more in the next 24-48 hours. In the meantime I think if I was flying in the next couple of days I'd want to know what equipment was operating my flight.  :-\

From Seattle Times....

"The neat rectangular hole that appeared in the fuselage was located at the position where Boeing fits a plug to seal a door opening that is not used as a door by most airlines and by no U.S. carriers.

An emergency exit door is installed in that location only for jets going to low-cost carriers like Ryanair who cram in additional seats that require an extra emergency exit. Otherwise, the hole is sealed with a plug and from the inside it is covered by a sidewall so that to a passenger it looks like a normal window, not a door opening.

This plug, halfway between the over-wing exit and the door at the rear of the plane, is present only on the largest versions of the 737.

It’s fitted on the previous generation 737-900ER and the same design is on the 737 MAX 8-200, the high density version for low-cost carriers, as well as the MAX 9 and MAX 10.

It is not present on the MAX 7 or MAX 8."



Westjet flies 9's I think. AC's fleet looks to be all MAX 8's
« Last Edit: January 06, 2024, 11:34:00 am by sailor723 »

Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2024, 02:00:52 pm »
Just see now that the FAA has grounded 737 MAX 9's ( same model as Alaska Airlines plane that had the blowout)

I think Westjet flies 9's  (or at least has them on order)

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-67903655

Edit  They grounded those 9's that have the extra emergency exit cutout that has been plugged.....171 aircraft. They can be flown again after inspection.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2024, 10:14:38 am by sailor723 »

Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2024, 08:26:24 am »
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/loose-bolts-boeing-737-max-9-jets-united-airlines-1.7077787

Sounds like Boeing may still be having quality control issues on the assembly line. Annoying for a car but scary at 30,000 feet.

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2024, 08:34:17 am »
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/loose-bolts-boeing-737-max-9-jets-united-airlines-1.7077787

Sounds like Boeing may still be having quality control issues on the assembly line. Annoying for a car but scary at 30,000 feet.

More than scary, can be deadly.

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2024, 09:24:19 am »
Updates on Grounding of Boeing 737 MAX 9 Aircraft

Quote
The FAA’s priority is always keeping Americans safe. In that spirit, Boeing 737-9 aircraft will remain grounded until operators complete enhanced inspections which include both left and right cabin door exit plugs, door components, and fasteners. Operators must also complete corrective action requirements based on findings from the inspections prior to bringing any aircraft back into service.

https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/updates-grounding-boeing-737-max-9-aircraft

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2024, 09:29:29 am »
I think it was PJ O'Rourke, who said, when looking at a particularly rough bit of casting in the Soviet made Vietnam airlines aircraft he was flying in:
 'I wonder what the turbine bearings look like?'

Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2024, 09:40:46 am »
I think it was PJ O'Rourke, who said, when looking at a particularly rough bit of casting in the Soviet made Vietnam airlines aircraft he was flying in:
 'I wonder what the turbine bearings look like?'

Yep, it's often the parts you can't see that matter. (and can sometimes kill you!)

Offline erich

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2024, 01:08:24 pm »
It was the cargo door issue on the DC-10 that contributed to the downfall of McDonnell Douglas

Offline ktm525

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2024, 01:16:25 pm »
It was the cargo door issue on the DC-10 that contributed to the downfall of McDonnell Douglas

Well that and engines falling off. Yeah stupid design that had doors open outward rather than inward.


Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2024, 06:33:12 am »
The whole "contracting out to cut costs" thing is worrying. I've read criticism of Boeing that suggested they have gone from being a company  run by engineers and driven by engineering to one driven by bean counters and cost controls. If true, that doesn't give you a warm fuzzy feeling when boarding one of their aircraft.  :-[

More issues    Recently on CNN.... https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/04/business/boeing-737-max-holes-hnk-intl/index.html
« Last Edit: February 07, 2024, 06:57:20 am by sailor723 »

Offline rrocket

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2024, 06:49:19 am »
The whole "contracting out to cut costs" thing is worrying. I've read criticism of Boeing that suggested they have gone from being a company  run by engineers and driven by engineering to one driven by bean counters and cost controls. If true, that doesn't give you a warm fuzzy feeling when boarding one of their aircraft.  :-[
Yea, I saw a documentary on Netflix (I think) where employees were articulating your point VERY loudly. These weren't Negative Nancies. These were people saying "someone is going to die because of this". And these were the people that really knew the company.

Scary.

They then moved the headquarters from Seattle to Chicago which separated the executives even further from the culture that built Boeing.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2024, 06:54:16 am by rrocket »
How fast is my 911?  Supras sh*t on on me all the time...in reverse..with blown turbos  :( ...

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2024, 10:39:04 am »
And focused more on share prices then building great planes

Some of it seemed to be a consequence of Boeing taking over McDonnell-Douglas, as somehow those execs managed to take over Boeing instead:

https://qz.com/1776080/how-the-mcdonnell-douglas-boeing-merger-led-to-the-737-max-crisis

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2024, 01:33:20 am »
Spotted this on Flightradar24 around 12:30 am, Monday.  Sunwing flight diverted to Winnipeg.

Plane issue or passenger issue?
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Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2024, 06:50:45 am »
Spotted this on Flightradar24 around 12:30 am, Monday.  Sunwing flight diverted to Winnipeg.

Plane issue or passenger issue?

Hard to say.....possibilities include aircraft issues, medical emergency onboard, destination weather or a passenger misbehaving. These sun destination charter flights can be pretty boozy.
It would be interesting to see if there is anything in the local Winnipeg media in the next day or so.

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Offline sailor723

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Re: 737 MAX in the news again
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2024, 12:00:55 pm »
And focused more on share prices then building great planes

Some of it seemed to be a consequence of Boeing taking over McDonnell-Douglas, as somehow those execs managed to take over Boeing instead:

https://qz.com/1776080/how-the-mcdonnell-douglas-boeing-merger-led-to-the-737-max-crisis

I've also read that some of the hotshot MBA's who drove GE into the ground ended up in Boeing senior management.

https://www.managerism.org/images/Thinkpiece38-Boeing-Part2.pdf