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Author Topic: HST on 2nd hand car sales  (Read 12723 times)

Offline tpl

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HST on 2nd hand car sales
« on: November 11, 2009, 12:05:31 pm »
Question:   If you buy a 2nd hand car from a private seller in Ontario do you have to pay GST ?    I know that you do have to pay PST.

After July 2010 will you have to pay HST on a 2nd hand car from a private seller?   Seems to me that you should not... but that seems too good to be true. On the other hand you should not have to pay the Federal part of HST on a 2nd hand car from a private buyer.... that WOULD be a tax grab and I am sure someone would have mentioned it in the pres by now.

Anyone know?
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Offline wing

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2009, 12:17:27 pm »
Guaranteed you will be paying HST on used cars in Ontario and that will include the GST part.  Currently you do not pay the GST on used cars from a private person.

There are many things people don't realize they will get hosed on.  I believe they have done some changes to the MER's on RRSPs but the way it still originally even if you lived out of province you would be paying HST on MER's on your investments!
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Offline blur911

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2009, 12:27:30 pm »
Quote from: tpl on November 11, 2009, 12:05:31 pm
that WOULD be a tax grab and I am sure someone would have mentioned it in the pres by now.


Tax grabs are no longer newsworthy items in Canada.  Too commonplace. ;D
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Offline airbalancer

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2009, 02:33:53 pm »
Quote from: blur911 on November 11, 2009, 12:27:30 pm
Quote from: tpl on November 11, 2009, 12:05:31 pm
that WOULD be a tax grab and I am sure someone would have mentioned it in the pres by now.


Tax grabs are no longer newsworthy items in Canada.  Too commonplace. ;D

So true, run for office if you want to complain ;D
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Offline tpl

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2009, 02:43:57 pm »
Quote from: wing on November 11, 2009, 12:17:27 pm
Guaranteed you will be paying HST on used cars in Ontario and that will include the GST part.  Currently you do not pay the GST on used cars from a private person.

There are many things people don't realize they will get hosed on.  I believe they have done some changes to the MER's on RRSPs but the way it still originally even if you lived out of province you would be paying HST on MER's on your investments!
I think that once the HST is everywhere apart from Alberta then it will be time to impose it on Alberta whether they like it or not just to have a consistent ( within a point or two ) across the country. (If AB doesn't want the money that would be ok I am sure PQ would take it)  Then force the rate the same across the country, get rid of all the fiddly little provincial differences. then we could have the tax included in prices.

Anyway  I wonder about the GST on private sales.  It goes against the way a GST/VAT is supposed to work. Private sellers are generally taxable entities and if you make them charge GST then you have to make them non-taxable and let them claim back their input taxes.,.. all very theoretical but it should not be buggered up just to suit Ontario.  I know that the problem is avoided in practice  by having the Gov directly collect the tax.
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Offline sailor723

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2009, 03:04:25 pm »
Here in NB you pay the HST to the motor vehicle branch when you go to change the registration on a car bought from a private seller. I think the only way you don't pay is when transferring the registration between immediate family members (parent to child etc)
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Offline wing

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2009, 04:02:14 pm »
Yes exactly the MTO will collect the HST now.

As bonus, perhaps used vehicle prices from private sellers will now have to drop.  Because if you are selling privately you now have no advantage over a dealer in terms of tax savings.
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Offline sweetpotato

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2009, 02:06:16 pm »
Yes, the dealers are delighted that full HST will apply to private sales. They have annnounced as much in their association press releases, spinning it as a curb on curbsiders.  Unstated, is the fact that more people will simply trade their vehicles in, and the dealers will get that action.

I get a chuckle of the talk of a tax grab by some posters, when said jurisdiction is running huge deficits.....

Oh, and I would love to see 13% HST here in Alberta. First we could clean up our deficit, then we could go revenue neutral by lowering income taxes. That would have the effect of enticing high income earners and their businesses to Alberta. But fear not Ontario, the simpletons that make up the electorate would never be that forward thinking.
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Offline TopGun

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2009, 11:05:15 am »
Quote from: sweetpotato on November 28, 2009, 02:06:16 pm
Yes, the dealers are delighted that full HST will apply to private sales. They have annnounced as much in their association press releases, spinning it as a curb on curbsiders.
.....

Yes...it was in the Star's Wheels section Saturday.
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Offline articsteve

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2009, 05:24:53 pm »
Everything and anything that has a "plate" is gonna get taxed at lucky 13:

private sale trailers, ATVs, motorcycles, snowmobiles.  Somehow all this is revenue neutral and is going to grow the economy.   :rofl:

Whatabout GASOLINE ???  Currently, we have an Ontario Tax, we have a Federal Tax, we have the GST, but no PST.  So on such and such a date next summer gasoline with increase 8 cents a litre over night presuming gas is already at a buck.  :o   

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Offline tpl

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2009, 06:25:10 pm »
Re the gas tax.  I wonder why the opposition and the public have not made more fuss on this one. Ontario could well lower its ad valorem gas tax ( 14.7 c/litre ) so that the pump price would stay the same.
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Offline wing

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2009, 07:06:02 pm »
Nobody will complain until they see the gas prices at $1.10 again
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Offline articsteve

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Re: HST on 2nd hand car sales
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2009, 09:57:46 pm »
Quote from: tpl on November 30, 2009, 06:25:10 pm
Re the gas tax.  I wonder why the opposition and the public have not made more fuss on this one. Ontario could well lower its ad valorem gas tax ( 14.7 c/litre ) so that the pump price would stay the same.

Ontario could well lower its ad valorem gas tax ( 14.7 c/litre ) so that the pump price would stay the same.


So could the Federal Government  ???  Don't understand your statement.  The purpose of the HST is to increase taxation for both governments.

Ontario gets a 4.5 Billion up front payment to sign.

 I wonder why the opposition and the public have not made more fuss on this one

I guess for the same reason Harper supporters don't.  ::)   This is a Harper initiative.  The CONS just tabled legislation making this possible.

HST    (Harper Sales Tax)  :rofl: :P  :bang:

Remember, when Harper and the CONS say no tax increase, it simply means the opposite.


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