Topic: New Car Shopping Time

[HeliDriver]

Finding any of those with a manual transmission is tough. A new 5-Series wagon is also seventy grand, so a decent used one is in the same ballpark, pricewise, as a new 3-Series. They're also a bit bigger than we really need.

Funny, though, I just saw an older (mid 90s, maybe?) 540i Touring this morning. It looked really small, maybe even smaller than the new 3-Series touring. I bet it would be a blast with the V8!

A neighbour has a newish Saab 9-3 Aero wagon. It's a sharp looking car, but I can't believe how much they want for a new one! And they haven't had AWD long enough for there to be many used ones around. Maybe in a year or two it will be possible to pick one up for a steal.

Another thing: I'm a buy-it-and-drive-it-forever kind of guy. A lot of these suggestions are doubtlessly fun cars, but I'm trying to think of something that I'll be happy with for ten years or so.

I might be able to live with a crappy plastic interior for a two-year lease (only 1.9% for the WRX, which was tempting), but I can't stand the thought of being stuck with it until I'm fifty. 

[random006]

I was going to suggest the Volvo V50 AWD but you beat me to it in an earlier post.  Here is the info courtesy of Canadian Driver:

http://www.canadiandriver.com/buyers-guide/2009/volvo/v50.php

[ovr50]

SiR -"Funny, though, I just saw an older (mid 90s, maybe?) 540i Touring this morning. It looked really small, maybe even smaller than the new 3-Series touring. I bet it would be a blast with the V8!"

Yes, it would be BUT some of the mid-90s V8s were problem-plagued. Be careful.

To no one's great surprise, BMWs have grown in size over the past say 20 years as most cars have. My E90 M3 is almost exactly the same dimensions as to length, width and height as my 1985 535i was. Current 5 Series is about a foot longer than my '85 car was.

I'm actually enjoying the size of my M3 over my previous '08MY 535xi. Now that I think about it, I always liked the size of the old 5 Series, which is 3 Series size now.

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Saabs have had large discounts from MSRP for awhile. You're right, XWD hasn't been out for long although I'd think someone would be selling one, somewhere.

If you're visiting an Audi dealer who is VW adjacent, even though there's no AWD go take a look.

[tpl]

SiR -"Funny, though, I just saw an older (mid 90s, maybe?) 540i Touring this morning. It looked really small, maybe even smaller than the new 3-Series touring. I bet it would be a blast with the V8!"

Yes, it would be BUT some of the mid-90s V8s were problem-plagued. Be careful.

To no one's great surprise, BMWs have grown in size over the past say 20 years as most cars have. My E90 M3 is almost exactly the same dimensions as to length, width and height as my 1985 535i was. Current 5 Series is about a foot longer than my '85 car was.

I'm actually enjoying the size of my M3 over my previous '08MY 535xi. Now that I think about it, I always liked the size of the old 5 Series, which is 3 Series size now.

Specifically one particular BMW V8 had a problem with cylinder bore wear. It was the first generation of engines with chrome piston rings running directly on an Aluminium  Silicon treated bore. Nikasil or some name like that. I would think that any cars that started with that engine family would have had them replaced under extended warranty 10 years ago now.


Here is a link    http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/nikasil.htm

[HeliDriver]

Don't worry, a four-year-old BMW just out of warranty scares me enough.    I'm not really thinking about buying a 15 or 20 year old one.

That 540i wasn't for sale. It just happened to be parked next to me at the grocery store.

[johngenx]

Having spent some time pushing a 2010 WRX, I think you're used to a buttoned down, stiff suspension and you're mistaking body movement and roll for loss of traction.  The limits of the WRX are very high, but the suspension is very soft compared to something like your SiR.

However, a WRX can put the power down on a rutted, snow covered road, thanks to that longish suspension travel.  I agree that it's not for everyone, and can feel odd to people used to a short travel stiffly sprung car.

[HeliDriver]

I hear what you're saying, and don't disagree. The WRX never felt for a moment like it was close to the limits of adhesion (I think I mentioned as much in my initial review), it just felt unpleasant at what was really a pretty modest pace.

But, of course it was just a 15 minute test drive: I'm sure with a bit of time I could adjust to the different feel. And I'm sure that the long-travel, rally-inspired suspension would be perfect for our weekly ski trips down the gravel Smith-Dorrien into K-Country.    Of course, that leaves the other 95% of my driving, which is on relatively smooth pavement...

In hindsight, what strikes me was the contrast between the WRX and the BMW: I felt perfectly at home in the BMW from the first minute, and its attitude in every corner was "Are you sure you don't want to go faster?", rather than the Subie's "Whoa! Are you sure you want to be going this fast?"

[airbalancer]

Did you have the BMW in the sport mode when you were driving it?
Did you try shift it your self?
It does feel better nthe the sport mode

[ovr50]

Did you have the BMW in the sport mode when you were driving it?
Did you try shift it your self?
It does feel better nthe the sport mode

I could be wrong, but I don't think the tranny in the 328 is the Steptronic, therefore the 328 tranny may not have a sport mode.

[Flinter]

The whole WRX driving experience is very different than a lot of other sports cars.  You can be far more ham-fisted when driving them -- sure they wallow around a lot, but the AWD and gobs of power mean you just alter your driving style to throw finesse to the wind and drive it in anger all the time. 

I've found that driving the Forester in the winter has totally changed my winter driving habits.  I no longer driver super-smoothly, but instead hammer the throttle, letting the AWD do all the "thinking" for me.  I can say, it sure is fun!  My Forester is equipped with rear LSD, making lurid AWD power slides ridiculously fun and shockingly controllable.

I think both of your comments are bang on.

When I first test drove the WRX I was coming from an Acura Integra and my first impressions were much like those of SiR. In the WRX, the turn in wasn't as sharp, steering was not as precise, and the car wallows around more than I liked. However, after driving the car a few times I got a feel for how high the limits are if you just kinda ignore the body motion and go for it. You've gotta love that powertrain too. I definitely agree with other comments that a spring/damper upgrade would probably make a big difference.

The 128i and 328i will both feel more precise, controlled, and refined. The interiors are a definite step up too. However, it sounds like the 128i is out due to the absence of AWD and no hatchback. That leaves the 328i xDrive Touring. 

The big question becomes if you want to pay the significant extra coin for the BMW. When I looked at the price, lower lease rates and higher residuals on the WRX I decided to give it a try with a 24 month lease. 

[HeliDriver]

Did you have the BMW in the sport mode when you were driving it?
Did you try shift it your self?
It does feel better nthe the sport mode

I could be wrong, but I don't think the tranny in the 328 is the Steptronic, therefore the 328 tranny may not have a sport mode.

Yep, it had the Steptronic with both sport and manual modes. I left it in regular mode for most of our highway cruising, and shifted manually when I wanted to play around in the city (on/off-ramps and such). I had it in sport mode by mistake once, but didn't try it out long enough to get an impression.

The big question becomes if you want to pay the significant extra coin for the BMW. When I looked at the price, lower lease rates and higher residuals on the WRX I decided to give it a try with a 24 month lease. 

Yes, that 24 month lease on the WRX is very tempting. From a quick look at the website, I figure I could lease one for two years, zero down, for about $450 a month - tax included!

At this point I'm certain the WRX isn't a car I want to own, but I could maybe be tempted to rent one for a couple of years. The suspension mods probably aren't a great idea with the lease, though.

[Giant Dwarf]

Yes, that 24 month lease on the WRX is very tempting. From a quick look at the website, I figure I could lease one for two years, zero down, for about $450 a month - tax included!

At this point I'm certain the WRX isn't a car I want to own, but I could maybe be tempted to rent one for a couple of years. The suspension mods probably aren't a great idea with the lease, though.

That's a LOT of car and lot of performance for not a lot of bucks!
The suspension bits on a lease aren't that big of a deal.  I did the springs on my Miata and handed it back in lowered and never heard a peep of complaint.  Chances are anyone wanting the car next would want those same suspension upgrades.  Just don't go hog-wild with them (cost wise).

[mmorriso]

Yes, that 24 month lease on the WRX is very tempting. From a quick look at the website, I figure I could lease one for two years, zero down, for about $450 a month - tax included!

At this point I'm certain the WRX isn't a car I want to own, but I could maybe be tempted to rent one for a couple of years. The suspension mods probably aren't a great idea with the lease, though.

putting that $10800 into upgrading/modifying the Civic would be fun too!

[Arctic_White]

Yes, that 24 month lease on the WRX is very tempting. From a quick look at the website, I figure I could lease one for two years, zero down, for about $450 a month - tax included!

At this point I'm certain the WRX isn't a car I want to own, but I could maybe be tempted to rent one for a couple of years. The suspension mods probably aren't a great idea with the lease, though.

putting that $10800 into upgrading/modifying the Civic would be fun too!

Probably, but it is a lot easier to fork out $450 a month for two years, than it is $10,800. 

[Turbo Bob]

The whole WRX driving experience is very different than a lot of other sports cars.  You can be far more ham-fisted when driving them -- sure they wallow around a lot, but the AWD and gobs of power mean you just alter your driving style to throw finesse to the wind and drive it in anger all the time. 

I've found that driving the Forester in the winter has totally changed my winter driving habits.  I no longer driver super-smoothly, but instead hammer the throttle, letting the AWD do all the "thinking" for me.  I can say, it sure is fun!  My Forester is equipped with rear LSD, making lurid AWD power slides ridiculously fun and shockingly controllable.

Same thing happened to me when I went from the Exige to the Subaru, instead of carving through the corners accelerating from the apex, I'd just turn, mash the pedal, and hang on for dear life! 

My fuel costs went through the roof too, as that turbo-shove-in-the-back gets pretty addictive, I started driving everywhere like that... 

[toolatecrew]

My 02 Impreza RS was the only car I've ever owned that I would drive for the fun of it after a snowstorm. AWD + snow tires makes anyone feel like a rally driver. As long as you stay aware that you really are not above the laws of physics you can drive in a very ham anded way. No more feathering the throttle on every launch or blinking traction contol lights. Subarus beg to be beaten and abused. I can relate to the concept of it being like driving a high performance tractor. Refined? NO Fun YES.

[rrocket]

Finding any of those with a manual transmission is tough. A new 5-Series wagon is also seventy grand, so a decent used one is in the same ballpark, pricewise, as a new 3-Series. They're also a bit bigger than we really need.

Funny, though, I just saw an older (mid 90s, maybe?) 540i Touring this morning. It looked really small, maybe even smaller than the new 3-Series touring. I bet it would be a blast with the V8!

A neighbour has a newish Saab 9-3 Aero wagon. It's a sharp looking car, but I can't believe how much they want for a new one! And they haven't had AWD long enough for there to be many used ones around. Maybe in a year or two it will be possible to pick one up for a steal.

Another thing: I'm a buy-it-and-drive-it-forever kind of guy. A lot of these suggestions are doubtlessly fun cars, but I'm trying to think of something that I'll be happy with for ten years or so.

I might be able to live with a crappy plastic interior for a two-year lease (only 1.9% for the WRX, which was tempting), but I can't stand the thought of being stuck with it until I'm fifty. 

Used 9-2X Aeros are cheaper than same year WRX here.....

[johngenx]

Used 9-2X Aeros are cheaper than same year WRX here.....

Our dealer had a bunch of Saabarus, and priced them, of course, shockingly high.  But, the salesman confessed they'd be willing to move a LOT on the price to get rid of them.  Seems even when shown the Subaru DNA, most customers wouldn't look at them.

I prefer the Aero to the WRX of the same year.  Kind of a sleeper, ya see...

[Turbo Bob]

Used 9-2X Aeros are cheaper than same year WRX here.....

Our dealer had a bunch of Saabarus, and priced them, of course, shockingly high.  But, the salesman confessed they'd be willing to move a LOT on the price to get rid of them.  Seems even when shown the Subaru DNA, most customers wouldn't look at them.

I prefer the Aero to the WRX of the same year.  Kind of a sleeper, ya see...

Man I've never even seen that car before, it's awesome!  What year did they make it until and will you still be able to get Saab spares?