Topic: I got my first speeding ticket today

[carcrazy]

First speeding ticket (or traffic ticket) in 11 yearsa of driving in Canada.
85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.
Any advice for my  court apearance?

[rrocket]

First speeding ticket (or traffic ticket) in 11 yearsa of driving in Canada.
85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.
Any advice for my  court apearance?

Court appearance?  For what?  To fight it?

[carcrazy]

First speeding ticket (or traffic ticket) in 11 yearsa of driving in Canada.
85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.
Any advice for my  court apearance?

Court appearance? For what?  To fight it?

I guess ...

[johngenx]

Laser?  If so, forget it.  You're wasting time fighting it.  It's speed gospel.  Radar?  Still screwed.  Modern radar is accepted as 100% evidence, though you could try to refute it.

[Cord]

Most people show up not to fight the ticket but to plead to a lesser infraction which means less money and fewer points. Most prosecutors happily do this to spare the court system from a trial.

[farleywilbur]

First speeding ticket (or traffic ticket) in 11 yearsa of driving in Canada.
85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.
Any advice for my  court apearance?

Uhh... so you were doing 85?  If so, you were doing more than 40% over the posted limit.  

[carcrazy]

No idea what type of device they use in Toronto.
I believe they have arbtrators before reaching the Court.
At least this is what the cop had suggested and my FIL said something similar from a recent occurence.
I was wondering if anyone had a recent experience with Toronto Police.

[carcrazy]

Most people show up not to fight the ticket but to plead to a lesser infraction which means less money and fewer points. Most prosecutors happily do this to spare the court system from a trial.

Yes. This is what the cop said: lower fine and no points.

[No H2O]

The cops were out for the loot.

I've stated this before, but if it isn't about the money, why doesn't the city, municipality or province let me make out the fine to a charity of my choice or worthwhile organization. I'm still out the money.

No reason for enforcement in the area.

I hardly ever see them in any area where it matters. Why don't they get off their butts and nail cell phone yappers.

[carcrazy]

First speeding ticket (or traffic ticket) in 11 yearsa of driving in Canada.
85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.
Any advice for my  court apearance?

Uhh... so you were doing 85?  If so, you were doing more than 40% over the posted limit.  

I've seen no proof so I can't say. This is what the cop said and wrote on the ticket, but this is another story.

[rrocket]

I've seen no proof so I can't say. This is what the cop said and wrote on the ticket, but this is another story.

So are you saying you had no idea what speed you were traveling at??

[quadzilla]

85 in a 60 zone.  The cops were out for the loot. No reason for enforcement in the area.

Well apparently there are still people speeding in that area so they are they to make more money.

Remember, pleading down is still an offense and counts against your insurance. Good luck.

[dr_spock]

What speed were you really going at?   Was there a sign indicating 60 before you entered the ticket zone?  If you don't know, then it'll be hard to contest that the officer was incorrect in charging you with speeding.  Did the cop write a lower speed on the ticket than you were actually travelling? 

[AP]

Plead not guilty and request disclosure of the officer's notes from the prosector's office so that you can make full answer and defence.  You are constitutionally entitled to disclosure pursuant to Supreme Court of Canada jurisprudence.  If they do not comply (which they may not), show up at the assigned court date and (if the officer shows up) ask for a stay of proceedings on the ground that you were never given disclosure. 

If you receive disclosure and the officer shows up, ask the prosecutor to amend the certificate for a lesser offence.  Alternatively, you could have a trial and waste court time just to spite the system.  You will likely lose b/c justices of the peace (many of whom do not have law degrees, by the way) apparently believe traffic police are incapable of error.

...or take it up the tailpipe and just pay the ticket...

[Sir Osis of Liver]

Plead not guilty and request disclosure of the officer's notes from the prosector's office so that you can make full answer and defence.  You are constitutionally entitled to disclosure pursuant to Supreme Court of Canada jurisprudence.  If they do not comply (which they may not), show up at the assigned court date and (if the officer shows up) ask for a stay of proceedings on the ground that you were never given disclosure. 

If you receive disclosure and the officer shows up, ask the prosecutor to amend the certificate for a lesser offence.  Alternatively, you could have a trial and waste court time just to spite the system.  You will likely lose b/c justices of the peace (many of whom do not have law degrees, by the way) apparently believe traffic police are incapable of error.

...or take it up the tailpipe and just pay the ticket...

This is why court costs should be assessed over and above whatever the fine was, if found guilty of course. Take responsibility for your actions and pay the damned fine if you were speeding.

[mmret]

^ which would be fine if

1. the insurance system were "well designed"
2. speed limits were realistic

IMHO neither 1 nor 2 holds. So, while I understand that two (or three) wrongs don't make a right, I have sympathy here. Its a system. Its a game. Play. There's no room for morals.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

^ which would be fine if

1. the insurance system were "well designed"
2. speed limits were realistic

IMHO neither 1 nor 2 holds. So, while I understand that two (or three) wrongs don't make a right, I have sympathy here. Its a system. Its a game. Play. There's no room for morals.

Both of those can be fixed if society agrees that they are a problem. A number of provinces have reformed their insurance systems, and other jurisdictions have higher speed limits. Until Ontario gets it's together and changes their regulations, the rules are what the rules are. You don't get to choose the rules you are willing to follow.

[articsteve]

Until Ontario gets it's  together and changes their regulations, the rules are what the rules are. You don't get to choose the rules you are willing to follow.

Does that morsel of wisdom apply to the Libyans. 

[quadzilla]

^ which would be fine if

1. the insurance system were "well designed"
2. speed limits were realistic

IMHO neither 1 nor 2 holds. So, while I understand that two (or three) wrongs don't make a right, I have sympathy here. Its a system. Its a game. Play. There's no room for morals.

I'm thinking since he was in a 60kph zone this happened in the city which means the speed limit here was reasonable. I'm also thinking it was one of the regular speed traps that are setup around the city. Maybe the OP could say where this happened?

Just because people don't think the limits are realistic doesn't make it right to speed. If you get caught, pay up. Otherwise, don't speed.

I don't think I should have to stop at all the stop signs in my neighborhood, does that mean I can just roll through all of them?

[2latecrew]

At first I was going to say: If you were speeding buck up and take the consequences..but its really not that simple.

If the rules were iron clad..lidar proven speed results in everyone getting the same fines and consequences then that would make sense. But the system is set up such that you can plea to a lesser charge and get less or even show up in court..the officer does not and you get off.

The rules are "fluid" The guy behind you caught doing 85 in a 60 zone might end up with a smaller fine or even getting off simply because he works within the system. Being the person who DOESN"T take advantage of all the opportunities the system presents really doesn't make one any better of a person or any better off.

I agree that one should not drive 85 in a 60 zone. I would not intentionally do that (although I'm not going to say I never exceed any posted speed limits)