Topic: Snowies for the RAV, 16" for Vancouver Island?

[Trainman]

With the prediction of cold (for here) temps in a couple of weeks, I need to start thinking of snowies for the RAV.  Current size is 225/65R17 on factory alloy's.  We have 16" steel rims from the Sienna that the dealer says will work on the RAV.  This works out to a 225/70R16 for size based on the Miata.net tire size calculator.  Any recommendations for a relatively mild climate?  Biggest hazards will be black ice and wet snow of up to 10-20cm (over that and I doubt we would be driving, at least not in the RAV).

I know what I would buy if we were still in the Interior, but back here on the Coast I am at a bit of a loss.  Wife does not want studs this time around.

Any and all suggestions will be welcomed!

[davidy]

Here are the top 6 finishers as listed by Consumer Reports in the Nov 2012 edition of winter tire reviews:

Michelin Xi3
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Excellent
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Excellent
 Overall: 1st CR rec

Michelin Xi2
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Excellent
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Good
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 2nd CR rec

Hankook I*Cept evo
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Good
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Good
 Hydroplaning: Very Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 3rd CR rec

Pirelli Winter 210 Sottozero Series II
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Fair
 Dry braking: Good
 Wet braking: Good
 Handling: Good
 Hydroplaning: Excellent
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 4th CR rec

Uniroyal Tiger Paw Ice & Snow II
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Very Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Good
 Ride comfort: Good
 Noise: Poor
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 5th CR rec

Bridgestone Blizzak WS70
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Very Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Poor
 Hydroplaning: Good
 Ride comfort: Excellent
 Noise: Good
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 6th CR rec

For Vancouver/Victoria, I would definitely avoid the Xi2 and Xi3. Definitely take a look at the Hankook W310 I*Cept evo....replacement for the W300 Icebear (winter performance).

Plus the other 11 finishers in order:

1. Michelin Xi3(62) * CR recommended
2. Michelin Xi2 (62) * CR rec
3. Hankook I*Cept evo (60) * CR rec
4. Pirellli Winter 210 Sottozero Series II (58) * CR rec
5. Uniroyal Tiger Paw Ice & Snow II (58) * CR rec
6. Bridgestone Blizzak WS70 (58) * CR rec
7. Nokian Hakkapeliitta R (58)
8. Goodyear Ultragrip Ice WRT (58)
9. BF Goodrich Winter Slalom KSI (56)
10. Continental ExtremeWinterContact (56)
11. General Altimax Arctic (56)
12. Hankook Winter I*Pike (54)
13. Falken Espia EPZ (54)
14. Dunlop Graspic DS-3 (54)
15. Yokohama IceGuard IG20 (50)
16. Firestone Winterforce (48)

Dave

[Trainman]

Here are the top 6 finishers as listed by Consumer Reports in the Nov 2012 edition of winter tire reviews:



Hankook I*Cept evo
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Good
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Good
 Hydroplaning: Very Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 3rd CR rec

[EDIT by Trainman: the bold are areas that would apply to the Island, good info thanks]

For Vancouver/Victoria, I would definitely avoid the Xi2 and Xi3. Definitely take a look at the Hankook W310 I*Cept evo....replacement for the W300 Icebear (winter performance).

Plus the other 11 finishers in order:

1. Michelin Xi3(62) * CR recommended
2. Michelin Xi2 (62) * CR rec
3. Hankook I*Cept evo (60) * CR rec
4. Pirellli Winter 210 Sottozero Series II (58) * CR rec
5. Uniroyal Tiger Paw Ice & Snow II (58) * CR rec
6. Bridgestone Blizzak WS70 (58) * CR rec
7. Nokian Hakkapeliitta R (58)
8. Goodyear Ultragrip Ice WRT (58)
9. BF Goodrich Winter Slalom KSI (56)
10. Continental ExtremeWinterContact (56)
11. General Altimax Arctic (56)
12. Hankook Winter I*Pike (54)
13. Falken Espia EPZ (54)
14. Dunlop Graspic DS-3 (54)
15. Yokohama IceGuard IG20 (50)
16. Firestone Winterforce (48)

Dave

Thanks!  I will look for the W310's and see what kind of pricing I can get.

[dirtyjeffer]

i'm actually a bit surprised at the Hancook tire finishing 3rd...judging by its apparent "all roundedness", one would have thought it wouldn't have finished 1st...plus, it's likely somewhat affordable too.

[davidy]

i'm actually a bit surprised at the Hancook tire finishing 3rd...judging by its apparent "all roundedness", one would have thought it wouldn't have finished 1st...plus, it's likely somewhat affordable too.

Weird scoring by CR IMO. Based on the scoring for each category, I would pick the Hankook I*Cept evo as top rated.

I am very surprised that the 11th place by General Altimax Arctic....it placed 2nd in 2009 (right behind the Xi2). I too like the Hankook I*Pike W409 if one quite a bit of highway/freeway driving. In 2009, W409 had a better handling score than the Arctics. The Arctics aren't great on the gas mileage either.

[PJungnitsch]

Probably they weight the 'winter' categories higher than the 'summer' categories. A winter tire that gets you stuck or doesn't stop well on ice isn't much good in winter.

[HeliDriver]

And they also have a "rolling resistance" category, although I don't know how much it counts towards the overall score.

Personally, that's one category that is absolutely, completely, 100% irrelevant to me in making a winter tire purchase decision.

[Jaeger]

And they also have a "rolling resistance" category, although I don't know how much it counts towards the overall score.

Personally, that's one category that is absolutely, completely, 100% irrelevant to me in making a winter tire purchase decision.

It matters to me.  My fuel economy takes major nosedive with the snow tires on.  Next time I'll choose a set that doesn't require as much of a compromise in this area.

[HeliDriver]

^^ Fair enough. I'm not saying the information isn't good to have, just that it would be interesting to know how much weighting that category gets in the overall scoring.

People always seem to get hung up on the rankings, even though there's only a half-dozen point spread from first to eleventh place (for example). Even an eleventh place tire could be the best one for you, given whichever particular categories you find most important.

[davidy]

Here are results for #7 to #16 plus the rankings from 2009:

Nokian Hakkapeliitta R
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Good
 Hydroplaning: Good
 Ride comfort: Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 7th

Goodyear Ultragrip Ice WRT
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Fair
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 8th

BF Goodrich Winter Slalom KSI
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Very Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 9th

Continental ExtremeWinterContact
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Very Good
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Very Good
 Rolling resistance: Poor
 Overall: 10th

General Altimax Arctic
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Good
 Rolling resistance: Fair
 Overall: 11th

Hankook Winter I*Pike W409
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Very Good
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Fair
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 12th

Falken Espia EPZ
 Snow traction: Excellent
 Ice braking: Very Good
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Poor
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Fair
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 13th

Dunlop Graspic DS-3
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Very Good
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Good
 Noise: Good
 Rolling resistance: Very Good
 Overall: 14th

Yokohama IceGuard IG20
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Good
 Dry braking: Poor
 Wet braking: Poor
 Handling: Poor
 Hydroplaning: Fair
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Fair
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 15th

Firestone Winterforce
 Snow traction: Very Good
 Ice braking: Fair
 Dry braking: Fair
 Wet braking: Fair
 Handling: Fair
 Hydroplaning: Excellent
 Ride comfort: Very Good
 Noise: Fair
 Rolling resistance: Good
 Overall: 16th


2009 Consumer Reports on Car Winter Tires

 1. Michelin Xi2 (84) * CR rec
 2. General Altimax Arctic (78) * CR rec
 3. Nokian Hakkapeliitta 5 (78) * CR rec
 4. Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 (76)
 5. Nokian Hakkapeliitta R (74)
 6. Continental ExtremeWinterContact (74)
 7. Bridgestone Blizzak WS-60 (72)
 8. Pirelli Sottozero 210 Series II (70)
 9. Dunlop Graspic DS2 (70)
 10. Hankook Winter I*Pike W409 (70)
 11. Gislaved NordFrost 5 (68)
 12. Toyo Observe G02 Plus (64)
 13. Yokohama Ice Guard IG20 (62)
 14. Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice (62)
 15. Firestone Winterforce (58)
 16. Cooper Weather Master S/T2 (54)
 17. Hankook Icebear W300 (50)

[HeliDriver]

It's interesting to note that the top-rated tire in 2009 scored an 84, while the top score in 2012 was only 62.

Now, it's obvious that CR must have changed their testing procedures or scoring system, but it would sure be nice to know how, exactly.