Topic: ‘Toyota defence' might rescue jailed Minnesota man

[rrocket]

Ok..and no neutral again?  As you say...a 185 HP Camry wouldn't be real zoomy...so why not put it into neutral?  And pumping the brakes?  Another driver error.  Also, a few here have said that they've pushed on some brake pedals that were closely spaced and hit the brake AND accelerator at the same time.  Could be that too..

BUT...it's impossible to say I suppose..

All responses which assume that a driver suffering from UA will remain cool, collected, and has been taught how to properly respond to crisis situations. Real life demonstrates that many drivers do not know how to respond to crisis situations (or even drive safely in ordinary conditions), so your point is moot.

I wouldn't call pumping the brakes "operator error". I'd call it a panic response created by a situation that should never have occurred - the car shouldn't be accelerating on its own to begin with.

IF the car was actually accelerating on it's own.    Again..people who do this kind of thing ALWAYS blame the car.....Just like the person who crashed through the glass at the Starbucks likely said "The car just took off!"

[PJungnitsch]

Obviously. What purpose did the article you posted serve, exactly

Isn't that obvious? People screw up and hit the gas instead of the brake. It happens.

The car doesn't slow down, they just push down harder. Natural reaction, one reason ABS has been such a good thing.

The guy had only been driving for a year. His claim always was that he pushed down as hard as he could, and I'd guess that is exactly what he did.


Still seems like he got a huge jail sentence for at worst, a horrible mistake.

[johngenx]

Wonder where God was?  He did save that poor woman in her Lexus that not only had WOT, but complete brake AND transmission failure.  Guess some are just sinners.

[vdk]

^^^ Win!

[ovr50]

Obviously. What purpose did the article you posted serve, exactly

Isn't that obvious? People screw up and hit the gas instead of the brake. It happens.

The car doesn't slow down, they just push down harder. Natural reaction, one reason ABS has been such a good thing.

The guy had only been driving for a year. His claim always was that he pushed down as hard as he could, and I'd guess that is exactly what he did.


Still seems like he got a huge jail sentence for at worst, a horrible mistake.

Well Demo, I see that PJung has answered your query (not sure why your panties are in such a knot over the posting, tho). I posted it as an example of the stuff that happens around here, A LOT, but usually by older drivers than 39. I was not in any way saying that Toyota doesn't have a problem, as you seem to be assuming I was saying.

"Unintended acceleration" can happen without the car being at fault, and that does happen a lot. I wonder if the driver had a Toyota instead of a Dodge truck, if she would have been so quick to say she hit the wrong pedal?

You can relax, no one is challenging "the greatest of all Greek orators". 

[rrocket]

Well Demo, I see that PJung has answered your query (not sure why your panties are in such a knot over the posting, tho). I posted it as an example of the stuff that happens around here, A LOT, but usually by older drivers than 39. I was not in any way saying that Toyota doesn't have a problem, as you seem to be assuming I was saying.

"Unintended acceleration" can happen without the car being at fault, and that does happen a lot. I wonder if the driver had a Toyota instead of a Dodge truck, if she would have been so quick to say she hit the wrong pedal?

You can relax, no one is challenging "the greatest of all Greek orators". 

But he was driving only a year...so his skill level was likely right around an elderly..

[articsteve]

Relax, ovr50, the story was on Autoblog too.  That's where I first saw it.  It's not like you had to look hard for it.

The guy never should have been imprisoned to begin with.  Driving his pregnant wife home from church with no drugs or alcohol in his system?  I have trouble believing that there was ANY intent to go 90+ mph...certainly not intent proved beyond a reasonable doubt.  Whether the problem here was a stuck pedal, a slipped floormat (stock or aftermarket), or even just driver error, I would certainly hope that this would make people think twice before finding someone guilty of vehicular homicide.

A family man who it appears did nothing deliberately wrong is serving an eight year prison sentence.  Whatever caused this accident, it doesn't appear to be something this guy did with a shred of intent.  If that's doesn't strike you as effed up...

I don't know jack about criminal law, but while there's certainly not enough here to find Toyota or a floor mat manufacturer liable in those three wrongful death cases, I would hope that there's enough here to allow Mr. Lee an appeal to get out of prison and see his kids again.

Well I agree with you about the obvious lack of intent.  In Canada this guy would not have been sent to prison.  The justice system in the USA, in most states in seems, has gone completely off the rails.  

IMO, the man being not used to driving, came off the thruway on to an off ramp at probably thruway speed and simply didn't stop in time.  It's a statical certainty that this type of traffic incident will occur.  As horrible as it is, high speed rear enders are a calculated risk if you travel by car.  Look and see how many Police are killed in this very way.

Definitely let the guy out of prison.    

[Mitlov]

IMO, the man being not used to driving, came off the thruway on to an off ramp at probably thruway speed and simply didn't stop in time.  It's a statical certainty that this type of traffic incident will occur.  As horrible as it is, high speed rear enders are a calculated risk if you travel by car.  Look and see how many Police are killed in this very way.

I think he was going over 90 mph at the time, so that's definitely not the scenario.  I agree that he shouldn't receive jail time if he's not intoxicated and not deliberately going that fast (i.e., racing another car or something).

[articsteve]

I think he was going over 90 mph at the time

That's based on an estimate from the Police.  They always over state their position.  Obviously, if they are part of a system of "justice" that puts a poor man in prison for 8 years, leaving his wife and 3 little kids on welfare, they are not going to be totally fair on the "evidence".