Topic: Warning label: "Learning to use a stick shift"

[quadzilla]

Now in my current car when you apply the handbrake it switches OFF the HIDs used as DRLs. Ok but this can give a false signal to another driver that they may turn in front of me or something when they tuirn on again.   ( Why use the hand brake with DSG? you may well ask a) the DSG does not creep like a slush box b) habit )

Doesn't your GTi have a hill holder? Mine does.

For sure I use it for parking but how many of us use the handbrake when parking an automatic? 

I do but I think that is from the years of driving a manual. Plus I learned that if you don't use it, it could seize up on you if somebody else did and then you have bigger problems.

what I mean is it teaches you much better car control.

Can you explain this? I see lots of people driving a manual and trust me, car control is the last skill that they have.

[Black Hatch]

For sure I use it for parking but how many of us use the handbrake when parking an automatic? 

I do but I think that is from the years of driving a manual. Plus I learned that if you don't use it, it could seize up on you if somebody else did and then you have bigger problems.

Except during the winter; where the handbrake can freeze up.

Speaking of parking for those that have a manual transmission... what gear do you leave the shifter in when you park. (level surface)
Lately I've been leaving it in 3rd gear; but for the longest time I've left it into 2nd.
I am wondering if there any difference in which gear you leave it in.

(Of course put it in reverse is when you are parking downhill)

[wing]

I just let the clutch out until it starts to grab then I let go of the brake, unless it is a REALLY steep hill no need for the hand brake.  Also depends on the car.  Of course this wears the clutch some but it's usually not mine

[tpl]

I use the handbrake when parking the GTI BEFORE I put it in park.

I don't think the GTI has a hill holder... maybe it does but I'd never know 'cos I use the handbrake 


@dr-Spock   I think its called a pawl not a paw. A pawl being a thing that engages in a ratchet to prevent movement.

@Black hatch    I don't leave the Transmission in any gear in a manual transmission car. Transmissions are more expensive than handbrakes and in my experience, well maintained handbrakes work far longer than the life of the car. And of course... habit.

[dr_spock]

Thanks tpl.  I stand corrected. 

[initial_D]

I always use the handbrake when parking, manual and auto.

[Black Hatch]

@Black hatch    I don't leave the Transmission in any gear in a manual transmission car. Transmissions are more expensive than handbrakes and in my experience, well maintained handbrakes work far longer than the life of the car. And of course... habit.

What I meant was I use the handbrake as well...
Pull the handbrake, turn off engine then I shift it into a gear for 2nd reinforcement. (Say if for some reason, the handbrake comes loose)

Doesnt the drivers manual say to put the car in gear while on an incline/decline?

[tpl]

@Black hatch    I don't leave the Transmission in any gear in a manual transmission car. Transmissions are more expensive than handbrakes and in my experience, well maintained handbrakes work far longer than the life of the car. And of course... habit.

What I meant was I use the handbrake as well...
Pull the handbrake, turn off engine then I shift it into a gear for 2nd reinforcement. (Say if for some reason, the handbrake comes loose)

Doesn't the drivers manual say to put the car in gear while on an incline/decline?

I will check the Fit manual.  I would not be surprised if there was not some lawyer inspired paragraph on that in the 50 pages or so ( in all manuals nowadays) about seatbelts and kid seats and so on.
Just for interest; I never turn the wheels into the curb when parking. Again, habit  and IIRC people in the UK didn't do that anywhere that I went to ( thats a disclaimer 'cos I did not live in or visit a hilly region).  I have a feeling that is mandatory in some parts of North America.

[quadzilla]

I don't think the GTI has a hill holder... maybe it does but I'd never know 'cos I use the handbrake 

You should try not using the handbrake and see what happens. The grade has to be a certain level before it works, at least on mine. Plus it has a really weird feeling and took me a while to get use to it. On small inclines my car can roll back a cm before taking off.

[tpl]

I will try it.

[Ontariodriver]

I even use it for parking

For sure I use it for parking but how many of us use the handbrake when parking an automatic? 

I do. I use the Handbrake all the time. Even when sitting at a traffic light. saves rolling out into traffic or hitting the car or person in front. As long as you remember the tar mac and tyre rule. Will also save a rear ending someone in front, if hit from behind. Especially in manual where you car could roll a couple of paces forward and your foot might slip on off the clutch.

Can you explain this? I see lots of people driving a manual and trust me, car control is the last skill that they have.

That is because they are self taught. They should be a separate license for Manual and Automatic. People need to be taught properly how to drive a manual. Trouble is people think just because they drive a Automatic that a manual will just as easy. But it is not.

Another tricky maneuver is a reverse up hill or a parrell park on steep hill. Will test the limits of novice manual users. Even experience manual user can find this hard.The amount times I had to do that in Hampstead. I can now do with my eyes shut. 

[initial_D]

So it comes back to Driver's Ed.

[safristi]

.....right ON baybee.................

[Rupert]

More of my cars in the best part of a lifetime of driving have been manual shift and handbrake usage, in conjunction with the clutch, on an incline, is the hardest part to get a feel for when learning. Even after learning one has to learn again when changing to another manual shift vehicle...clutch bite feel varies even on similar models. Of course, having mastered the other aspects of driving; learning the traits of different vehicle only takes a few starts. The other aspects of road usage skills are more important than just learning to get going though but perhaps one becomes more involved in the whole experience with a manual shift car and this may produce a better more concerned and knowledgable driver. Having started by driving a motorcycle (one up and three down) I believe that this gives a later car driver a much better observation regimen of the road ahead. You are far more aware on a motorcycle of hazards on the road which may cause a disaster on two wheels. It is hard to visualize when learning but one does come to a juncture when it all becomes seamless and automatic to the point that one does not have to consiously think much about gear shifting and engine control and a person becomes as one with the machine. A high point to be savoured. Then again there is the continual shifting and left leg wear experienced in wall to wall 401 rush hours. An automatic then becomes an attractive proposition.
I use the hand brake when parking an automatic vehicle...certainly on an incline to take the load off the transmission locking pin...remember to set the hand brake before putting the lever into park. There is no point in setting the lever in park and allowing the car to roll it's weight onto the pin before applying the hand/parking brake. I think a hand brake is more likely to be applied when parking than a foot operated device. With no bench seats being used anymore one wonders why the latter devices are still around. If you park on a hill without setting the brake you will feel a stiffness and grating when re-starting your vehicle when you move the lever out of park. This is due to the weight of the vehicle being held back by this device. Not a good thing for longevity.

[tpl]

    Lets be kind to machinery.

[dorin]

Speaking of parking for those that have a manual transmission... what gear do you leave the shifter in when you park. (level surface)
Lately I've been leaving it in 3rd gear; but for the longest time I've left it into 2nd.
I am wondering if there any difference in which gear you leave it in.

(Of course put it in reverse is when you are parking downhill)

I would never leave the car in any other gear than first or reverse when parked.  The reason for this is that the lower gearing in first and reverse provides the most resistance against movement.  So, third or even second are definitely worse in terms of providing resistance against rolling off on a hill.  If I were you I would stop using anything other than first or reverse.  Technically, I believe that reverse is geared even lower than first so it's the best choice, but first is close.

The direction of incline also has nothing to do with which gear you leave the car in.  The point of leaving the car in gear is that the stopped engine will resist movement strongly enough to keep the car from rolling away on its own.  It doesn't matter in which direction the car would tend to roll.

[dorin]

Just for interest; I never turn the wheels into the curb when parking. Again, habit  and IIRC people in the UK didn't do that anywhere that I went to ( thats a disclaimer 'cos I did not live in or visit a hilly region).  I have a feeling that is mandatory in some parts of North America.

I only turn the wheels into the curb when parking on hills.  There's no point in doing so otherwise.  As a habit though, I think it depends on whether ones formative experiences were in a hilly area or not.  It also makes sense that turning the wheels into the curb would be mandatory in hilly areas.

[Honda Owner]

I live in the hilliest place in the country and both my daily drivers are manuals but I almost never use the handbrake to start. There are very rare occasions, of course, but for the great majority of the driving I do the handbrake is used for parking only.

One of the measures that has been adopted here in British Columbia is graduated licencing. The road test is much more difficult than in the past. The first one, for a class 7, is 45 minutes long and the second one, for the full class five, is an hour. Graduated licencing has really reduced the number of fatalities in the province, especially here in Vancouver where many parents buy their kids Porsches as symbols of their "love." In fact, in my neighbourhood there is a Lamborghini with an N sign (novice driver) sign in the back window. Any moving violation results in an instant two year suspension while driving on a N licence. One of my kids is on an N now and she is on her best behaviour as was my son before he got his class 5 last year. They also knew if they got any tickets I would take the car away from them forever! Now, when they graduate, they get to keep them and I pay the insurance. A little incentive to stay in school as it were!

For motorcycles, the N limits you to 125cc for two years which has really reduced fatalities because you can no longer take your class 6 test on a 50cc scooter and then jump on an Hyabusa.