Topic: Why can't we all share the road and play nice?

[quadzilla]

I was able to get in a good amount of cycling over the long weekend and for the most part, many people were very courteous to me by giving me 2-3 feet of space when passing. What I don't understand is those people that don't move over at all and nearly brush me with their mirror.

On Saturday we were riding over to get some take away and had some lady almost hit both my wife and I when there was plenty of space to pass (the oncoming lane was empty) to which I chased down the driver (you need a lot of green lights to beat me in a 40kph zone) and gave her a good earful. I'm thinking from her reaction that she didn't even know what she did, no clue.

Then there are times when I'm riding up/down Bayview which is 4 lanes (2 each way) and the vehicle will not even move over to go around me when every single lane is empty. Is it really that hard to do?

Another spot I was going around a slow tight corner and the lady tried to pass me by using the oncoming lane and had to brake before hitting the center median. Why could she not just wait 10 seconds and then pass me on the straight section. What makes this one worse is there were rail-road tracks that I had to cross which can be deadly for cyclists.

What is wrong with people? I understand there is a huge hate on between bikes, cars and pedestrians but are people that vindictive that they see how close they can come without killing somebody?

Do people just not care or are they really that clueless to what is going on around them?

[johngenx]

No, it's just that most people are a$$holes.

[Dexer]

Cyclists are entitled to as much respect as they earn...which is none.

People understand that cyclists have no respect for the law and no respect for others. They ride on the sidewalk when it's convenient. They never stop at stop signs. They never signal stops or turns. They are a menace.

Cyclists are reaping the rewards of their utter disregard for public safety. We know that cyclists don't care about the rest of us and don't care about the law. Consequently, most drivers have learned not to care about cyclists.

[johngenx]

Generalize much?

[PJungnitsch]

When I cycled to school in the winter I threw on a bright yellow overjacket and vehicles treated me very differently.

It has to be somewhat psychological (it's not like I was invisible without), same color as cops, school zone signs, etc. Seems to punch through the fog in their brains.

[tpl]

Dexer is right about many of the adult cyclists one sees in TO on weekdays, there seems to be a different group on weekends..   Here in Guelph I see the majority are pretty careful and law abiding  AND it appears to me that drivers in G see that and are far more considerate to them.   Just my observations, may be that the students are more lawabiding and are a higher proportion of the cyclists.
I agree with Quad that there are many, many, many self centred drivers in TO who just don't give a about any other vehicle and, if they thought they could get away with it, would probably just run cyclists ( or pedestrians) down if it got them where they are going 1 second faster.

IMHO part of the TO problem is that the Police never ticket cyclists and rarely ticket motorists for offences against cyclists unless someone gets hurt.

[airbalancer]

Cyclists are entitled to as much respect as they earn...which is none.

People understand that cyclists have no respect for the law and no respect for others. They ride on the sidewalk when it's convenient. They never stop at stop signs. They never signal stops or turns. They are a menace.

Cyclists are reaping the rewards of their utter disregard for public safety. We know that cyclists don't care about the rest of us and don't care about the law. Consequently, most drivers have learned not to care about cyclists.

so sad, to be so bitter



On Saturday we were riding over to get some take away and had some lady almost hit both my wife and I when there was plenty of space to pass (the oncoming lane was empty

This would the same person who take up the whole road on a narrow  country road

[quadzilla]

Wow, what an interesting reply from Dexer. At least that tells me what kind of person is out there trying to kill me.

I guess with that kind of thinking I should just plow down every single pedestrian that jay walks, or the people that play badminton or catch on the bike path because they have no respect for anybody else. Or all the dog owners that let Fifi out on a 20 foot leash and runs out in front of me.

Or how about when somebody gives me a door prize maybe I should just pull them out of their car and beat the day lights out of them because they have no respect for anybody else.

For the record Dexer, drivers do everything you think cyclist do. Also, NOT all cyclist ride like that. Sure there are a few bad apples out there but there are many trying to change that image but its people with a closed mind and hate on for anybody else that is not helping times change. I'd like to think we are no longer cavemen.

IMHO part of the TO problem is that the Police never ticket cyclists and rarely ticket motorists for offences against cyclists unless someone gets hurt.

I fully agree with this. People need to be (re) educated about the rules of the road and I mean that for both sides. Even the most simple thing like parking in a bike lane seems to be over looked. Personally, I have no idea why the parking police don't set up next to any Starbucks as fill their quota before 10am since most of those drivers will park just about anywhere to get their morning overpriced java.

[Angry Chicken]

Cyclists are entitled to as much respect as they earn...which is none.

People understand that cyclists have no respect for the law and no respect for others. They ride on the sidewalk when it's convenient. They never stop at stop signs. They never signal stops or turns. They are a menace.

Cyclists are reaping the rewards of their utter disregard for public safety. We know that cyclists don't care about the rest of us and don't care about the law. Consequently, most drivers have learned not to care about cyclists.

You can't be serious?    Sure, and extending that logic, since cyclists are beneath your notice (hopefully not also beneath your wheels!) you have a 007-type license on 'em all.  This has got to be the most clueless, generalistic, and irrational thing I've seen posted on this forum.  At least your honest.  Right??

[Railton]

Cyclists are entitled to as much respect as they earn...which is none.

People understand that cyclists have no respect for the law and no respect for others. They ride on the sidewalk when it's convenient. They never stop at stop signs. They never signal stops or turns. They are a menace.

Cyclists are reaping the rewards of their utter disregard for public safety. We know that cyclists don't care about the rest of us and don't care about the law. Consequently, most drivers have learned not to care about cyclists.

You can't be serious?    Sure, and extending that logic, since cyclists are beneath your notice (hopefully not also beneath your wheels!) you have a 007-type license on 'em all.  This has got to be the most clueless, generalistic, and irrational thing I've seen posted on this forum.  At least your honest.  Right??

With time, all will be revealed.
Railton

[overtakeyouintheleftlane]

Quad, I'm not comfortable cycling in Toronto if it's outisde of a park or bike trail (through parks for eg.). I don't want to take the risk of some driver almost hitting me. Too many close calls. I also show respect to cars/rules of the road as I also drive a car as well.

T.O. drivers are nuts.

Dexer - You have problems.

[dr_spock]

Overtaking and passing rules

Passing meeting vehicles

148.  (1)  Every person in charge of a vehicle on a highway meeting another vehicle shall turn out to the right from the centre of the roadway, allowing the other vehicle one-half of the roadway free. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (1).

Vehicles or equestrians overtaken

(2)  Every person in charge of a vehicle or on horseback on a highway who is overtaken by a vehicle or equestrian travelling at a greater speed shall turn out to the right and allow the overtaking vehicle or equestrian to pass. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (2).

Exception

(3)  Subsections (1) and (2) do not apply to a person in charge of a road service vehicle or a road-building machine or apparatus while the machine or apparatus is engaged in the construction of a highway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (3).

Vehicles meeting bicycles

(4)  Every person in charge of a vehicle on a highway meeting a person travelling on a bicycle shall allow the cyclist sufficient room on the roadway to pass. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (4).

Vehicles or equestrians overtaking others

(5)  Every person in charge of a vehicle or on horseback on a highway who is overtaking another vehicle or equestrian shall turn out to the left so far as may be necessary to avoid a collision with the vehicle or equestrian overtaken, and the person overtaken is not required to leave more than one-half of the roadway free. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (5).

Bicycles overtaken

(6)  Every person on a bicycle or motor assisted bicycle who is overtaken by a vehicle or equestrian travelling at a greater speed shall turn out to the right and allow the vehicle or equestrian to pass and the vehicle or equestrian

[Angry Chicken]

Wait, I don't know where you got your information from, but a group calling themselves, DIATRIBE (Drivers Intent on Attrition and Taking Roadbeds from Idiot Biking Enthusiasts) recently successfully lobbied for an amendment to the Highway Traffic Act.  It now says (in part):

Exception

(3)  Subsections (1) and (2) do not apply to a person in charge of a road service vehicle or a road-building machine or apparatus while the machine or apparatus is engaged in the construction of a highway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (3).

Vehicles meeting bicycles

(4)  Every person in charge of a vehicle on a highway meeting a person travelling on a bicycle shall allow the cyclist sufficient room on the roadway to pass. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (4).

Exception
(4) (a) The vehicle on a highway meeting a person travelling on a bicycle is not required to allow the cyclist sufficient room on the roadway to pass where, in the estimation of the motorist, the bicyclist is: (a) not worthy of such consideration; (b) not also a motorist or otherwise a road tax payer and thus not a contributor to the physical condition or construction of the highway; (c) making rude gestures at the motorist.  R.S.O. 2011 (amended), c. H.8, s. 148 (4).  If any of the above conditions are met, the motorist may feel free to commit vehicular homicide or otherwise make the cyclist's life miserable and dangerous as this is their constitutional right.

Vehicles or equestrians overtaking others

(5)  Every person in charge of a vehicle or on horseback on a highway who is overtaking another vehicle or equestrian shall turn out to the left so far as may be necessary to avoid a collision with the vehicle or equestrian overtaken, and the person overtaken is not required to leave more than one-half of the roadway free. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (5).

Bicycles overtaken

(6)  Every person on a bicycle or motor assisted bicycle who is overtaken by a vehicle or equestrian travelling at a greater speed shall turn out to the right and allow the vehicle or equestrian to pass and the vehicle or equestrian

[tpl]

The above section in red does not apply to attractive female cyclists.

[safristi]

The above section in red does not apply to attractive female cyclists.

 in yer dreams..................polka dot jersey fer U..........Yellow fer me.... ..Saf wins the TOUR de TIGHT PANTS...

[quadzilla]

Coming home after work and I'm not even 2 blocks from my office when this Honda Fit starts to pass me and then decides to turn right with me still beside them.

Lucky for me my spidey senses were tingling and I was able to avoid getting run over. Plus my vocal reflexes were lightning quick to yell out an obscenity which alerted the driver they were starting to run over a cyclist. 

They stopped their turn and ended up in the wrong lane around the corner and thankfully there was nobody there.

I think they knew I was there because they moved over to get around me but then just turned. Horrible attention span, too much sun....who knows but thankfully I escaped another one.

[aaronk]

As a cyclist, I hear ya and know what you're talking about. Consider though that there are also lots of ignorant cyclists. Not saying you are one of them, but I have been witness to cyclists who bang into *stopped cars*, weave through intersections where they clearly don't have a right-of-way, or taking up way too much lane in an 80 km/h zone. This is far from a one-sided story as there are offenders on both sides.

I think the more our cities focus on building infrastructure where cyclists can ride in comfort free from the burden of massive speeding lumps of steel piloted by texting drivers the better. I'm all for segregated bike lanes and cycle path networks. The more people that can ride the better - less congestion, less pollution, saving money, better health...it's all good. The old railways turned into crushed gravel cycle paths is brilliant, many communities (and the Bruce Trail) offer this type of terrain.

As a side note, I hate cycling past parked cars on a busy street. I know how few people think before they open their doors. I have never seen someone get 'doored' in person, but I can imagine it wouldn't be pretty.

[quadzilla]

As a cyclist, I hear ya and know what you're talking about. Consider though that there are also lots of ignorant cyclists. Not saying you are one of them, but I have been witness to cyclists who bang into *stopped cars*, weave through intersections where they clearly don't have a right-of-way, or taking up way too much lane in an 80 km/h zone. This is far from a one-sided story as there are offenders on both sides.

I can't argue any of that and those people me off also.

On the way to work I passed the same guy who ran three red lights. Yes you read that right....I was still able to pass him three times even though he was running some red lights. For the record, I was not pushing hard today due to some sore legs.

Last night while riding out at the Tommy Thompson Spit a group of roadies coming against me thought it was great to break into a sprint 5 wide. What a bunch of asses.

Lady stops her bike in the middle of the bike path, puts it on the kick stand and leaves it there. Seriously? You can't move it 2 feet to the right and get it off the path.

Yep, they all me off. I guess the real problem is common sense isn't so common is it.

[Schmengie]

Do people just not care or are they really that clueless to what is going on around them?

 Both. Everyone seems so wrapped up in their own little worlds they don't see things that are happening right in front of them. There's a 4-way stop on a busy road not far from my house and I see it everyday. One of the roads leading into it is quite steep and I see cyclists racing down it and blasting through the intersection without even slowing down. They expect drivers to look out for them, but they apparently have no such responsiblity themselves. Most of them don't even wear helmets.

 We have clearly marked bike lanes in this town that might as well not be there because so many drivers just ignore them like they do the other rules of the road. Speeding, unsafe turns into the wrong lane, no signalling, running stops signs and lights, it happens all the time. Once I even saw someone in a jacked-up truck drive up over the sidewalk to avoid a stop light with a pedestrian standing right there. Some drivers will do just about anything to get where they're going 10 seconds sooner, and if you get in their way, well, that's too bad for you.

 Pedestrians are no better. They dart out into traffic between parked cars, they ignore stop/walk signals, they walk in the middle of the road despite a sidewalk being there, and they do it all while obliviously texting on their cell phones. Either that, or they've got their iPods on so loud they couldn't hear a train if it was on top of them. I'm so damned busy watching out for everyone else I barely have time to watch out for myself.

[safristi]

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