Author Topic: More bad press for Toyota  (Read 6975 times)

Offline johngenx

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #60 on: March 09, 2010, 11:57:08 pm »
http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682417,00.html

"That's not proof of a flaw in the system, but it does touch on a powerful buzzword. The idea of "runaway engines" is a deeply planted fear in the psyche of American drivers, which makes it difficult to take a rational look at the issue.

No other country in the world has comparable problems with cars accelerating on their own. In the US, though, "sudden unintended acceleration" is a mass phenomenon. It has become the topic of various nonfiction books and online self-help groups -- indicators to those affected that they aren't alone.

NHTSA has received 12,700 complaints of unintended acceleration in the last decade, across the spectrum of brand names. Ford, Chrysler, General Motors, Honda, and nearly every other carmaker have been affected. The causes of the phenomenon are as difficult to track down as are reported UFO sightings -- partly because those affected don't take kindly to doubters."


This is key.  This is why it won't make a lick of difference what Toyota does.  They have become the firm that has finally made it possible for all those thousands of runaway engine people to be vindicated.  They are the lightening rod for the entire industry.
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Offline vdk

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #61 on: March 10, 2010, 12:09:13 am »
How many German cars are automatic vs North America?

Believe it or not Stevie, forensics can still determine that the brakes were cooked even after the car partially burned.

How many people can actually drive in Germany and how many can drive in NA? Presented as a percentage?

Offline micha

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #62 on: March 10, 2010, 12:12:01 am »

Have there been any unintended acceleration cases in majority-Stickshift countries, like England and Germany?


You mean those people who can manage to drive at 250km/h and have the lowest death rates in the civilized world? No.

Yes, there were UA cases:
There were also cases of stuck Toyota gas pedals in Germany. The drivers braked successfully, and notified their car dealerships. None of them met their deaths.
The difference is proper driver's education or maybe just that most Toyota's are MT in Germany.


EDIT: My first post on this site so "Hello" to all. Just thought I mention it.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 12:24:32 am by michaw88 »

Offline articsteve

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #63 on: March 10, 2010, 12:17:02 am »
No other country in the world has comparable problems with cars accelerating on their own. In the US, though, "sudden unintended acceleration" is a mass phenomenon

No other country in the world has a civil legal system like the US where plaintiffs take no financial risks and their lawyers in return take 50 to 66.6% of the award.

The pin head who was driving "the Prius" has already retained a lawyer to sue Toyota.  Even though he had the time and ability to call the cops, weave thru traffic at 90 mph for 30 miles, he needed the cop to tell him to turn off the motor.

ONLY IN AMERICA  :P


U.S. joins Toyota, California in inspecting runaway Prius

Automotive News -- March 9, 2010 - 11:58 am ET
UPDATED: 3/9/10 2:28 p.m. ET
 
LOS ANGELES (Reuters) -- U.S. safety regulators and Toyota Motor Corp. dispatched investigators to San Diego today to inspect a Prius that sped out of control on a California freeway a day earlier.

U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood said two investigators from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration were sent to join a team from the California Highway Patrol "to be part of the investigation."

Toyota said its own inspectors were also working to try to find out what caused the 2008 Prius to surge uncontrollably to over 90 mph as it was being driven by owner James Sikes, 61.

The incident, which involved a dramatic pursuit by a highway patrol car, has raised new questions about the automaker's damaging string of recent recalls and whether Toyota has done enough to address consumer complaints about unintended acceleration that have damaged its reputation and sales.

The Prius was taken to a Toyota dealership in El Cajon, California, where Toyota investigators were examining the car, Toyota spokeswoman Celeste Migliore said.

The Prius has been a "halo" car for the world's top automaker and dominates the market for fuel-efficient gasoline-electric hybrid vehicles.

Sikes said he had received a recall notice to take his car into a Toyota dealership; but when he did, he was told that his car was not on recall lists, he told reporters.

The automaker has recalled the 2004-2009 Prius models due to concerns that loose floor mats could entrap accelerator pedals, causing unintended acceleration.

High-speed drama

On Monday afternoon, Sikes was passing another car on a highway near San Diego when the Prius accelerated out of control, the highway patrol said.

For the next 20 minutes, Sikes sped 30 miles along the freeway, he said.

"I pushed the gas pedal to pass a car and it did something kind of funny," Sikes told reporters. "It jumped and it just stuck there. As it was going, I was trying the brakes ... It wasn't stopping."

Sikes called the local 911 emergency service, and the highway patrol dispatched an officer who pulled alongside the Prius. The trooper used a loudspeaker to tell Sikes to use the emergency and regular brakes and to turn off the car's engine.

Once the Prius slowed to around 50 mph, Sikes turned off the engine of the car and it rolled to a stop with the trooper's car in front of it.

A California Highway Patrol spokesman in San Diego said the cause of the runaway car incident remains under investigation. "We do not have any initial findings at this point," she said.

Toyota has recalled more than 8 million vehicles worldwide for mechanical problems that can cause the accelerator to stick and for the risk that floor mats could trap an accelerator.

Unintended acceleration in the company's Toyota and Lexus vehicles has been linked to at least five U.S. crash deaths since 2007. Authorities are investigating 47 other Toyota crash deaths over the past decade.

Monday's incident, which attracted widespread media coverage, happened in the same Southern California county as a fatal crash in August 2009 that prompted new scrutiny of Toyota's safety record.

In that case, Mark Saylor, an off-duty California Highway Patrol trooper, and three family members were killed when a Lexus ES 350 they were driving sped out of control.

Toyota has said repeatedly that it believes that there is no problem with its electronic throttle control system.

A spokesman for the automaker said Monday that it believed the steps it had taken should address the problems with reported unintended acceleration if repairs were completed properly.
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Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #64 on: March 10, 2010, 12:19:53 am »
Driver training is much better in Germany, which is great, and a complete red herring.

Cars shouldn't go WOT of their own volition.

Automotive News reports that the automaker appears to have had similar issues as far back as 1999, at least in the UK. According to the trade publication, Toyota recalled 10,919 Lexus IS200 models built between March 1999 and July 2000 for a floor mat issue that could lead to sudden acceleration. Now federal investigators are wondering why Toyota didn't spread their recall over to the U.S.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/24/report-toyota-recalled-floor-mats-in-the-uk-ten-years-ago-didn/

Obviously there were issues in Europe as well, just handled differently.


« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 12:35:59 am by Sir Osis of Liver »
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Offline vdk

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #65 on: March 10, 2010, 12:35:08 am »
Since everyone agrees that better driver training is needed in Canada and the US I wonder why no one does anything about it. It would lead to a lower number of accidents, lower insurance rates, lower death rates on our highways. Is there a catch?  ???

Can the public get this kind of thing after the Toyota fiasco? It's desperately needed as we can see.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 12:38:59 am by vdk »

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #66 on: March 10, 2010, 12:37:04 am »
Since everyone agrees that better driver training is needed in Canada and the US I wonder why no one does anything about it. It would lead to a lower number of accidents, lower insurance rates, lower death rates on our highways. Is there a catch?  ???

Yep, the great unwashed don't want to pay for it, and politicians are too gutless to make them.

Offline PJungnitsch

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #67 on: March 10, 2010, 12:37:39 am »
Heh, maybe Germans just have more practice. The highest rates of unintended acceleration per brand in the last two years are VW/Audi.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/nhtsa-data-dive-2-ua-rates-1990-2009-by-manufacturer-updated-with-new-charts/ua-by-make-1990-2009/

On the big surge in Toyota complaints in the last few months, this might be part of the reason:

Anybody can file on-line complaints at NHTSA without a VIN number. Try it. With any car make you hate. Anybody can give a bogus email and a likewise bogus physical address. There is no on-line checking.

Any Toyota hater (and there seems to be a lot on the internet) could file any number of 'complaints'.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/many-nhtsa-complaints-unverifiable/#more-347851

Offline vdk

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #68 on: March 10, 2010, 12:41:37 am »
Since everyone agrees that better driver training is needed in Canada and the US I wonder why no one does anything about it. It would lead to a lower number of accidents, lower insurance rates, lower death rates on our highways. Is there a catch?  ???

Yep, the great unwashed don't want to pay for it, and politicians are too gutless to make them.

And that would be productive progressive. And we all know progressivism is bad.

Offline micha

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #69 on: March 10, 2010, 12:48:00 am »
I guess you would have to start with a basic course. Nobody would be willing to pay the prices people in Germany pay for driver's ed, because people in NA are not used to it. Last price I heard for driver's ed in Germany was 2,000€ and people considered that very cheap compared to other driving schools.

Offline Sir Osis of Liver

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #70 on: March 10, 2010, 12:49:07 am »
Since everyone agrees that better driver training is needed in Canada and the US I wonder why no one does anything about it. It would lead to a lower number of accidents, lower insurance rates, lower death rates on our highways. Is there a catch?  ???

Yep, the great unwashed don't want to pay for it, and politicians are too gutless to make them.


And that would be productive progressive. And we all know progressivism is bad.

Oh definitely! We all know that market forces and social Darwinism will eventually make us better drivers!


Offline dr_spock

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #71 on: March 10, 2010, 02:33:00 am »

How many of us here in NA are taught to drive by our parents versus going through a proper driving school?

Technology can also help make up for the lack of skills. 

Offline Shnak

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #72 on: March 10, 2010, 07:23:33 am »
It's funny, I remembered last night of a sudden unintended acceleration episode that happened to me while driving my dad's Ranger back in around 1999. I was pulling away from our street onto the main street and the revs immediately shot up to the red line. I don't remember exactly, but I'm pretty sure I immediately shut down the engine, pulled over to the side of the road and walked home to get my neighbour who was a mechanic. Turns out there was a small branch stuck between the throttle on top of the engine, preventing it from springing back to its resting position. Yeah, my dad had gone fishing in the woods the night before!

So there, I was the victom of an UA myself!  ;D

Offline slybry

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #73 on: March 10, 2010, 08:29:39 am »
Saw on news yesterday about Prius that accelerated uncontrollably. I suspect this story is just a bunch of BS.

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/03/09/california-prius-freeway.html?ref=rss

- He had was able to call 911 and continue along until cops could respond and catch up to him. How long did that take? 15 or 20 minutes????
- In all this time the 61 year old man never thought of putting car in neutral???? Come on!!!!
- Brakes did not stop the car.
- Reports on news say that police cruiser got in front of Prius and braked to help it stop. Yet I did not see any damage to front bumper. Holly crap. I just look at my bumpers the wrong way and the scratch.
- During an interview the driver stated that he tried to pull the accelerator pedal up by hand. Ah come on :rofl:! A 61 year old going 90 miles an hour can bend down and pull on accelerator pedal. I think he should call Cirque de Soliel as they always can use a good contortionist.

I think this is a bunch of crap. Just someone trying to cash in or get his 15 minutes of fame. The media laps this crap up because they are having a feeding frenzy with Toyota's problems.

This is just getting stupid. I feel sorry to Toyota.
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Offline Shnak

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #74 on: March 10, 2010, 08:39:18 am »
This is just getting stupid. I feel sorry to Toyota.

You shouldn't feel sorry for Toyota... after years of arrogance, being all proud of their impeccable dependability record all while squeezing part makers behind the scenes to lower prices resulting in lower quality, it's all finally caught up with them.

Offline The Mighty Duck

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #75 on: March 10, 2010, 09:04:27 am »
Quote
After the car decelerated to about 80 kilometres an hour, Sikes turned off the engine and coasted to a halt.

I'd like to hear why he didn't do this to begin with... although I suppose losing power brakes and power steering would be unfortunate.

Hmm...

Offline johngenx

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #76 on: March 10, 2010, 09:07:02 am »
Wonder how many of the UA people are straining to make lease/finance payments?  Trying to ditch the car?

Offline Shnak

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #77 on: March 10, 2010, 09:21:33 am »
Wonder how many of the UA people are straining to make lease/finance payments?  Trying to ditch the car?

Seriously? Some people are way too cynical around here...  ::)

Offline toolatecrew

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #78 on: March 10, 2010, 09:22:05 am »

Offline Shnak

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Re: More bad press for Toyota
« Reply #79 on: March 10, 2010, 09:35:36 am »
http://toyotasimulator.com/

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