Topic: Treating a noisey tappet on a Dodge 318 ci

[68Polara]

I hope "tappet" is what it's called.  What sounds like one tappet in my 1968 Dodge Polara 318 ci suddenly became noisey yesterday.  After about 5 minutes, the noise diminshed until it finally seemed to go away.  Is there an additive that will fix this?  Is this a sign of something that should be looked at?

Thanks for any advice.

[Honda Owner]

Well, you really should rebuild the engine.....

You have a sticky lifter. Eventually you will have to replace them but when you open a motor that old, you never know what lurks within............

[68Polara]

Well, you really should rebuild the engine.....

You have a sticky lifter. Eventually you will have to replace them but when you open a motor that old, you never know what lurks within............

Thanks.  I don't mean to question, but really?  I found the car in Calgary last Nov. and had it shipped to the Ottawa area.  It's in terrific shape overall.  The engine has 72k miles on it and normally its purrs.  A "sticky lifter" is a sign of a need for an engine rebuild?  Is there no engine additive than can breakdown the stickiness?  I'm somewhat mechanical and do some things myself (ie. change fuel pump and the like), but I don't exactly know what an engine rebuild involves?  I'll certainly have it done if/when it does need it.  I was hoping this tapping sound was something very minor.

Thanks again.

[jamie1]

You said the noise has gone away. So if the noise is gone,I really would not be worried about it. Could have been a bit of grit/sludge that went through.

[68Polara]

You said the noise has gone away. So if the noise is gone,I really would not be worried about it. Could have been a bit of grit/sludge that went through.

Thanks, I hope so.  Right after I got the car last Nov., I had the guys at Capital Dodge in Kanata, Ont. do a hot oil flush (4 of the mechanics there own old Dodge's).  I've had to do a couple of idle speed adjustments since, but like I said, the engine normally purrs.  The tapping noise went away, but I thought it best to ask here if there might be an additive to take care of it, not thinking it would require major intervention.  I still hope not.  I still hope someone will advise of an additive for this purpose.  Again, if it really is a sign of a major overhaul, I'd be willing to do it, or have it done.

[maritime_storm]

Their is no way adjust individual valves on pre-magnum 318, the rockers for each cylinder bank pivot on a rocker arm shaft together and have no adjuster so it isn't uncommon for them to tap after a number years. As another poster mentioned, short of tearing the engine down and replacing the valve train, once they start making noise their isn't much you can do about the tapping except ignore it. Which is fine, it doesn't hurt these engines any. Regarding putting something in the engine to stop the noise, most oil additives and flushes do far more harm then good, so it is best to avoid them. You are better off to change the oil more often with good quality oil, doing so actually keeps your engine cleaner avoid these issues in the first place.

[articsteve]

do a hot oil flush

What is that 

If it was my car I'd throw on a new filter. Add a litre of automatic tranny fluid.  Drive it a 100 miles and then change the filter and oil.

[68Polara]

do a hot oil flush

What is that 

If it was my car I'd throw on a new filter. Add a litre of automatic tranny fluid.  Drive it a 100 miles and then change the filter and oil.

I don't know for sure, but I took the advice of the service manager at Capital Dodge in Kanata to have it done.  Being an older engine, I was told it would be a good thing.  I assume they have some way of circulating the oil throughout the block.  As mentioned, there are a bunch of old school mechanics with old Dodge's of their own working there, so I trusted them.  I hope it wasn't a bad thing to do.

[68Polara]

Their is no way adjust individual valves on pre-magnum 318, the rockers for each cylinder bank pivot on a rocker arm shaft together and have no adjuster so it isn't uncommon for them to tap after a number years. As another poster mentioned, short of tearing the engine down and replacing the valve train, once they start making noise their isn't much you can do about the tapping except ignore it. Which is fine, it doesn't hurt these engines any. Regarding putting something in the engine to stop the noise, most oil additives and flushes do far more harm then good, so it is best to avoid them. You are better off to change the oil more often with good quality oil, doing so actually keeps your engine cleaner avoid these issues in the first place.

Thanks! Great to know what can/can't be done, that this is not an uncommon issue, and that the engine won't be hurt.  Until a rebuild may be necessary, I'll focus on preventative measures.  Any recommendation as to frequency of oil changes and best type/brand for my situation?

Thanks again!

[articsteve]

Since it's a non winter car I'd put a straight 30 weight oil in it. 

[maritime_storm]

"Since it's a non winter car I'd put a straight 30 weight oil in it. "

Steve it's not 1970 anymore. Dodge was using 10w30 year round in those engines until 1992. Oil change interval would depend on your driving habits. If your just using it for light cruising on weekends then this is what I would do if it we're mine. Change the oil when you bring out in the spring then change, twice during the summer, and again right before you put it away for the winter. If you use it as a daily driver all summer then consider changing it more often. You have to remember, even though oils have improved greatly since this car was built, it doesn't have any of the modern engine design efficiencies in it, so it will be harder on oil than a modern car. Oil is cheap, rebuilds are expensive.

[articsteve]

"Since it's a non winter car I'd put a straight 30 weight oil in it. "

Steve it's not 1970 anymore. Dodge was using 10w30 year round in those engines until 1992. Oil change interval would depend on your driving habits. If your just using it for light cruising on weekends then this is what I would do if it we're mine. Change the oil when you bring out in the spring then change, twice during the summer, and again right before you put it away for the winter. If you use it as a daily driver all summer then consider changing it more often. You have to remember, even though oils have improved greatly since this car was built, it doesn't have any of the modern engine design efficiencies in it, so it will be harder on oil than a modern car. Oil is cheap, rebuilds are expensive.

Steve it's not 1970 anymore

Exactly my point.  The car is a 68 with a few miles.  Those motors had huge tolerances and loved 30 weight oil which was the year round oil in Florida at the time.  10W30 was for below 0C climates.  It sucked for summer, but it was the "comprise oil".  Good for all seasons.  Just like those BS "all season" tires.  The masses like it simple.  So the companies went the KISS route.  The motor heads knew better. 

Using 10W30 in those old motors during summer was like using water.   That is why after 80 MILES most motors were blowing smoke past the rings, particularily Chryslers.

[68Polara]

Thank you both, steve and storm.

We use the Polara to cruise around mostly only on the weekends.  I expect we'll average about 4,000 miles (6,000 kms) on it during the spring, summer, fall each year.  I'll be taking steve's advice to try straight 30 weight oil and storm's advice about frequency, but I have a couple of questions.

If I change the oil just before putting into winter storage.....

- is straight 30 what I should go with for that period where the car just sits (in a large lightly heated garage, formerly a modern chicken coup)?
- do I really need to change the oil again right away when I bring the car out in the spring if it was changed just before putting into storage?

Thanks again for any clarification.

Tom

[maritime_storm]

Motor oil oxidizes over time, you change it in the fall to rid the engine of containments the oil has picked up during the summer, then again in the spring because it has oxidized from sittings for several months. I still feel you should be using a thinner oil than 30 SAE, as most engine wear is at start up the 30 weight weight oil will take longer to get to parts than a multi-grade. A better compromise, if you want to go thicker than a 10W30, would be to use 15W40. Still thinner to pump on a cold start than 30 SAE but stays thicker when hot as well. The reason single weights were recommended back in the day was because they we're a better quality then the multi-grades at the time. All motor oil has come a long way in terms of anti-wear and anti-sludge additives, it was common place in the 60's & 70's to rebuild engines around the 125K mark, whereas today the average lifespan is considered to 350K and it gets longer by the year.

[articsteve]

- is straight 30 what I should go with for that period where the car just sits (in a large lightly heated garage, formerly a modern chicken coup)?

I would say the thicker the oil the better as it might stay on the engine parts better before heading down to the pan and personally I change it before storage and that is it.  I don't start them and I don't re-change the oil in the spring.

An Esso Bulk Oil and Lubricant distributor (they are in every community) makes a good friend.  Cheaper and very convenient to buy by the case.  They can get anything.  I buy 20W50 Group 2, and 0W30/0W40 Group 4 oils by the case very much cheaper than buying from Crappy Tire.

it was common place in the 60's & 70's to rebuild engines around the 125K mark, whereas today the average lifespan is considered to 350K and it gets longer by the year.

That's because of the engine designs and materials used, not because of the oil.  I agree oil is better today, but multigrade oils are made with more compromises.  My old 6.2 GM diesel called for 30 above freezing and 15W40 below freezing so if you are only operating in a warm climate I'd stay clear of winter grads. 

[PJungnitsch]

On the farm we ran lots of old engines low mileages year after year for decades and 10w30 changed once a year seemed to work fine. A 230 hp 318 is unlikely to stress the oil much.

Myself, I would change it once in the fall, like I do with my motorcycle, and use HD diesel oil. They have extra additives as they don't have catalytic fouling to worry about. Also tend to come in heavier weights, if you want to go that way.

A much bigger concern than oil IMO, with old machines like that is ensuring the rad, heater core, hoses, etc are in top notch shape or replaced. My neighbor just about cooked his beautifully restored classic the other day because of a old clogged rad.

[articsteve]

Straight 30 weight oil will give better compression.