Topic: Yowza Cop Car!

[Mitlov]

The Carbon looks ok, looks like a car Robocop would drive.

Ford would be very dumb if they just halt CVPI production without something to leave in its place...

Dumb?  What sort of profit margin do you think they have on the police interceptor as is?  Probably tiny.  And don't you think per-unit production costs are going to significantly increase now that there's no longer a civilian version (economies of scale and all that)?  Is it really dumb to end production of a car that's no longer profitable?

Without leaving something in its place?  Are you suggesting that they (1) develop a whole new police interceptor from scratch (huge R&D costs that would be better spent elsewhere), (2) make a police interceptor Taurus (we'll see how many police agencies buy a FWD cruiser...most American ones shunned the police Impala), or (3) import the Falcon (cool car, but it's expensive to modify to meet North American regulations--a cost they're not going to recoup with fleet sales)?

[The Mighty Duck]

That said, the Charger's proved really popular around here.  I love seeing it in police colors and lights.  What amazing road presence.

I seem to recall Fuzz saying the Charger was an unreliable POS and generally not very good for police work.  Sad, since it does look bad-ass as a police car.

(3) import the Falcon (cool car, but it's expensive to modify to meet North American regulations--a cost they're not going to recoup with fleet sales)?

Let's be honest.  Ford should give us the Falcon anyway.  If they can modify it as a police vehicle as well, all the better. 

[safristi]

..is FUZZY @ a police union SPA........................gettin' his Collar easteral  quotient UP.......or has he defected to Chrysler!!!!..............come back Fuzz all is on deferral hiatus.................he he hernia.............

I'm scared one of his senor!!! ossifers got wind of his tales out of skool POSTS

[aquadorhj]

Appearance not withstanding, I think it's a cool police car.

Apparently, it has air analyzer built into the trunk, so it can tell LEOs as they cruise by whether there's fire or toxicity in the air..  pretty cool.  (just watched Daily Planet on discovery channel.. )

Rear doors are weird, though.

[safristi]

"toxiCITY" in the air..................heaven forfend ...maybe a car went BY...................

[Wolfe]

The Carbon looks ok, looks like a car Robocop would drive.

Ford would be very dumb if they just halt CVPI production without something to leave in its place...

Dumb?  What sort of profit margin do you think they have on the police interceptor as is?  Probably tiny.  And don't you think per-unit production costs are going to significantly increase now that there's no longer a civilian version (economies of scale and all that)?  Is it really dumb to end production of a car that's no longer profitable?

Without leaving something in its place?  Are you suggesting that they (1) develop a whole new police interceptor from scratch (huge R&D costs that would be better spent elsewhere), (2) make a police interceptor Taurus (we'll see how many police agencies buy a FWD cruiser...most American ones shunned the police Impala), or (3) import the Falcon (cool car, but it's expensive to modify to meet North American regulations--a cost they're not going to recoup with fleet sales)?

I don't wanna really get into the issue of keeping the Crown Vic alive but you've hit on pretty much all of the really big economic problems that face the Carbon police car. If Ford, a long established car-maker, cannot support a new purpose-built police cruiser project to replace the Crown Vic how can a new company like Carbon do the same? If it's not economically feasible for Ford to do it then I can't see how it could be feasible for a completely new entrant to the market.

The development and tooling costs for the Crown Vic must've been fully amortized years ago. I'd bet that the Crown Vic is one of if not the cheapest car to build in North America.

I suspect that Carbon is lowballing the cost estimates for their cruiser for now and once the Crown Vic is out of production the price of the Carbon car will rise. It just doesn't seem possible to develop and build a new car with the capabilities and durability that Carbon claim and deliver it at a price anywhere close to what Ford charges for the police spec CV. Something's gotta give.

[Mitlov]

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/02/26/australian-company-wants-pontiac-g8-to-be-next-cop-cruiser?icid=sphere_blogsmith_inpage_autoblog

Come on.  It'd be awesome.  (No, it's not body-on-frame just like the Charger, may not be big enough, yadda yadda yadda, it'd still be awesome).

[Scaerio]

If BMW 5-series, Volvo S60s, and Mercedes E-classes are big enough for European police forces, I'm sure the G8 and Charger would be fine for North American police.

[inco]

One big advantage that the folks at Carbon will have is likely much less labour costs than Ford. Heck they can maybe even get them made in Asia - say alongside the new Tata. That would really keep the costs way down.

What we as taxpayers don't need is monopoly cars. Having only one choice takes away the need to compete and that would be an expensive alternative down the road. Still the big three would be at a labour cost disadvantage trying to build these puppies here in North Amercia - unless one of them dedicates a plant specifically for police and taxi builds and negotiates a separate contract with the UAW/CAW.

Not likely that could happen, however with the current strain and give and take on current contracts, I suppose anything is possible.

Scaerio your point is valid except police in North America carry more stuff and tend to become bigger people - Fuzzy - I'm not suggesting that Tim Horton's is the cause, honest.

[tpl]

The Carbon looks ok, looks like a car Robocop would drive.

Ford would be very dumb if they just halt CVPI production without something to leave in its place...

Dumb?  What sort of profit margin do you think they have on the police interceptor as is?  Probably tiny.  And don't you think per-unit production costs are going to significantly increase now that there's no longer a civilian version (economies of scale and all that)?  Is it really dumb to end production of a car that's no longer profitable?

Without leaving something in its place?  Are you suggesting that they (1) develop a whole new police interceptor from scratch (huge R&D costs that would be better spent elsewhere), (2) make a police interceptor Taurus (we'll see how many police agencies buy a FWD cruiser...most American ones shunned the police Impala), or (3) import the Falcon (cool car, but it's expensive to modify to meet North American regulations--a cost they're not going to recoup with fleet sales)?

Surel the answer is to sell the complete production line of the CV ( and maybe the old RWD Lincoln that is used for limos and airport taxis up here) to a consortium of unemployed CAW/UAW members for $1 and let them keep producing it.   I think that the company would need an exemption from the NTHSA and EPA   as the company would have to get a large supply of the engines and certainly would not have the r&d to keep updating them....but...  I bet you could find 1 million Ford V8 rwd powertrains  in junk yards that could be rebuilt.

OR do the same thing with a new company but just supply them bare truck chassis as suggested above and let them build a new body on the frame. 

I feel tho' that the economics are against this.

[barrie1]

The Crown Vics are all Candian built in Talbotville Ont which is located just outside of London about 8 miles. Same for the Mercs and many of the Lincoln as well as they all share the same chassis and drivetrains. The standard Ford cruiser only has the 4.6 engine which produces 230Hp and does a great job for the Police as its a four door which serves their purposes for transporting passengers when required. The Chrysler Charges that Hamilton got were all the 6cyl engined models which could not take the ideling and constant driving with little maintenance in between shifts. The engines virtually self destricted in them but the Hemi might be a different story but Hamilton did not buy any of them at the time. The 350 CID Hemi usually is around the 345Hp but I believe they have increased that now for more ponies which would be helpful to the police in a chase situation on occasion. I suspect they are much more durable as a engine design as well. I would rather have the big Hemi myself which is pumping out around 425Hp instead but eats more fuel of course. I believe they were OK with the handling and braking but Fuzz is the expert on this one as I am sure he has tried a few out by now. Cities like London get a unbelievable price advantage when buying vehicles like this according to a Police Sgt Nephew of mine. Most of our taxi's in the London area are retired police cruisers from both the OPP and the Local City forces. 

[Cord]

The Crown Vics are all Candian built in Talbotville Ont ...

Is that another name for St. Thomas, Ont.?