Author Topic: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"  (Read 6116 times)

Offline Greg B.

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CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« on: December 04, 2009, 07:57:57 am »
A shocking revelation from Akio Toyoda...

http://detnews.com/article/20091126/OPINION03/911260331/1322/auto01/Howes--Toyota-not-looking-so-shiny-now


Quote
Two years ago, before two-thirds of Detroit's automakers were tempered by the fires of bankruptcy, the editor of the ostensibly "Japanese-loving" Consumer Reports apologized to readers for recommending the problem-plagued Camry V-6.

He also said the magazine had decided new Toyota models could no longer be given the benefit of the doubt -- or its prized "recommended" label. And Toyota's V-8 powered Tundra four-wheel drive pickup was labeled "unreliable" by the magazine, the unofficial Bible to discerning car and truck buyers.

Two years before that, the global industry's gold standard for quality recalled more vehicles in the United States than it sold in the United States. There have been running customer complaints about sludge in its engines, and, more recently, growing federal skepticism over Toyota's response to the unintended acceleration probe.

Infallible they aren't, as CEO Akio Toyoda, a scion of the founding family, conceded last month. Toyota, he said, is nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death" and is "grasping for salvation." He also said the still cash-rich automaker has grown too arrogant on "the hubris born of success" and the "undisciplined pursuit of more."


A truly astounding fall from grace.

Offline inco

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2009, 08:07:09 am »
And a breath of fresh air! ;) :thumbup:

Offline Giant Dwarf

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2009, 08:24:14 am »
 :popcorn: Cue ArticSteve's endless "barrie-like" defence in 5 - 4 -3 -2 -1...

Offline Thinking Out Loud

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2009, 11:01:03 am »
Step one in recovery:

Acknowledge you HAVE a problem.

GM never got that, at least at the top levels.  They seem to now, but only after government intervention.

Offline TopGun

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2009, 12:46:15 pm »
Step one in recovery:

Acknowledge you HAVE a problem.

GM never got that, at least at the top levels.  They seem to now, but only after government intervention.

Typically, the longer a company is successful TOL, the longer it takes to make the acknowledgment they have a problem.

Some companies never make that observation...or they don't react to it...and they fail.
If it flies, floats or f#%&s...rent it.

Offline Shnak

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2009, 01:54:11 pm »
Step one in recovery:

Acknowledge you HAVE a problem.

GM never got that, at least at the top levels.  They seem to now, but only after government intervention.

What's funny is that, without ever acknowledging what their actual problems were, GM has been claiming for many months now that they're all in their past!  :rofl:

Offline EV Dan

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2009, 02:11:41 pm »
No big surprise here. In the "fun to drive" segment they haven't made a car under Toyota badge for years while their green line was limited to the corporate relationship correct Prius with no plug when the drivetrain has been ready for it (coincidentally?) and the aftermarket was converting the cars for awhile now. Not to mention production ready Rav4-EV, just waiting for Toyota to make an investment in a joint Li-ion battery venture, which could have been done decades ago, that is if Toyota wasn't so indifferent to their consumer.
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Offline articsteve

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2009, 03:50:58 pm »
Whats more irrelevant?  This thread or the auto "journalist" that wrote it.  :think:

Consumer Reports apologized to readers for recommending the problem-plagued Camry V-6.

Current Camry is now 4 model years old.  This same problem-plagued POS Camry has led the segment in every year including 2009.   ::) 

Toyota, he said, is nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death" and is "grasping for salvation."    

General Motors' decline in Canada deepened Tuesday as Toyota beat the struggling auto giant in monthly sales for the first time.

Despite a rocky year for the entire industry, Toyota Canada's sales, including the Lexus luxury brand, jumped in November from the same period last year while GM of Canada posted more losses.

It marked the first time that a Japanese-based automaker has ever topped GM, which had led the industry every month in Canada from 1950 until earlier this year.

 :rofl2:

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/733296--toyota-canada-leads-the-pack


Automotive News
December 1, 2009 - 12:01 am ET
UPDATED: 12/1/09 5:38 p.m. ET


U.S. auto sales increased by less than 1 percent in November for the industry's first year-over-year gain without government incentives since October 2007.

The slight sales increase -- 35 units -- accompanied a seasonally adjusted annual sales rate of 10.5 million units, in line with the industry's “new normal” after a four-year decline and this summer's cash-for-clunkers incentive.

“Stability is good," said Jessica Caldwell, an analyst with consumer auto site Edmunds.com. "We'd like to see some growth, but I think most automakers right now would take stability.”

U.S. light-vehicle sales averaged 16.4 million units annually this decade through last year. In an accelerated decline, sales fell to 13.2 million units last year, reaching quarter-century lows by November 2008. That means today's comparisons are being measured against the worst November in decades.

October's 11.2 million SAAR reflected the first month this year in which seasonally adjusted demand passed 10 million units, not including the July and August boosts from the federal government's cash-for-clunkers program. August's U.S. sales increased 1 percent.

Along with the industrywide gain, Ford Motor Co.'s sales climbed less than 1 percent, the automaker's fourth gain in five months. Toyota Motor Sales U.S.A.'s 3 percent advance marked the automaker's third increase in four months.

Hyundai-Kia climbed 34 percent as sales of the Hyundai Accent and Elantra nearly doubled. Nissan North America shot up 21 percent, for its largest gain since June 2007. American Honda sales fell 3 percent, and General Motors Co.'s dropped 2 percent. Chrysler plunged 25 percent.

Nissan, Hyundai and Detroit automakers seem to have drawn some of their strength from fleet sales, said Jeff Schuster, an analyst with market research firm J.D. Power and Associates, although he could not give firm numbers today.

“We had them up just slightly on the retail side, so that to me suggests that it was a pretty strong fleet push,” Schuster said of Nissan.

But the industrywide increase in fleet sales isn't a bad sign, he said.

“We've just been used to some historically low fleet levels this year,” he said. “Inventory is not out of control, so it's not necessarily that we have to move a lot of product into fleet.”

As of Nov. 1, the industry had a 63-day supply of vehicles.

 :hello:
“Frankly, we are not going to ever defeat the insurgency,”     Billions for jets and pennies for vets; Harponi is MAGNIFICENT.

Offline footlong58

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2009, 04:02:01 pm »
^^^^  Why hasn't Toyota hired you yet to be their PR guy?

Offline ovr50

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2009, 04:23:52 pm »
Although it's a Detroit News article, there is some truth in what the writer stated. Toyota today is fighting the global recession like everyone else, and they likely did get arrogant and big headed. This global market will make all automakers more responsive to consumer needs and wants, and for that reason alone, it is good. Not all automakers will survive in the coming new world, I think Toyota will still be here, but....who really knows?
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Offline footlong58

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2009, 04:42:35 pm »
:)

Surely you don't spend all your time looking up facts and figures and numbers and graphs in defence of anything anti Toyota, and not get paid for it?

What... you mean, you do this for fun?   :'(

Offline johngenx

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2009, 05:13:00 pm »
Toyoda is right.  Seems to me he's pretty much the only auto industry exec that has the balls to tell the truth.  Toyota acted like they could do no wrong and auto, truck and SUV sales were going to grow exponentially forever.  They increased productive capacity at a horrendous rate and focused on the US market to the detriment of their overall business.

I think Toyota underestimated how fast the Koren car companies would increase their quality and gain acceptance in the marketplace.

No one (not just Toyota, but all companies) saw Ford coming.  That said, Ford has along history of short bursts of brilliance, only to rest and falter.  Their decision to bring European products here indicates that this time they might be in the game for real, but only time will tell.  The Fusion and Mustang are "domestic" products that kick ass, so it also shows Ford can make good stuff right here.

But, even with a global death drop in car sales and Toyota struggling to bring their products to market with aggressive pricing, they do know how to put money in the bank, and if anyone writes Toyota off at this early point in the game, they're pretty risky betters.

Toyoda's acknowledgment alone makes me think that Toyota is going to be seriously competitive in the near future.  They still have strong sales (they're still at or near the top in most car segments) and their reputation for quality is still strong.  Also, despite some missteps, their products are still more than in the game in terms of build quality.  Too many people equate their loss of a giant advantage as failure.  Look at Consumer Reports and you'll see that while their are some problems, most of the products are still more than safe bets in terms of reliability.
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Offline TopGun

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2009, 05:24:47 pm »
^^^^  Why hasn't Toyota hired you yet to be their PR guy?

Well they should consider it...PR people don't give balanced responses.  All of the responses on here are relative to GM.  Well...if Toyota is better than GM, then I guess they're the best.  He didn't mention how the Korean's are kicking their butt.

Talk is cheap...(AS should know that...God knows we do)...if Toyota is good enough to acknowledge their issues, then let's see how long it takes to turn the big ship around.

Edit:  Can't spell...but I can spell better than others...so I'm still the best!

Offline EV Dan

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2009, 05:40:16 pm »
"Nissan, Hyundai and Detroit automakers seem to have drawn some of their strength from fleet sales, said Jeff Schuster, an analyst with market research firm J.D. Power and Associates, although he could not give firm numbers today."

- or else he would not get paid by the mighty T- people. I don't see what kind of 'fleet' sales could account for 46%  ::)



Dec. 2 (Bloomberg) — Hyundai Motor Co. and Nissan Motor Co. led the first monthly gain in U.S. auto sales since government stimulus measures ended, signaling buyers are returning to showrooms as the economy stabilizes.

Hyundai’s sales surged 46 percent in November and Nissan’s rose 21 percent, industry researcher Autodata Corp. said. Toyota Motor Corp. posted a 2.6 percent increase, exceeding analyst estimates. The annual sales rate was 10.93 million vehicles, up from 10.41 million a year earlier, when seasonally adjusted for two fewer sales days in November 2009, according to Autodata.

Offline articsteve

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2009, 09:48:30 pm »
:)

Surely you don't spend all your time looking up facts and figures and numbers and graphs in defence of anything anti Toyota, and not get paid for it?

What... you mean, you do this for fun?   :'(


Lets put it this way; I put my money where my mouth is.   ;D

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« Last Edit: December 04, 2009, 09:59:16 pm by articsteve »

Offline airbalancer

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2009, 06:21:24 am »
WOW, they only last 5.5 months, and then you have to get a new one
I am still on the same truck after 6 years ;D

Offline DockMan

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2009, 07:34:33 am »
WOW, they only last 5.5 months, and then you have to get a new one
I am still on the same truck after 6 years ;D
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Offline Mitlov

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2009, 02:56:26 pm »
Why DO you buy a new truck every five months?  Are you actually buying each, or borrowing them from a fleet, or what?   :think:

I can't imagine the initial depreciation you'd be eating if you bought a new vehicle (from ANY manufacturer) every five months.
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Offline inco

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2009, 03:09:23 pm »
These are vehicles the has driven  - not owned or leased. Don't forget where he works. ;D ;)

Offline Mitlov

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Re: CEO: Toyota nearing "capitulation to irrelevance or death"
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2009, 03:28:32 pm »
Lets put it this way; I put my money where my mouth is.   ;D

These are vehicles the has driven  - not owned or leased. Don't forget where he works. ;D ;)

 :rofl:  That's not putting your money where your mouth is.  That's putting your mouth where your boss pays you to, which sounds remarkably NSFW  ;D