Topic: Engine With 9,100 kms on it Seizes 7km After Oil Change

[calvingw]

Hopefully I found the right place to post.

I bought my first car in November of 2014. It was a 2009 Kia Rio5 with 4,500 kms on the odometer for $10,000, with the warranty period expired . How did it have 4,500 kms says everyone I know? He man I bought it from said his mother, who is in her eighties, only drove the car to the grocery store and back. She had bought the car new for $24,000 in 2009 and was giving up driving in 2014. I called the mechanic who did the pre-buy inspection and he verified that he also had done the maintenance for the old lady over the past 5 years.

April 22, 2015 I bring it in for my first oil change with 9,100 kms on it. No lights are on on the dash and I am not having any problems with it. The oil was getting low and dark so I decided to take it in. No problem getting it changed, they even show me the dipstick after with an appropriate amount and colour of oil on it.

I drive it home, stopping for gas, and later that day I take it out to get food. Less than one kilometer from home I hear a noise on the passenger side of the engine and most of the dash indicators come on, including the oil light. It had been 7 kms since I got the oil changed. I immediately pull over to the side of the road, turn off the car and look under the hood. I check the oil and it seems fine, proper level and colour, but now the engine won't start.

I call the people at the oil change place and one of the managers comes out to the side of the road to look at the car. The engine won't turn over. He can't figure out what is wrong. We boost it with no result. He does not add oil to the car but does check like a dozen times to make sure there is oil, there is. He says if a mechanic signs off that it was their fault they will pay the damages.

I sign up with AMA and have it towed to my house so my girlfriends mechanic can come look at it. He can't find the problem with it either, says to get it towed to Kia. I do and 2 hours and $260 later they tell me it is a seized engine. This is basically where I am at now. Kia tells me it is about $4000 for a new engine  but they have not determined the fault.

Advice? Get a second opinion of fault if they won't say? I don't know anything about this stuff... but I am leaning toward getting the new engine.

Thanks in Advance,
Calvin in Calgary

[Fobroader]

Does the engine turn over, like when you turn the key does it try to start?? Could have snapped the timing belt, that could account for the noise. I dont know enough about Kia engine to tell you if they are interference or not, if they are not, new timing belt and away you go, if it is, then yeah, new engine.

[calvingw]

The engine does not turn over. It tries for half a second just to tease me and then nothing. I personally don't doubt that the engine is seized, but I don't know anything.

[Fobroader]

The engine does not turn over. It tries for half a second just to tease me and then nothing. I personally don't doubt that the engine is seized, but I don't know anything.

Like the starter doesnt turn it over....hmmm.....

[blur911]

The oil was getting low and dark so I decided to take it in. No problem getting it changed, they even show me the dipstick after with an appropriate amount and colour of oil on it.

How low?

How long since it was last changed?  Years maybe?

[calvingw]

I guess it is technically possible that the oil had not been changed in a while. The guy I bought it from said his mother changed to oil several times but that does not mean recently I guess. When I determined it needed to be changed I didn't think it was a huge emergency.

[Fobroader]

I guess it is technically possible that the oil had not been changed in a while. The guy I bought it from said his mother changed to oil several times but that does not mean recently I guess. When I determined it needed to be changed I didn't think it was a huge emergency.

Oh its absolutely an emergency....if the oil gets too dirty it will start blocking passages and bearings will not be properly oiled. Dirty oil is a death sentence to an engine.

[mmret]

If you buy a used car the first thing you should do is get an oil change. There might be some exceptions to this, perhaps if you had dealership service records, but in your case...mistake.

[tortoise]

Well, that really sucks.  Sorry you're going through this.

I would go back to the mechanic that did the maintenance for the lady and ask for copies of the records.  No doubt this will become useful.

[aquadorhj]

Well, that really sucks.  Sorry you're going through this.

I would go back to the mechanic that did the maintenance for the lady and ask for copies of the records.  No doubt this will become useful.

useful for what though?

it's past the warranty.

it was used car, and probably bought with 'as is' clause.

[Fobroader]

Well, that really sucks.  Sorry you're going through this.

I would go back to the mechanic that did the maintenance for the lady and ask for copies of the records.  No doubt this will become useful.

useful for what though?

it's past the warranty.

it was used car, and probably bought with 'as is' clause.

No, usual used car warranty, 30 feet or 30 seconds......

[tortoise]

Because if you can prove the shop that did the oil change screwed things up it would be useful to have documentation that all previous required services had been done.

Only 7km following an oil change cannot be a coincidence.

[Fobroader]

Because if you can prove the shop that did the oil change screwed things up it would be useful to have documentation that all previous required services had been done.

Only 7km following an oil change cannot be a coincidence.

If the oil handn't been changed in a while, draining and putting fresh stuff in might have loosened up some deposits and god knows, blocked the oil pump or something.

[aquadorhj]

yeah, if it was driven so little in the last 5 years, the oil in the engine might oxidized/varnished the inside of the engine....


that's why i go WOT to redline!!! 

[Firm]

Fob could be right about the fresh oil loosening some crap and blocking some passage (s). However, that would be no fault of the oil change shop.

IMO, your best bet is to get all the service records from the old lady's mechanic, hopefully they show that the car had oil changes done at the correct intervals and in line with the Kia requirements. Then take your records to Kia Canada and explain the situation. You'll most likely get some "goodwill" from them in the form of an offer to cover some of the replacement engine costs. At worse they tell you your SOL and your no worse off than you are now.

[Arthur Dent]

Incorrect filter used? Maybe a chunk of the old filter clogged up an oil gallery. Puzzling one.

[calvingw]

Just talked to the man I bought it from. He said the car had one oil change from the dealer and another one or two from a shop. I will try to get the records as it might help my case that it wasn't my fault.

Any advice on getting a second opinion if Kia doesn't know the cause? I might even be able to push the car 500 meters from Northland Kia to Fountain Tire.

[Arthur Dent]

They might have to tear down the engine to determine the cause. There will some cost there I'd assume.

[Slow_lane]

I bought my first car in November of 2014.  I called the mechanic who did the pre-buy inspection and he verified that he also had done the maintenance for the old lady over the past 5 years.

April 22, 2015 I bring it in for my first oil change with 9,100 kms on it. The oil was getting low and dark so I decided to take it in.

Not going to help your situation this time but here are a couple bits of advice for next time.

1) You should not have had car inspected by the seller's mechanic. You should have gone to another one for a completely unbiased assessment of the car.

2) You should have asked to all Mtce records before buying car. Especially because of it's history. This way you would have known timing of last oil change. You could also verify the mileage on car by tracking the records on paper.

3) For a car used under such strange conditions I think it would have been wise to change the oil when you bought the car and not drive it 5 months before waiting.

4) Never let oil get low.

I am not knocking you. First time car buying is tough because you do not have any experience. My first car purchase (a hand painted 69 Toyota Sprint) was so full of mistakes it would make your head spin. I even had my dad with me for advice. He told me (no ....begged me) not to buy the piece of crap but I did not listen and bought it anyway. It was a nightmare.


With regards to getting you car back on the road


Now that damage is done you will have to decide if your going to spend the bucks to get it fixed. Before you go ahead ensure that car in in great shape in every other respect. You do not want to put good money into this car's engine only to find after it needs more work on brakes or suspension. If your tires are shot that is another consideration to take into account.

I would not leave getting engine replace in dealer's hands. It will cost you much more that at at independant shop. Ask around for a good mechanic in your area that is honest and fair. Maybe he can find a used engine from an accidented car to swap out for good price.

Good time to start building a relationship with a shop you can rely on. I found a great mechanic and have stayed with him for everything for over 20 years now.