Topic: Quick Spin: 2012 Chevrolet Silverado 2500

[Autos_Editor]

This is more truck than anyone needs for household chores, and is due for an update in the near future.

Read More...

[Northernridge]

Good review from an impressions point of view but to omit a towing hauling assessment really makes these HD truck reviews pointless. You guys do a nice job of reporting fuel mileage on your testers – HD truck drivers are very interested in loaded/unloaded/towing mileage. Autos.ca should bring the same rigour to trucks. Perhaps you can recruit a truck guy who can write??

On another note HD trucks have gotten spendy.

[Fobroader]

Good review, this is my favorite HD truck, especially after seeing a diesel power mag review in which they said the engine brake in the Silvy soundly trounced the F350 it went up against. I have a 3/4 ton one of these from 2006, but its a gas, the fuel mileage is atrocious, but for hauling a trailer, its the only way to fly. The truck is absolutely stable in any crosswinds, rain or gravel road Ive been on. My buddy, which I go camping with, has a trailer that weighs a little bit less than ours and he uses an Avalanche to tow with. Hes had countless pucker moments while our rig has been arrow straight. For hauling heavy things, you cant beat them, where I have time and time again put my old 1/2 ton on the bumpstops, the 3/4 is great, gravel, concrete blocks, a whole deck package....I have yet to take it to its limits. They are definetly not a truck for everyone, but the 4 doors are great, it will seat 5 people comfortably and while Merc S class owners wont mistake being in one over their own cars, these new trucks are very quiet and comfortable for what they are. A freind of mine has a 2012 Denali H.D., if you need a heavy duty truck and can swing it, get a Denali, its a beautiful truck.

[Soram6275]

I like this truck, but was surprised the mileage from the diesel wasn't a little better...

[timelynoise]

"On the road, the 2500 HD is incredibly quite inside. "

"What? I can't hear you! This 2500 HD is quite noisy." 

[wing]

lol

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

[X-Traction]

These huge pickups, in 2wd, are as clumsy as beached whales.  At considerable cost in money and hardware 4wd makes them better, but they're still fairly useless in slippery/snowy conditions.  Last winter I had to use our Suzuki Grand Vitara to tow one of these Chev 4x4 extended cabs out of a snow-filled ditch where it had stranded itself. Bent my rear tow loop doing it.  These pickups are awfully heavy.

[Fobroader]

These huge pickups, in 2wd, are as clumsy as beached whales.  At considerable cost in money and hardware 4wd makes them better, but they're still fairly useless in slippery/snowy conditions.  Last winter I had to use our Suzuki Grand Vitara to tow one of these Chev 4x4 extended cabs out of a snow-filled ditch where it had stranded itself. Bent my rear tow loop doing it.  These pickups are awfully heavy.

Thats a driver failure, my truck with good tires, a rear LSD and long wheelbase is excellent on ice and snow.

[Northernridge]

These huge pickups, in 2wd, are as clumsy as beached whales.  At considerable cost in money and hardware 4wd makes them better, but they're still fairly useless in slippery/snowy conditions.  Last winter I had to use our Suzuki Grand Vitara to tow one of these Chev 4x4 extended cabs out of a snow-filled ditch where it had stranded itself. Bent my rear tow loop doing it.  These pickups are awfully heavy.

Good on you for helping a stranded driver but you are naive about trucks in winter conditions. With winter tires trucks are excellent in icy and snow conditions and better than everything else in deep snow. Truck drivers get over-confident and wind up in trouble but that's really a dumb-ass driver issue. 2-wheel drive trucks with a little ballast are just fine...especially these days with limited slip and ESP.

I've been driving pickup trucks for years and probably have extracted a half dozen ditched vehicles a year in the rural area where I live. I keep a farm grade recovery strap and have used the front tow hooks, and trailer hitch...nothing ever bends. I have learned to ask the other driver to hook up the strap to his own vehicle though.

[Snowman]

These huge pickups, in 2wd, are as clumsy as beached whales.  At considerable cost in money and hardware 4wd makes them better, but they're still fairly useless in slippery/snowy conditions.  Last winter I had to use our Suzuki Grand Vitara to tow one of these Chev 4x4 extended cabs out of a snow-filled ditch where it had stranded itself. Bent my rear tow loop doing it.  These pickups are awfully heavy.

Good on you for helping a stranded driver but you are naive about trucks in winter conditions. With winter tires trucks are excellent in icy and snow conditions and better than everything else in deep snow. Truck drivers get over-confident and wind up in trouble but that's really a dumb-ass driver issue. 2-wheel drive trucks with a little ballast are just fine...especially these days with limited slip and ESP.

I've been driving pickup trucks for years and probably have extracted a half dozen ditched vehicles a year in the rural area where I live. I keep a farm grade recovery strap and have used the front tow hooks, and trailer hitch...nothing ever bends. I have learned to ask the other driver to hook up the strap to his own vehicle though.

  Well said. I have owned and driven many trucks winter tires and they are great in the winter especially with the ground clearance advantage. Some people confuse driver error with vehicle limitations 

[X-Traction]

So what you folks are claiming is that vehicles with far more weight on the front end than on the back inherently handle as well as vehicles with evenly distributed weight.  Since the latter characteristic is cited as a much-vaunted characteristic of the best-handling cars, I'm calling a bs.

In the places I go in the winter, 4wd pickups are disproportionately represented among those stuck and in the ditches.  (2wd pickups don't even reach these places.)  Does this mean pickup drivers are less competent?

nothing ever bends

You may not have extracted anything weighing more than twice as much as your vehicle either.  I will admit the Grand Vitara's rear tow loop was not designed to be used for this.  I got a new replacement for free, though.

As for deep snow, any vehicle with good traction will simply plow it out of the way, leaving only the depth of the underbody clearance to drive through.  In this sense, a higher vehicle may well not do better, since it ends up having deeper snow to drive through.  I've driven the Vitara through heavy damp snow as high as the tops of the tires, and pushing onto the hood.  Likewise up steep hills using chains.

[Fobroader]

No one is saying they are the cats ass, its just that driven competently they will do just as good or better than anything on the road on ice and snow. On a snowy day in Edmonton we will have a great crosection of vehicles in the ditch, cars, suvs and trucks all hit the ditch with scary, scary frequency. Having owned trucks for a while, give my my truck with a nice, aggresive and siped all terrain tire and I garauntee Ill make it farther than your Grand Vitara in deep snow. I have more power, more ground clearance and wider tires, so deep snow I have you beat. On ice, I have more weight and a longer wheelbase, so mine is more stable. The biggest thing is, you could give a bad driver a Dakar vehicle with studded tires and they will still put it into the ditch because they are stupid.

[X-Traction]

No one is saying they are the cats ass, its just that driven competently they will do just as good or better than anything on the road on ice and snow.

You seem to have entirely missed the point about weight distribution.  I'll try again.

IF, as universally claimed for fancy sports cars, an even weight distribution on the wheels is a GOOD THING, then the poor weight distribution of every pickup truck simply puts them at a inherent disadvantage.  ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL, they simply cannot handle as well as better balanced vehicles.  Case dismissed.

On a snowy day in Edmonton we will have a great crosection of vehicles in the ditch, cars, suvs and trucks all hit the ditch with scary, scary frequency. Having owned trucks for a while, give my my truck with a nice, aggresive and siped all terrain tire and I garauntee Ill make it farther than your Grand Vitara in deep snow. I have more power, more ground clearance and wider tires, so deep snow I have you beat. On ice, I have more weight and a longer wheelbase, so mine is more stable. The biggest thing is, you could give a bad driver a Dakar vehicle with studded tires and they will still put it into the ditch because they are stupid.

You may have done well in these conditions, but I don't find your arguments convincing.  For instance, you cite wide tires as an advantage on ice and in snow, yet rally drivers choose narrow tires for ice and snow. 

Yes, extremely wide tires can allow a vehicle to "float" on top of hard snow, but it has to be like concrete to support a heavy pickup.

So the pickup has oodles of power.  It also weighs an awful lot more.  And power isn't necessarily an advantage in slippery conditions.  And if it is an advantage, the Vitara's low range makes up for any difference remaining.  I already explained why more clearance probably is a disadvantage in snow deep enough for the vehicle to be plowing through it.  Modern vehicles with curved noses like the Vitara push snow to the sides rather than go over it.

[Ex-airbalancer]

Ok, this getting stupid now
The 2500  is made mostly for work
Carrying extra fuel to fill construction equipment ,  carrying a welder, moving a 5th wheel or camper around
Throw a plow on the front of it and it can do move snow

Most people would having 2500 with have some weight in the back so it will even out

[X-Traction]

Ok, this getting stupid now

  Indeed.

The 2500  is made mostly for work
Carrying extra fuel to fill construction equipment ,  carrying a welder, moving a 5th wheel or camper around

Certainly, and I never even implied these trucks weren't good at such things.  I said they are clumsy in snow and on ice because of poor weight distribution.

Throw a plow on the front of it and it can do move snow

Certainly modifications can improve their characterisitics.

Most people would having 2500 with have some weight in the back so it will even out

"Extra weight in the back to even things out" amounts to an admission such pickups are inherently unbalanced and so inevitably have inferior handling in snow and on ice.  Casually stated, of course, to avoid clearly admitting what's been obvious all along and was my point to begin with.  Thanks.

[X-Traction]

Stop embarrassing yourself X-Traction.  These are capable winter performers.

Sure.  If they weren't such pansies, rally car drivers would choose big pickups with huge engines and fat tires for winter racing.

Embarrassed?  It's not me making claims the best vehicles for winter driving have poor weight distribution, ridiculous horsepower and fat tires.

[rrocket]

IF, as universally claimed for fancy sports cars, an even weight distribution on the wheels is a GOOD THING, then the poor weight distribution of every pickup truck simply puts them at a inherent disadvantage.  ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL, they simply cannot handle as well as better balanced vehicles.  Case dismissed.

I disagree.  Just to be sure, I went and checked the weight distribution of several 4x4 pickups to see how "poor" the weight distribution is.  I found a low of 58/42 to a high of 62/38.  At first glance this seems bad.  Until you look at the weight distribution of most FWD cars.  About the same.    The 2012 Camry, which I know is very capable in the winter (for a FWD car) scales in at 61.5/38.5.  Again...about the same as most any 4x4 truck.  And I'm sure you've driven a FWD car in the winter and have gotten along just fine when driven sensibly.  BTW,  neither of these will outhandle a sports car with 50/50..but equipped with good winter tires and driven sanely, they will handle winters just fine.  In general terms, there is no way you can exploit a car's "handling" in the winter anyways.  The limiting factor is not the car/truck's weight distribution, it's the road conditions and tires.

To sum up, I've just established 2 things about the "poor" weight distribution of trucks: 1) They're very similar to FWD cars  2) You were talking out your ass.

Case dismissed.

[Fobroader]

Stop embarrassing yourself X-Traction.  These are capable winter performers.

Sure.  If they weren't such pansies, rally car drivers would choose big pickups with huge engines and fat tires for winter racing.

Embarrassed?  It's not me making claims the best vehicles for winter driving have poor weight distribution, ridiculous horsepower and fat tires.

Because the WRC is littered with Grand Vitaras with bent tow hooks........

[Mike]

This how all Grand Vitaras come from the factory...right...right?

[Fobroader]

This how all Grand Vitaras come from the factory...right...right?

Apparently why they all do so well on ice.