Topic: "Etching" scam.

[Wheelboy]

In recent threads the topic of vehicle "etching" has been mentioned and the fact that some dealers claim that, on their vehicles, it's mandatory.

It doesn't take much thought to realize that this is just another money making scam and if you ever manage to see it hidden inside "admin fees" and manage to get some mumbled explanation from a salesperson as to its purpose, you're at your most vulnerable time (having found your car and made your deal) and most buyers, rather than fight this charge, will pay it saying "Uhh what's another couple of hundred dollars?"

It's hidden withing Admin fees in the hope that you won't spot it and question it.  If it wasn't a scam why wouldn't the saleperson admit up front that they know what's best for you?  If they know what's best for me, why don't they include a set of mandatory shoe orthotics or winter tires and wheels?

Anyway, "tied selling" is an illegal practice.  This is what the APA says about it -

"For several years, APA's mystery shoppers have encountered new car dealerships that heavily promoted their own vehicle etching systems, most frequently Protector Plus. APA observed heavy markups on Protector Plus charged by some dealers, because Protector Plus did not publish its list prices (the product costs the dealer about $50, but we saw it selling for up to $495, included with "admin" or "DOC" charges). Also, in some markets, dealers told the APA shoppers an etching job was mandatory with every vehicle, even though requiring you to take it is illegal in Canada. In Ontario, this practice, called "tied selling" has been banned under the standards of business practices applicable to car dealers."

A couple of years ago, when I didn't have much of a clue about tied selling, one VW dealership (Leavens London) let us walk before they would remove the $200 scam.  Another dealer in London (Dalmar) would waive the $200 so we bought there.

Before anyone jumps is with "Uhh why would you not want $4000 back if you car got stolen?" I will add this - you don't "get" $4000.  If the car is not recovered, you get $4000 off the price of a replacement from the same dealership who sold you the "insurance" in the first place.  The fine print on their certificate is everything.

And isn't this why we buy insurance in the first place?

[DrJay]

In recent threads the topic of vehicle "etching" has been mentioned and the fact that some dealers claim that, on their vehicles, it's mandatory.

It doesn't take much thought to realize that this is just another money making scam and if you ever manage to see it hidden inside "admin fees" and manage to get some mumbled explanation from a salesperson as to its purpose, you're at your most vulnerable time (having found your car and made your deal) and most buyers, rather than fight this charge, will pay it saying "Uhh what's another couple of hundred dollars?"

It's hidden withing Admin fees in the hope that you won't spot it and question it.  If it wasn't a scam why wouldn't the saleperson admit up front that they know what's best for you?  If they know what's best for me, why don't they include a set of mandatory shoe orthotics or winter tires and wheels?

Anyway, "tied selling" is an illegal practice.  This is what the APA says about it -

"For several years, APA's mystery shoppers have encountered new car dealerships that heavily promoted their own vehicle etching systems, most frequently Protector Plus. APA observed heavy markups on Protector Plus charged by some dealers, because Protector Plus did not publish its list prices (the product costs the dealer about $50, but we saw it selling for up to $495, included with "admin" or "DOC" charges). Also, in some markets, dealers told the APA shoppers an etching job was mandatory with every vehicle, even though requiring you to take it is illegal in Canada. In Ontario, this practice, called "tied selling" has been banned under the standards of business practices applicable to car dealers."

A couple of years ago, when I didn't have much of a clue about tied selling, one VW dealership (Leavens London) let us walk before they would remove the $200 scam.  Another dealer in London (Dalmar) would waive the $200 so we bought there.

Before anyone jumps is with "Uhh why would you not want $4000 back if you car got stolen?" I will add this - you don't "get" $4000.  If the car is not recovered, you get $4000 off the price of a replacement from the same dealership who sold you the "insurance" in the first place.  The fine print on their certificate is everything.

And isn't this why we buy insurance in the first place?

Completely agree ... However.  The last time I purchased a car I was fortunate enough to have a sales pro, who actualy explained what it was and what the benefits where. He even gave me an info packet on this protector plus for me to peruse at my leisure and decide from there.  My neighbour actualy claimed on hers (her car was stolen and not recovered) The dealership wrote her a cheque for the $4000.00 (she did purchase another car from the same dealership). My salesguy explained to me that I did not have to purchase another vehicle from him (the dealership) in order to collect on it (he/they just hoped I would because they would look after me) I don't know if this is standard practice, if not, then it should be.  Give me the option, don't gloss over it. Don't lie about it. Explain it to me the same as you would any other optional piece of equipment and let me decide if it's beneficial to me (just like my sales pro did) I took it anyway.

[Wheelboy]

My salesguy explained to me that I did not have to purchase another vehicle from him (the dealership) in order to collect on it (he/they just hoped I would because they would look after me)

On the certificate I have in my possession it says plainly that the replacement vehicle must be bought at the selling dealer.  It also limits where a damaged (and recovered) vehicle may be repaired - at the selling dealer's bodyshop.  There's no mention of what would happen if the dealership didn't have a bodyshop.

[DrJay]

My salesguy explained to me that I did not have to purchase another vehicle from him (the dealership) in order to collect on it (he/they just hoped I would because they would look after me)

On the certificate I have in my possession it says plainly that the replacement vehicle must be bought at the selling dealer.  It also limits where a damaged (and recovered) vehicle may be repaired - at the selling dealer's bodyshop.  There's no mention of what would happen if the dealership didn't have a bodyshop.

Hmm interesting I will have to dig up my certificate because I do not recall it saying I had to buy at the selling dealer nor does my dealer have an attached bodyshop.  Now I am curious to find out for certain what mine says.

[toolatecrew]

Buying a 43R (Depreciation protection replacement value) rider on your insurance will cost less than protection plus and ensures that if your vehcile is stolen not recoverd withon first 2-3 years (depensing on policy) that you will be compensated with a brand new equivilant vehicle. This does not mean you will be paid what you pay for the vehicle it means you will be paid enough to aquire an equivilant new vehicle (So if you have a 2009 Elantra you paid 20 K for it gets stolen and Hyundai ios clearing out left over Elantras at 17K they will buy you one of those not give you 20k). In addition is ensures that you will recive only OEM parts for the duration of the 43r. It ensures the same treatment if you write the vehicle off.

All prtection plus does is give you 4K extra coverage if its stolen not recoverd. Its simply not good value compared to a 43r.

[DrJay]

Buying a 43R (Depreciation protection replacement value) rider on your insurance will cost less than protection plus and ensures that if your vehcile is stolen not recoverd withon first 2-3 years (depensing on policy) that you will be compensated with a brand new equivilant vehicle. This does not mean you will be paid what you pay for the vehicle it means you will be paid enough to aquire an equivilant new vehicle (So if you have a 2009 Elantra you paid 20 K for it gets stolen and Hyundai ios clearing out left over Elantras at 17K they will buy you one of those not give you 20k). In addition is ensures that you will recive only OEM parts for the duration of the 43r. It ensures the same treatment if you write the vehicle off.

All prtection plus does is give you 4K extra coverage if its stolen not recoverd. Its simply not good value compared to a 43r.

Good info ..thanks for that ..Makes me wonder however, why my broker never mentioned that as an option on my insurance.

[AutoBroker]

yes, depending if stolen car recovered or not, makes you eligible for different amount 'towards purchase of new car at the same dealership'

[johngenx]

I don't buy warranties from third party firms (most aren't worth the paper they're printed on) and I don't buy insurance from companies that aren't my insurance company of choice either.

Large, reputable insurance companies are weasels that use every thing in their power not to pay out on claims, so what makes me think that etching companies aren't the same, or worse.

We simply have a depreciation waiver on the Corolla.