Topic: Post Gasoline Future for Toyota

[Snowman]

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-12-17/toyota-embraces-fuel-cell-cars-for-post-gasoline-future

[Ex-airbalancer]

It may be the future but not in my lifetime

[Guy]

All that water expelled from the exhaust pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

[Noto]

All that water expelled from the exahsut pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

It's water vapour, not like having a hose spraying water out behind each car.  I doubt the amount of water that comes out will be relevant.

[Snowman]

All that water expelled from the exahsut pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

It's water vapour, not like having a hose spraying water out behind each car.  I doubt the amount of water that comes out will be relevant.

The amount at intersections when vehicles are at idle will be an issue. Its a problem with water in our fuel now.

[Guy]

All that water expelled from the exahsut pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

It's water vapour, not like having a hose spraying water out behind each car.  I doubt the amount of water that comes out will be relevant.

I'm referring to the picture in the article. There's a sizable puddle Under the exhaust pipe.

[Noto]

All that water expelled from the exahsut pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

It's water vapour, not like having a hose spraying water out behind each car.  I doubt the amount of water that comes out will be relevant.

I'm referring to the picture in the article. There's a sizable puddle Under the exhaust pipe.

Haven't read the article

[EV Dan]

All that water expelled from the exahsut pipes would make roads slippery like hell in winter??

It's water vapour, not like having a hose spraying water out behind each car.  I doubt the amount of water that comes out will be relevant.

The amount at intersections when vehicles are at idle will be an issue. Its a problem with water in our fuel now.

There will be a lot more water than from an ICE. H2+O=H2O (IIRC) They can collect it in a water tank in cars destined to cold climates, easy enough work around. However if Hydrogen is Toyota's future then either the company is doomed or The Big Fossils will still be running things, until there is nothing left to drill, frack or mine.

[killlereye]

The amount at intersections when vehicles are at idle will be an issue. Its a problem with water in our fuel now.

[G35X]

When I was living in Winnipeg I find it rather fantasy-like as micro ice crystals coming out of
tailpipes and reflecting the sun in the cold morning. Yes, ICE's(gas or diesel) do emit water vapour
(and micro water pellets).

I think Toyota knows something about obtaing H2 cheaply, either as industry byproudct or
as the product of surplus electricity. In Germany there is so much electricity from wind mills and
solar panels flowing into the grid that they started producing H2 from water by electrolysis to
avoid grid runaway.

Anyway, H2 vehicles are EVs after all. Toyota Mirai's fuel cell output is said to be 114kW max., or
about 150HP. If Toyota can make such a high-power cell at a cost and size suitable for a mid-size
car, then why not make a much smaller, say 4kW or so, stationary cell for household use? You can
make your own H2 by reforming natural gas piped into your house at about 60 percent of thermal
efficiency if you utilize the byproduct heat to warm up water for kitchen and bathroom use.
Electricity thus produced can be use to charge EVs such as Tesla, Leaf and some others coming to
the market in the near future reducing overall emission of CO2 compared to conventional ICE vehicles'
thermal efficiency of  just about 25 to 30 percent.

[rrocket]

There will be a lot more water than from an ICE. H2+O=H2O (IIRC) They can collect it in a water tank in cars destined to cold climates, easy enough work around. However if Hydrogen is Toyota's future then either the company is doomed or The Big Fossils will still be running things, until there is nothing left to drill, frack or mine.

Hydrogen is also Honda's plan.  Two large companies like that can make it happen.  But it's the infrastructure that's key.  These companies can make all the hydrogen cars they want.  But if it's too inconvenient to fill up, this is going nowhere.

I think hydrogen is viable.  But I also don't think it's something that will happen in my lifetime.

[Snowman]

Hydrogen will never happen due to the ifrastucture costs. The EV model is far more attractive.

[EV Dan]

Hydrogen will never happen due to the ifrastucture costs. The EV model is far more attractive.

Yep. H2 cars are the new Betamax. More complex, more inconvenient to use and only half the efficiency of a BEV - so unless the hydrogen gas is subsidized too, will be more expensive to run.
Only if a catalyst is discovered that will easily split water to H2 and O under sunlight for example, will H2 cars make sense.