Topic: 11 yrs old - replace the ABS control or the vehicle?

[windstarguy]

I have a 1998 Windstar 3.0L with 190,000km on the clock. The van is in very good shape overall. The ABS unit is malfunctioning, and I'm told by the dealership it's $1100 for a new control unit. I'm thinking I should have a mechanic inspect the vehicle to give me a health report, and if otherwise it looks good, get the thing fixed, as it would still be a lot cheaper than replacing the van.

In terms of replacing it, as I'm no mechanic and I'd have to finance the purchase regardless, I would prefer to buy new rather than used, and there aren't that many new vehicles out there that actually fit my needs as well as my Windstar does. We now average about 22,000km a year of driving (used to be 15,000 when we lived in a big city that had a good transit system).

So what do you think? Fix it or lose it?

[Honda Owner]

At that mileage and age, the Windstar is approaching the end of it's service life. You have to ask yourself is it worth doing this size of a repair only to have another issue crop up in the near future. The Windstar is not considered the most reliable vehicle in history and at that age, it will be one thing after another.

A new Caravan can be had for a very reasonable price.

[Ontariodriver]

I seen Caravans as low as 19K new now and is the better van. Also don't forget about the silly cheap Montana which can be pick up new for 15 large also used Freestars can be pick up for as low as 6-8 being less than 3-4 years old.

Nobody can tell you how to spend your money. I'd ask myself will the van go another 40,000 without to many issues. You might also get the unit cheap at a scrap yard and pay someone to fit the unit. 1100 you could buy a Windstar without the issues here in ON anyways.

[safristi]

dismantle the ABS fer HOW MUCH....$$$$$.........

[dr_spock]

You can probably buy a similar Windstar for parts with the $1100 and replace the module yourself if you have the skills. 

[HeliDriver]

I'm expecting to get flamed for this, but if it's in good shape otherwise, why not just keep driving the van without ABS?

ABS is rather overrated, IMHO, and as long as you're aware that it's no longer working, it's not a big deal to drive the van as-is. In fact, the ABS in my Civic died about a month ago and I have no plans to fix it unless I can do it myself cheaply (I haven't checked the codes yet to see if it's a major or minor problem).

[PJungnitsch]

Agree, just drive without. My truck never has had ABS, and while it would be nice, it's not essential, especially with good winter tires.

[johngenx]

I'm expecting to get flamed for this, but if it's in good shape otherwise, why not just keep driving the van without ABS?

No flames from me.  That's exactly what I would do.

[toolatecrew]

I agree with above. As long as the car is otherwise safe to drive keep driving it without ABS. Many MANY cars have been driven many many miles before ABS was invented with no problems. Its a nice saftey feature which can help in certain situations but its by no means a deal breaker. You vehicle will still stop safley. If you take the time to learn you can still pump the brakes or use other techniques to stop your vehicle as quickly without ABS. Heck ABS was proably an option on a 1998 anyways. Drive that sucker into the ground. Take the $1100 you would have used for repairs and put it away for a down payment on your next vehicle.

[johngenx]

Take the $1100 you would have used for repairs and put it away for a down payment on your next vehicle.

Best advice so far!

 

[windstarguy]

Thanks for all the replies so far. I should explain the thing about the ABS malfunction is not that it doesn't work at all, it's that it kicks in at low speeds, like when you're parking. The brakes will go into panic mode and grab and stutter as if you were making a high speed emergency manoeuvre. It's really annoying. The diagnosis on the problem was that the ABS controller is whack, and needs to be replaced. So it's kind of hard to ignore, although that's what we've been doing now for quite a while - we're just getting tired of it. The dealer assured us that as far as braking goes, there is no safety concern, the brakes work fine - it's just this low speed nonsense.

[tpl]

Is there a fuse that can be removed to fully disable the ABS ?

[johngenx]

Is there a fuse that can be removed to fully disable the ABS ?

Not usually.  I know the "low speed ABS pulsing" problem well.  I had an old MB with that problem, and it needed new ABS wheel sensors and control unit, but the car had nearly 500K on the odo, and there was no way I was going to spend $1500 on the ABS system.  So, I just learned to live with the parking-pulse as I called it.  Spend as little as possible and start banking as much dough as possible for the next vehicle...

[kardood69]

I think the sensible thing to do is what you first said - get her checked out and if she's otherwise good then either see about disabling the ABS or fixing it. 

$1100 is not that much if you get another year or so out of her.    Plus the convenience of say a day in the shop and you get her back versus shopping around for a new one, etc.

I spent $1500 on a new rear-end for a 95 suv last winter.  Sure it's probably near what she's worth, but without a rear axle and undrivable she is worth the scrap value.   So it's pretty much a wash for trade-in, but in the meantime she avoids having to get a new car.

A lot of people automatically don't like to fix old cars, but I think sometimes really not a bad decision.  It is a good excuse for getting a new machine though!

Maybe one of the accountant can do an opportunity cost calculation.

Now if cash for clunkers comes it will all be worth it!!

I wonder how much mark-up is in those ABS controllers.  Plugging in new box must take almost no labour.  Not to mention you'd think the ABS controller is used across a lot of vehicles, so they should be dirt cheap.  Sure it's automotive grade electronics, but come on!

Am I right or is there good reason for this?

[PJungnitsch]

That fuse solution I've heard of before, IIRC for GM cars. I did a very quick Google:

Q: How can you disable or unplug the ABS in a '96 Ford Windstar if it cycles at inappropriate times and it is too expensive to fix?

A: Pull the fuse.
In 1996 Windstar, it's fuse #33
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_can_you_disable_or_unplug_the_ABS_in_a_%2796_Ford_Windstar_if_it_cycles_at_inappropriate_times_and_it_is_too_expensive_to_fix

Q: Why does your 1998 Ford Windstar make a noise when you come to a stop?

A: may be abs brakes sensor....to disable on 1998 pull 15 amp fuse #30
abs and brake light will stay on but it will disable abs system.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_does_your_1998_Ford_Windstar_make_a_noise_when_you_come_to_a_stop

[kago]

Had the same issue with my '99 E320 Benz.  Dealer wanted $1800 plus tax for a new ABS hydraulic pump.  I drove without ABS for over a year.  One of my independant mechanics was able to find a used pump for $300 which comes with a one year waranty.  So far so good.

[johngenx]

Had the same issue with my '99 E320 Benz.

Is it the wagon in the pic?  We had a 98 E300 turbo diesel that I had a love/hate relationship with.  When it wasn't in the service bay for a warranty repair, it was awesome to drive.  1000kms on a tank of fuel and tons of torque.  Wished it was a wagon, but then I might not have sold it, and today it would be some sumbitch of a headache.

When owning an older MB, a good indie tech is gold.

[kago]

Yes mine is a wagon, same model as the pic..W210.  Wish it was a diesel.  Most issues were also dealt with during warranty period. Have kept up on the maintenance and still looks like new.  No doubt a good indie is money in the bank. 

[windstarguy]

Thanks for all the replies.

I called my local Pontiac dealer - they had 10 Montana's in stock, according to their web site. I asked the sales guy if they had any with side air bags, as I wouldn't consider buying a new vehicle that didn't have side air bags. He was stumped, said he'd call me back. That was 5 days ago. And 15 large? Not in this town, unh-unh. But thanks for the suggestion.

Next I searched online for a used Windstar and found a promising 2002 SEL very nicely equipped with very low km's, but no price listed. I emailed the dealer for a price - that was 3 days ago and no reply. Apparently dealers are not that hungry.

So far I think my favourite suggestion is do nothing, and keep saving money until I'm better able to get some new wheels. We'll see...