Topic: Test Drive: 2012 Nissan Leaf SL

[Autos_Editor]

Peter Bleakney suggests the days when an electric car can truly be called 'green' is still "somewhere over the rainbow."

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[Autos_Editor]

The Leaf electric car is a great car to drive at least until its charge starts dropping, says Jil McIntosh.  

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[tpl]

"There are few things more liberating than sailing past a gas station in the all-electric Nissan Leaf, "


There are few things more liberating than going into a gas station and collecting 600+ kilometres of range in 5 minutes or less!


Swapping batteries won't do it...it is probably already too late to get all the manufacturers to agree that all EV batteries be close enough to identical.  IF they are all different then Murphy's umpteenth corollary would state that the battery you need is unavailable.

Superfast charging would work with some new battery technology but I suspect that charging 16KwH in <5 minutes would be deemed far too dangerous for the public to use themselves

Range extenders yes  but we will have to see if one can be made that is much more economical that the Volt is on engine power...I think that is probably quite easy to do at some cost... a 750 cc turbo diesel is probably rather more expensive than a cheapo 2 litre gas engine.

[sailor723]

Interesting to read comments in both reviews about the accuracy of the range display. I think it would be very un-nerving to start out with one range displayed only to have it drop by 50 km after driving 10-20 kms. I realize DTE displays on gas vehicles can vary as well but in that case it's the minor annoyance of a fuel stop. With a car like the Leaf it could result in being stranded when the 100km range displayed when you started out turns out to be only 75.

[JohnM]

This is very early days for all electric vehicles and it is clear that the reviews are being written by people who are steeped in the fossil fuel vehicle paradigm.  One couldn't expect anything else.

However, as time goes on and our culture gets more used to these vehicles and their different set of abilities and limitations, we'll get reports from journalists who regard them as normal.  These journalists won't have to get over the novelty and the fear factor to write a fully balanced report.

The Leaf looks like a great option for a significant number of drivers.  Once companies and public parking facilities introduce charging stations, that number will expand dramatically.

The Leaf demands a different level of awareness and I'm sure that will come to most people in the next decade whether or not they end up driving an electric vehicle.  In any case, the Leaf appears to be better executed that I ever expected at this point in time so my hat goes off to Nissan for having the vision and the guts to produce and market it.

Cheers,
John M.

[JPWhite]

Quite a balanced an factual article.


FYI The display of miles remaining is optimistic, which is well known in the LEAF community as the 'guess-o-meter'. There is an information screen and map easily accessed using the 'little blue button' on the steering wheel that gives two range numbers. The familiar optimistic one and a more conservative number. I always refer to the conservative number when determining my range against miles left on a trip. Have only hot the low battery warning twice in 4 months.

[JohnM]

Tony brings up a lot of good points about the different grid and tax impacts of a move to electric vehicles.  Obviously this requires planning, not something we in Canada, and in Ontario particularly, do well.

As a car the Leaf seems to be a pleasure to drive.  This is a common theme in reviews I've read and it seems that the Leaf can be regarded as a luxury ride in terms of comfort and NVH.  Jill was the only journalist to indicate it was nothing special on the highway or driving around town.  She said it was great while navigating parking lots but then so is a golf cart.

I missed my chance to drive a Leaf last year at the CNE because the lineup was too long.  Pity. 

One thing I don't get is the reference to regenerative braking extending in-town range.  Yes, braking will recover a bit of energy - I think it is in the 20% () efficiency area - but if you have to brake, you also have to accelerate and clearly the effect will be to reduce range compared to a steady speed.

Cheers,
John M.

[JohnM]

To: JP White

Why don't you write a short summary of your experience with the Leaf?  What you were expecting, what you got and how your habits changed.

Love to hear from an actual owner.

Cheers,
John M.

[nlm]

Tony brings up a lot of good points about the different grid and tax impacts of a move to electric vehicles.  Obviously this requires planning, not something we in Canada, and in Ontario particularly, do well.

More accurately, we can plan well but there are far more people interested in sacrificing the long term big picture for what affects them here and now.

Interesting point about lost gas revenue from EV. Another interesting point: in Ontario municipalities that maintain roads and bridges do not see one cent of gas tax revenue from senior governments. Road maintenance is funded from property tax. Hydro/utilities cannot charge fees that do not relate to direct cost recovery so they cannot add a charge for road maintenance or pension fund enhancements or jet airplane purchases.

It's a moot point since there isn't enough lithium or EV annual construction capacity to make such a dent into the marge urban markets. But the article does ask interesting end game scenarios and at least promotes awareness that even electric energy must come from somewhere.

[wing]

The Leaf is nothing really special to drive, it feels like an economy car....  And the high pitch whine can drive you nuts.

[nlm]

From a strictly desktop perspective, for the price of the LEAF and what it brings to the table (and what it also leaves on the table) I would prefer to get a Volt. Test drives and ideally weekly test runs may bear out a different result.

[richink]

No mention here as to what happens to your hydro bill when you plug this thing into your house. Thanks to Doalton McStinky's energy policies in Ontario I've seen a 100% increase in my hydro bill in the last 5 years. With that many batteries stringed together I can't imagine it will be kind, probably similar to your meter spooling up like it's a hot July day with the a/c, the oven and the dryer all going. Bottom line is that electricity isn't cheap in this province and you're still talking an impact on the environment to generate said electricity. Over $31k plus taxes for this slushbox (after the rebates) is preposterous and the range is a joke compared to fuelies.

My money would still be on a decently equipped econobox for under $20k. $10,000 buys a heck of a lot of gas.

The Leaf is a progressive curiosity at best, the vast majority of them to be owned by inner-city socialites and Hollywoof neo-celebritards.

[wing]

Actual cost to charge is probably $3-$4  Not crazy and much less than fuel.

[richink]

Makes sense. I've dug around a little more about this, several sources has the 120v charger sipping 6Kwh for 18 hours to charge this beastie up to give 140 km range give or take.

Off peak is 6.2 cents per Kwh in Ontario, so 6*6.2*18 = 6.70 plus HST per charge, call it give or take 7 bucks.

Your average econobox these days will do about 7L/100km, so let's say about 10 litres to 140 km, or about 12 bucks based on todays roughly $1.20 per litre in SW Ontario; so about $5 more to go the same distance.

Based on $5 per 140km energy/drive cost and a roughly $10k difference in purchase price, you'd have to drive a Leaf just over 280,000 km to derrive any financial benefit, probably marginally lower
considering an electric motor has lesser maintenance requirements, so call it about 250,000 km in annoyingly short 140 km bursts before the 18 hour charge on 120v. The 220v charger will cut down the charging time and will consume relatively less Kwh, but the math will be similar over the long haul.

The environmental impact of generating electricity vs. refining crude to gasoline and then burning it is arguably similar. Bottom line remains, I still don't see any benefit be it cost, performance or environmental.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

The Leaf battery is 24kWhr. Even if it was completely drained, at $0.07/kWhr that would take about $1.68 (24kWhr * 7¢/kWhr) to charge it completely.

And $0.07 a kWhr is very cheap for electricity in Canada. Most jurisdictions are in the 10-11¢ for residential rates with no to little reduction for off peak usage.

Leaf owners are required to buy the 240V charger which greatly reduces charge time.

[Ex-airbalancer]

I do not think that 6.2 includes delivered charges

[richink]

I'll have to look at my last Hydro One raping, but I thought that delivery charges were essentially static.

We could tip the numbers around slightly here and there, but you are still looking at many, many kilometers to offset your massively more expensive vehicle purchase with reduced energy costs.

I'm all for alternative energy sources, when they make sense. The torque off that electric motor must really pin you back in your seat...

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Worst case scenario of 11¢/kWhr still only adds up to $2.64 for a complete charge from completely dead.
Then you can add in no oil or filter changes, no air filter, plugs, plug wires etc etc.

With the rebates in Ontario, a $31k Leaf is about the same as a loaded up Focus. Those of a green mindset could be tempted.

I've pretty much decided that the next car we get will be extended range or possibly pure electric.

[garytam]

I am hopping more and more "green" people will go for the EV, so that the demand of gasoline will drop and will drive down the price

I love driving cars with manual transmission, unless they can come out with a MT EV, I will not buy a EV ....

For the folks out there who do not care much about driving funs, please ditch your automatic gas vehicle and buy EVs ....

if we see 20% of the cars out on the road are EV, price of gasoline will drop a big time   

[Ex-airbalancer]

I am hopping more and more "green" people will go for the EV, so that the demand of gasoline will drop and will drive down the price

I love driving cars with manual transmission, unless they can come out with a MT EV, I will not buy a EV ....

For the folks out there who do not care much about driving funs, please ditch your automatic gas vehicle and buy EVs ....

if we see 20% of the cars out on the road are EV, price of gasoline will drop a big time   

Are you dreaming  they will just close refineries so there is less gas out there