Topic: Run flats for winter tires?

[slybry]

I am buying a new 2011 BMW 328 Xdrive Classic. I am supposed to get it early next week. I believe it comes equipped with Continental run flat tires. 205/55/16.

I am wanting to start searching for a set of dedicated 16 inch wheels/mags and winter tires 2nd hand.

There is a lot of bad comments about run flats. Many of the comments date back a few years. I am wondering if run flats have improved over that time. I suspect by me running 16 inchers the ride won't be too badly affected by stiff sidewalls.

For winter I am wondering if I should get another set of run-flats or go with a regular set of tires. Here are some of my concerns.

1) With regular tires I would have to carry an inflation kit. I have never used one and have no idea how reliable these are when you need them. I have heard the foam in these cans freeze so may not work when you need them. I also have read that once a tire is filled with this sealing foam the tire cannot be serviced. Can anyone recommend a good brand of inflation kit?
2) Run flats are expensive. Do run flats really wear out faster than regular tires?
3) I understand that run flats lets you drive to next service station but after a drive like that with no air the tire is ruined and cannot be repaired. So your forced to purchase a tire on the spot (if you can find one)

I do not know which route to take. Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks

[ovr50]

I have had RFTs on my last 3 BMWs including my current X3 35i. I have not had any problems, but that is anecdotal evidence.

RFTs have improved over the past years, but there are ppl on the BMW forums who hate them, and replace them with GoFlats at the earliest opportunity. Some of them then carry an inflation kit. The con-RFT group cites expense, harsher ride, and wear as reasons to ditch them. The pro-RFT group cites safety, not having to change tire at busy/dangerous location, wear, cars designed for RFTs as reasons to keep them. Only you can decide. I have never felt the need to replace them.

For winters, I go with RFTs as well. On 16" wheels, the RFT sidewall stiffness is less noticable. I would NOT be buying 2nd hand tires, especially RFTs as they may have been patched when they are not supposed to be. I don't RFTs wear any faster than GoFlats, depends on your treatment of the tires. You can go about 100kms on an RFT that has been punctured.

Not a definitive answer, just my sense of what I have heard/experienced over the past few years.

[TopGun]

We've had rfts on our last 2 Minis and think they are really harsh. When the time comes to replace them (and it was my car...which the Mini is not) I would not get them again.

That said, rfts are now I'm their 3rd generation...and if those came with the car, I wouldn't go out of my way to change them.

[normancw]

I went with non-RFTs for both winter and summer.  Switching from the stock Bridgestone RE050A RFTs to Hankook Ventus V12 non-RFTs made a huge difference in ride quality (I have the sport suspension with 18" wheels).

The Continental ContiComfortKit (comes with liquid latex tire sealant) is recommended on BMW forums
http://www.tirerack.com/accessories/detail.jsp?ID=38

I got the almost identical Airman Tire Repair Kit  from Canadian Tire (no longer carried).
http://www.autos.ca/auto-product-reviews/product-review-airman-tire-repair-system

There's also the BMW M Mobility Kit - Emergency Tire Repair and Air Compressor Kit, which is more expensive.
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-1872-bmw-m-mobility-kit-emergency-tire-repair-and-air-compressor-kit.aspx

I bought a set of 17" Rial Salerno alloy rims and Bridgestone Blizzak WS-60 from TireRack for $2K total delivered.


The WS60 has been replaced by the WS70.  I would recommend real (non-RFT) winters like the WS70 or others - the RFT winters I've seen tend to be "performance snow" tires and that's probably not going to be ideal for Montreal winters.

Check this forum for used OEM rims:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=300&order=desc

I have had RFTs on my last 3 BMWs including my current X3 35i. I have not had any problems, but that is anecdotal evidence.

Didn't your M3 have non-RFT tires and come with the BMW M Mobility Kit?  Or have you had 3 or more BMWs since the M3!
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=463157

[sailor723]

We've used Dunlop Wintersport RFT's on the Mini for the last two winters. I went to -1 snows to a set of cheap 16" rims from Tirerack (around $100 each for the rims as I recall). The ride/snow performance has been fine for our winters here in Saint John.

As a side note.... I was interested to see that my new ML came with regular tires and a inflation kit (no room for a spare due to Adblue tank). The sales guy said the first Bluetecs came with RFT's but Benz dropped them after getting a lot of negative feedback from customers.

[capriracer]

Run Flats have improved greatly over the years - as have the suspensions on the cars that come with them.  I guess they've learned how to deal with Run Flats and their peculiarities.

Also, the wear issues on Run Flats are the same issues with all OE tires.  The only problem is that the replacement market hasn't produced a long wearing (and therefore low traction, high rolling resistance) version yet.  They may in time if the size of the market grows.  But winter run flat tires will probably be the same as regular winter tires.

[whaddaiknow]

I am buying a new 2011 BMW 328 Xdrive Classic. I am supposed to get it early next week. I believe it comes equipped with Continental run flat tires. 205/55/16.

Congrats on the new bimmer. You'll love it.
I am going through the same thought process right now, and I am leaning towards RFT's from tirerack, installed with TPMS on 16" wheels. Should be ~$2,000 delivered to my door.

[slybry]

I am buying a new 2011 BMW 328 Xdrive Classic. I am supposed to get it early next week. I believe it comes equipped with Continental run flat tires. 205/55/16.

Congrats on the new bimmer. You'll love it.
I am going through the same thought process right now, and I am leaning towards RFT's from tirerack, installed with TPMS on 16" wheels. Should be ~$2,000 delivered to my door.

I was told that the 328 I am getting has no TPMS sensors in wheels. I was told it work simply with the anti lock braking system measuring the revolutions of the tires. I was please to hear that.

[Bullet Blue]

I use 17 inch Dunlop RFT's on my 128i during the winter and they work decently. Bit harsher ride, but no real complaints with them. For summer I switched to 18 inch non-RFT's Continental's from my RFT Potenza's, mostly because I was able to get an incredible deal on them. Also got an inflation kit just in case, but haven't had the need to use it yet, so I can't comment on the reliability. But if that deal wasn't there, I'd be tempted to go run-flat again so long as you're okay with the harsh ride.

[Julie]

I use RFT on my winter set.

Ovr described the two camps with respect to RFT.  Like him, I have no problem with the runflats (I have 18" for summer and 17" for winter).

RFT are a LOT cheaper online than at the BMW retailer.  I didn't find them much more expensive than non-RFT.

As for tire repair kits, higher line sportier cars like the M3 and Porsche only have repair kits (no spare tire to weigh the car down).

The Continental ContiComfortKit (comes with liquid latex tire sealant) is recommended on BMW forums
http://www.tirerack.com/accessories/detail.jsp?ID=38

I got the almost identical Airman Tire Repair Kit  from Canadian Tire (no longer carried).
http://www.autos.ca/auto-product-reviews/product-review-airman-tire-repair-system

There's also the BMW M Mobility Kit - Emergency Tire Repair and Air Compressor Kit, which is more expensive.
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-1872-bmw-m-mobility-kit-emergency-tire-repair-and-air-compressor-kit.aspx

I bought a set of 17" Rial Salerno alloy rims and Bridgestone Blizzak WS-60 from TireRack for $2K total delivered.

Great advice from normancw on those Rial Salerno's.  They look great and are relatively inexpensive.

[mmret]

I use non RFTs on both sets for the Z4. No spare obviously.

The car came with RFTs but they were truly abysmal. Extreme stiffness and terrifying tram-lining meant they had to go.

I believe the Z4 was not initially designed to use RFTs (talking about the suspension setup here) and it was a last minute decision. Z4Ms come off the lot with non RFTs I think. The more modern BMWs I have driven with RFTs felt fine.

[safristi]

..when they change the Nomenclature to RUN FARTS.... i may squeeze one out...........

[articsteve]

Other than for use in an armoured vehicle, I don't see the point in these.

 

[Car Guy]

Hey slybry, first off, you are going to love that car.  I have a 2007 328xi coupe and a 2011 Mustang GT with the monster 5.0, and every time I drive the Mustang (which is just a blast to drive by the way) I am reminded of just how damn good my 328xi is.  I still love that car 4 years into it and it will be replaced (eventually, not ready to part with it just yet) by another one.

Now, one to your question.  My bimmer came with 17's.  Conti ProContact RFT's.  They are hard as a rock, but gave great grip.  I drove the first winter (Edmonton) with just the Conti's and it was ok, but I wanted the security of true winter's, and you don't have a choice there in Montreal.  Winter's required by law.  I went to a Kal Tire shop and bought a pre-made tire and wheel package that had Michelin x ice 17's, NON rft.  I carry a couple of cans of sealer/inflater AND a small electric air pump that can be plugged into the 12V just in case.  I have not had to use the sealer/inflater in 3 winters now, but I have it just in case.  However, as for the rft's, I was a skeptic UNTIL I picked up screws in both my rear tires.  The leaks were slow so I could use the portable pump to keep the air pressure up (they never went "flat" (as in 0 lbs air) and the fact that they were rft's meant that I could easily continue to drive for the few days that it took to get the new tires orderd and installed.

By the way, my two front Conti's are the originals and I estimate that they have about 50k on them.  They are still not worn out, but I will be replacing all 4 this winter and putting them on the stock rims and back onto the car in spring.

My experince has been that if you don't drive like an idiot, the rft's should give you decent tread life.  As for the winter tires, I went with non rft's and just carry around the appropriate materials to handle a winter flat as best as I can.  Let's face it, a flat tire in winter is a pain, regardless of whether it is a rft or not!!

Good luck and take care of that bmw baby.  It will treat you right in return!

[Julie]

Hey slybry, first off, you are going to love that car.  I have a 2007 328xi coupe and a 2011 Mustang GT with the monster 5.0, and every time I drive the Mustang (which is just a blast to drive by the way) I am reminded of just how damn good my 328xi is.  I still love that car 4 years into it and it will be replaced (eventually, not ready to part with it just yet) by another one.

Now, one to your question.  My bimmer came with 17's.  Conti ProContact RFT's.  They are hard as a rock, but gave great grip.  I drove the first winter (Edmonton) with just the Conti's and it was ok, but I wanted the security of true winter's, and you don't have a choice there in Montreal.  Winter's required by law.  I went to a Kal Tire shop and bought a pre-made tire and wheel package that had Michelin x ice 17's, NON rft.  I carry a couple of cans of sealer/inflater AND a small electric air pump that can be plugged into the 12V just in case.  I have not had to use the sealer/inflater in 3 winters now, but I have it just in case.  However, as for the rft's, I was a skeptic UNTIL I picked up screws in both my rear tires.  The leaks were slow so I could use the portable pump to keep the air pressure up (they never went "flat" (as in 0 lbs air) and the fact that they were rft's meant that I could easily continue to drive for the few days that it took to get the new tires orderd and installed.

By the way, my two front Conti's are the originals and I estimate that they have about 50k on them.  They are still not worn out, but I will be replacing all 4 this winter and putting them on the stock rims and back onto the car in spring.

My experince has been that if you don't drive like an idiot, the rft's should give you decent tread life.  As for the winter tires, I went with non rft's and just carry around the appropriate materials to handle a winter flat as best as I can.  Let's face it, a flat tire in winter is a pain, regardless of whether it is a rft or not!!

Good luck and take care of that bmw baby.  It will treat you right in return!

Welcome Car Guy, and post pics of your cars in a show and shine thread!  I am sure the enthusiasts would love to see both of your cars.