Author Topic: Manual Transmission Fluid - 06 Pontiac Pursuit (Read 916 times)

RunsinLight · « **on:** October 18, 2011, 06:44:37 pm »

I have posted questions about this in various other places. I wanted to make one post so I can finally get my head around it.

I've been considering getting my transmission fluid (manual) changed. I looked through my owners manual maintenance schedule and couldn't locate any references to changing the transmission fluid for manuals. In another part of the owners manual I came across this

Hydraulic Clutch

The hydraulic cluch linkage in your vehicle is self-adjusting. This system does not have its own reservoir. It receives fluid from the brake master cylinder reservoir.

Am I talking about two different things here? Or is this telling me my car doesn't have a reservoir of its own for transmission fluid?

rrocket · « **Reply #1 on:** October 18, 2011, 06:47:02 pm »

^^Two different things.

Since it's FWD and a manual tranny, the actual front differential is what your manual tranny "reservoir" is. It's more than likely gear oil rather than tranny oil.

RunsinLight · « **Reply #2 on:** October 18, 2011, 07:38:56 pm »

I think I found the section in the owners manual which mentions this. Is this oil something that should be changed after so many KM?

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 06:47:02 pm

^^Two different things.

Since it's FWD and a manual tranny, the actual front differential is what your manual tranny "reservoir" is. It's more than likely gear oil rather than tranny oil.

Gardiner Westbound · « **Reply #3 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:11:54 pm »

Most manufacturers recommend changing manual transmission oil somewhere between 50,000 and 100,000 kilometers to purge metal particle contamination from normal wear on synchronizers, bearings and gears. Refill with the exact fluid the automaker recommends.

The fluid level on most manual transmissions must be checked from underneath the car. Your mechanic should do it while it's on the hoist for a motor oil change. It only takes a minute.

rrocket · « **Reply #4 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:15:22 pm »

Quote from: RunsinLight on October 18, 2011, 07:38:56 pm

I think I found the section in the owners manual which mentions this. Is this oil something that should be changed after so many KM?

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 06:47:02 pm
^^Two different things.

Since it's FWD and a manual tranny, the actual front differential is what your manual tranny "reservoir" is. It's more than likely gear oil rather than tranny oil.

If you want buttery smooth shifts, go to a synthetic, like Royal Purple. The car only holds a couple of quarts. Cheap...and you'll LOVE the new shifting feel.

tpl · « **Reply #5 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:49:35 pm »

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 08:15:22 pm

Quote from: RunsinLight on October 18, 2011, 07:38:56 pm
I think I found the section in the owners manual which mentions this. Is this oil something that should be changed after so many KM?

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 06:47:02 pm
^^Two different things.

Since it's FWD and a manual tranny, the actual front differential is what your manual tranny "reservoir" is. It's more than likely gear oil rather than tranny oil.

If you want buttery smooth shifts, go to a synthetic, like Royal Purple. The car only holds a couple of quarts. Cheap...and you'll LOVE the new shifting feel.

Does this Pontiac share oil between the gearbox and the differential? I imagine it does. If so is Royal purples gearbox oil also a diff oil?

tpl · « **Reply #6 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:53:42 pm »

Quote from: RunsinLight on October 18, 2011, 06:44:37 pm

I have posted questions about this in various other places. I wanted to make one post so I can finally get my head around it.

I've been considering getting my transmission fluid (manual) changed. I looked through my owners manual maintenance schedule and couldn't locate any references to changing the transmission fluid for manuals. In another part of the owners manual I came across this

Hydraulic Clutch

The hydraulic cluch linkage in your vehicle is self-adjusting. This system does not have its own reservoir. It receives fluid from the brake master cylinder reservoir.

Am I talking about two different things here? Or is this telling me my car doesn't have a reservoir of its own for transmission fluid?

As RR said two different things.
The clutch and brake systems are both hydraulic and use brake fluid. To save space in the engine compartment they use a common reservoir for the fluid. Usually DOT3 hydraulic fluid aka brake fluid.

The "transmission fluid" as RR says is probably gear oil and is withing the gearbox and differential gears. There is no connection of any sort to the brake and clutch fluid. The clutch is outside the gearbox. The gearbox/differential has its own drain plug and fill plug

rrocket · « **Reply #7 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:54:50 pm »

Quote from: tpl on October 18, 2011, 08:49:35 pm

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 08:15:22 pm
Quote from: RunsinLight on October 18, 2011, 07:38:56 pm
I think I found the section in the owners manual which mentions this. Is this oil something that should be changed after so many KM?

Quote from: rrocket on October 18, 2011, 06:47:02 pm
^^Two different things.

Since it's FWD and a manual tranny, the actual front differential is what your manual tranny "reservoir" is. It's more than likely gear oil rather than tranny oil.

If you want buttery smooth shifts, go to a synthetic, like Royal Purple. The car only holds a couple of quarts. Cheap...and you'll LOVE the new shifting feel.
Does this Pontiac share oil between the gearbox and the differential? I imagine it does. If so is Royal purples gearbox oil also a diff oil?

They make them both. Some manuals actually use a manual fluid, and some use a gear oil. They have both. Just need to find out what he's currently using to cross reference.

maritime_storm · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2011, 05:34:00 am »

Actually it uses the "new" GM Manual Transmission Fluid,which is also known as Dexron III with a Type H specification.

tpl · « **Reply #9 on:** October 21, 2011, 06:04:39 am »

Quote from: maritime_storm on October 21, 2011, 05:34:00 am

Actually it uses the "new" GM Manual Transmission Fluid,which is also known as Dexron III with a Type H specification.

That is totally confusing. I just looked up Wikipedia on Dexron III. I hope this stuff is not labeled Dexron III

RunsinLight · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2011, 10:08:49 am »

I'm certainly going to look into this and possibly use the royal purple. Thanks for the tips everyone!

No H2O · « **Reply #11 on:** October 22, 2011, 08:37:58 pm »

Quote from: tpl on October 21, 2011, 06:04:39 am

Quote from: maritime_storm on October 21, 2011, 05:34:00 am
Actually it uses the "new" GM Manual Transmission Fluid,which is also known as Dexron III with a Type H specification.
That is totally confusing. I just looked up Wikipedia on Dexron III. I hope this stuff is not labeled Dexron III

The manual transmission in my BMW E36 was factory filled with ATF. One would think, ATF in a manual transmission?

Sure enough, it has a lot of advantages.

maritime_storm · « **Reply #12 on:** October 25, 2011, 05:51:45 am »

My 2003 ION2 has the same Getrag transaxle as his Pursuit, originally it called for DexronIII with a type H specification. In 2005 GM let the patent for Dexron III expire(Ford did the same later that year) and now calls for it's "new" GM Manual Transmission fluid which is the same stuff in a different bottle. My 2009 Ranger also calls for ATF(MerconV in this case) in the M5OD-R1HD transmission it has.

tpl · « **Reply #13 on:** October 25, 2011, 06:22:23 am »

My concern with labelling was that someone would be bound to pick up a bottle labelled Dexron III and then put it in a newer auto trans.

My E46 had BMW synthetic Gearbox oil in the MT which might have been ATF for all I know. ATF ( of all kinds)must be a satisfactory gear lubricant or many auto trans would die with dead gears and/or the filters fullof high grade metal dust from the cogs.

Gardiner Westbound · « **Reply #14 on:** October 25, 2011, 07:14:17 am »

Quote from: tpl on October 25, 2011, 06:22:23 am

My concern with labelling was that someone would be bound to pick up a bottle labelled Dexron III and then put it in a newer auto trans.

My E46 had BMW synthetic Gearbox oil in the MT which might have been ATF for all I know. ATF ( of all kinds)must be a satisfactory gear lubricant or many auto trans would die with dead gears and/or the filters fullof high grade metal dust from the cogs.

I don't mess with transmission fluid because there is a real risk a well intentioned ATF change will be bungled. Transmission fluid is strictly car make and model specific. It must adhere precisely to the automaker's formula. The manufacturer's branded ATF is best. I change it only if I have good reason to believe it may have been overheated, contaminated or the carmaker specifically calls for it.

On the rare occasions the ATF requires topping up or changing I take it to a same brand car dealer or an approved transmission shop. Ideally it will be looked after by a certified automatic transmission technician with the specialized tools and exact fluid the automaker stipulates.

Franchised lube, repair and tire shops are notorious for putting multi-vehicle ATF into cars, or whatever is on the shelf. Very bad idea!

No H2O · « **Reply #15 on:** October 25, 2011, 10:54:57 am »

Quote from: tpl on October 25, 2011, 06:22:23 am

My E46 had BMW synthetic Gearbox oil in the MT which might have been ATF for all I know.

TPL, I just changed the gear oil in the Honda CR-V and used the recommended Honda Manual Transmission Fluid.

There is no way that fluid is a 75W-90 that is commonly used in manual transmissions (my Porsche uses that). The Honda MTF poured like a 20 or 30 weight engine oil and I would guess that it is some form of ATF.

blur911 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 25, 2011, 11:03:32 am »

Quote from: No H2O on October 25, 2011, 10:54:57 am

Quote from: tpl on October 25, 2011, 06:22:23 am
My E46 had BMW synthetic Gearbox oil in the MT which might have been ATF for all I know.

TPL, I just changed the gear oil in the Honda CR-V and used the recommended Honda Manual Transmission Fluid.

There is no way that fluid is a 75W-90 that is commonly used in manual transmissions (my Porsche uses that). The Honda MTF poured like a 20 or 30 weight engine oil and I would guess that it is some form of ATF.

You probably already know this, but the viscosity ratings of gear oil and motor oil are not the same. 75w-90 gear oil is similar to 10w-40 motor oil if you pour them.

tpl · « **Reply #17 on:** October 25, 2011, 11:19:52 am »

I know this but I must admit I do not know the details of the differences between engine and gear oil excpt that gear oil has more resistance to its molecules being torn to pieces by sliding friction as in helical gears mating.

No H2O · « **Reply #18 on:** October 25, 2011, 11:45:17 am »

Quote from: blur911 on October 25, 2011, 11:03:32 am

You probably already know this, but the viscosity ratings of gear oil and motor oil are not the same. 75w-90 gear oil is similar to 10w-40 motor oil if you pour them.

I do. In fact the number in different viscosity engine oils doesn't even relate to the same temperature...go figure. That never made sense to me.

Whatever the number, the Honda MTF is far less viscous than the 75W-90...no comparison.

Correct me if I am wrong, but ATF has very good high pressure properties and low foaming properties.

RunsinLight · « **Reply #19 on:** November 06, 2011, 07:39:59 pm »

Recently I asked my dealership what they charge for transmission fluid changes. His first question was, "Is it a manual? If its manual you don’t need to change it he said. We just top it up when you come in for an oil change."

When ever a dealer (especially one that up sells at the service bay) essentially tells, “Hi we don't want your money” I have a tenancy to believe them.

Will changing my transmission fluid be beneficial for a vehicle I hope to keep for a long time?