CTC Review: 2010 Toyota Corolla XRS

[johngenx]

Why add the FIT to the Civic total

I think it's a competitor to the Matrix, not the Yaris.  The pricing of the Fit places it more like "Civic hatch" than a lower priced alternative.

[Honda Owner]

and bless every one of them.  Service customers for life.  A critical component that is overlooked by most.

Often overlooked and where the dealership really makes money. Eighty percent of Toyotas are sold with a service package.

[Canada Stig]

The profit on a 96,000 km service (4 year service - the biggie), which usually involves some combination of brakes and/or tires in addition to the 4 plus hours of labour and all the parts, is probably more than the showroom made selling the car.  Dealer principals who ignore parts and service (and parts is the big money maker, especially if the dealer is a big wholesaler) in favour of the front end are almost negligent.  I would sell cars at or even below cost if I knew they came back to the service and parts department for the next 6 years or more.

Japanese carmarkers - Honda, Toyota, etc all learned 25 years ago that this is where the money was and tend to retain customers long past warranty - ask any Honda/Toyota service advisor and he will tell you about the myriad of customers he has that are past 200,000, 300,000 and more km on their cars.  A Honda dealer I used to work at had one customer who had over 700,000 on his accord and was still a service customer.  This dealer made the equivelant of 10 or 20 times the showroom profit on this guy in parts and service.  Remember Honda's "Don't open your hood to strangers" campaign?  It worked.

Domestic carmakers, on the other hand, haven't quite gotten this yet (although some dealers are trying) and tend to lose their customers on the first out of warranty service, and lose out on hundreds, or even thousands, of dollars of profit on those cars as a result.

[Feds]

Averaging 8.0l/100 km?  Yikes.

My 2003, 170,000 km Protege5 does 7.8-7.9, while pushing a much worse profile through the air.  More useable space too...  Also 0.00 problems beyond regular maintenance.

Not that the P5 is the be-all and end-all of motordom.  If anything, this mileage number makes Ford look like geniuses.... Wait until the next-gen Focus with turbo 1.6 power out muscles and out economizes the Corolla, at a lower out-the-door price.

[wing]

Didn't you post this exact thing in the cube article?  You keep forgetting one thing,  You != me

[Feds]

Did I?  Oops now I feel like a troll... 

I just can't see why a car this size needs a 2.4l engine, unless it makes ridiculous power, which this one does not.  If it's because of the weight, well, that just makes Toyota's engineers lazy.

And I know I am not you, but are you doing a lot of sustained 120+?  That's the only thing that really hurts the Protege due to the short overall ratio.

[wing]

No, I do a lot of 0-80km/h stop, go, stop, go.  That kills it because of the acceleration.

[quadzilla]

Averaging 8.0l/100 km?  Yikes.

My 2003, 170,000 km Protege5 does 7.8-7.9, while pushing a much worse profile through the air. 

Maybe you should lend Wing your car for a week so he can set a baseline with it? I think you might see your fuel economy written up at 9.7L/100 (or worse) for the week.

[EV Dan]

No, I do a lot of 0-80km/h stop, go, stop, go.  That kills it because of the acceleration.

Speaking of which, do you clock your 0-60 and back times? I'd like to find a reliable source of this info, not just manufacturers' claims.

As for mileage I wonder why a 200 kg lighter Corolla has worse highway mileage than a 2.4 Sonata...

[johngenx]

It would seem that the 2.4L engine is the antithesis of the 1.8L in the Corolla.  Sure, it makes more power and is bigger, but that extra 600cc sure seems to use the go-go-juice.  Our worst all-city stop and go tanks with the 1.8 are in the mid 7's and most city driving is in the high 6's.  Mixed city/highway can get low 6's and highway use is always in the 5's unless I'm in danger of being arrested.

[wing]

Check the AJAC site for 0-60 times and braking times.

These numbers are achieved at testfest all during the same day by the same 3 guys so this is more consistent you could say than claimed numbers.

http://www.ajac.ca/web/ccoty/vehicle_list_manufacturer.asp

[articsteve]

I just can't see why a car this size needs a 2.4l engine, unless it makes ridiculous power, which this one does not.  If it's because of the weight, well, that just makes Toyota's engineers lazy.

When the high revving version of the Celica bit the dust the XRS motor was on life support.  The 2.4/5 speed auto was already on the shelf at Toyota so they stuck it in the new series Rolla "XRS".   It was either that or kill off that model.  Toyota makes money on the XRS, ppl buy them, so there is your answer.

I agree that the Rolla should just be had with the base motor.

[johngenx]

The old XRS never sold well thanks to the no-torque nature of the engine.

[Erik]

Well, at least I understand how to quantify quality now.

So, the best:
1) Movie of 2009 - Transformers 2
2) Ice Cream - Vanilla
3) Restaurant - McDonald's

Will sure make things easier at Oscar time. And how needs those annoying Michelin guidebooks for restaurant ratings. If it sells the best, it must be the best!!!!

[johngenx]

Erik, you always assume that anyone that buys/owns a Corolla has no love of internal combustion bouncing about inside them.  You are wrong.  The Corolla is not a sporting device of any kind, and neither are any of the FWD compact cars.  The Corolla's mission is to provide economical transport, and given the completely un-fun stop-and-go nature of the commute that our Corolla is put through every day, it serves that mission well enough to earn a medal.

If you don't think that a Corolla owner can't appreciate going a tad fast, then you need to take seat #2 on my 350hp motorcycle come spring...

[Erik]

Erik, you always assume that anyone that buys/owns a Corolla has no love of internal combustion bouncing about inside them.  You are wrong.  The Corolla is not a sporting device of any kind, and neither are any of the FWD compact cars.  The Corolla's mission is to provide economical transport, and given the completely un-fun stop-and-go nature of the commute that our Corolla is put through every day, it serves that mission well enough to earn a medal.

If you don't think that a Corolla owner can't appreciate going a tad fast, then you need to take seat #2 on my 350hp motorcycle come spring...

Actually, wasn't really commenting on the Corolla at all. The comment was aimed at some in this thread who only look at sales numbers to the determine the quality of something. THAT is what I was addressing my comments to.

To be honest, in my last couple of times looking at small cars, I always included the Corolla. I do believe it's best days are behind it in terms of having a huge quality advantage, but I will never say that it is a bad choice in the purchase of an automotive appliance. I doubt it will ever be my choice, simply because I have never found a Corolla that I could fit my 6'4 frame into comfortably.

But, I don't agree that ALL of the FWD cars in the market need be boring to drive. While the Corolla and Civic (my heart aches to say that - I used to race Civics and loved them!), are fairly insipid to drive, I have certainly enjoyed my wheel time in smalll Mazdas and VW's.

And while I don't doubt your fun on your motorcycle, for myself, I could never give up driving fun in my daily driver, just for a small, possible increase in reliability or a slightly lower running cost. YMMV, etc etc.

[articsteve]

The comment was aimed at some in this thread who only look at sales numbers to the determine the quality of something.

Corolla defines automotive success; a vehicle that is in high demand for more than a decade both new and used.  If lack of quality was it's formula then GM should be largest and most profitable company in history. 

I do believe it's best days are behind it in terms of having a huge quality advantage

The current gen Corolla owes it's success to the 2006 Civic.  This Honda was so above the game that Toyota had to delay their offering for over a year.  Hence the latest gen Corolla was born and it is by far the best Corolla ever. 

[TopGun]

Erik, you always assume that anyone that buys/owns a Corolla has no love of internal combustion bouncing about inside them.  You are wrong.
.....

A classic CandianDriver.com argument used when "defending" the great Toyota and Honda.  So not everyone that buys Corollas has no love of cars...therefore...Corollas are the choice of enthusiast drivers?

Corolla defines automotive success; a vehicle that is in high demand for more than a decade both new and used.  If lack of quality was it's formula then GM should be largest and most profitable company in history. 

Another classic.  Erik makes a great parallel that if "best" is defined by sales numbers, then McDs is the best restaurant.  Oh...let's ignore that and just go after GM again...oh we're so smart!!!!

[articsteve]

oh we're so smart!!!!

 

[johngenx]

A classic CandianDriver.com argument used when "defending" the great Toyota and Honda.  So not everyone that buys Corollas has no love of cars...therefore...Corollas are the choice of enthusiast drivers?

No, Corollas are not the choice of enthusiast drivers.  However, they might fit into an overall automotive strategy of an enthusiast individual.  People deride the Corolla for it's lack of sport ability (though I have driven most of the FWD compacts and found them all tepid and uninspiring) though that's not the mission of the car.  In our stable, the Corolla is to provide a comfortable, economical drive that averages about 20 km/h.  It serves highway duty as well, doing nothing more than achieving about 5L/100km flat.  This saves dough, so that I can spend money building/buying other stuff.

If I owned a Miata, I might commute in it, and still have fun with it on off days.  Other than that, every "fun" car/whatever I've owned for the last 20 years has not been used for commuting.  Well, maybe a WRX or STi, hhhmmm...