Topic: Advice needed:VW Rabbit and Passat price quotes - Good deal or not really?

[TT]

Guys,

I received a call yesterday from one of the VW dealers in Ottawa, informing me that they have dropped their prices and had "great" finance rates and deals 

Here's what they have given me as a quote for 2 different models that I am interested in:

Rabbit - 4 Doors - Base model
Finance
66 month  434$ / 3.9%
60 month  473$ / 3.9%
48 month  568$ / 2.9%

Lease   
48 month  331$ / 3.9%
36 month  366$ / 3.9%
 
Passat - Base Model
Finance 
66 month 563$ / 2.9%
60month 615$ / 2.9%
48 month 743$/ 1.9%

Lease   
48 month  476$/ 2.9%

Do you think the above numbers are truly good deals?

Note: The quotes include taxes and all the admin fees,etc...

[sailor723]

Only way to tell is to look at the price of the car not the payment. Hard to know if they're building in a bunch of "extras" in terms of admin fees,doc fees, glass etching etc etc. Who knows? they might well be quoting MSRP  ???The rates are set by the manufacturer so what you need to work from is the selling price and any add-on fees.

[TT]

Only way to tell is to look at the price of the car not the payment. Hard to know if they're building in a bunch of "extras" in terms of admin fees,doc fees, glass etching etc etc. Who knows? they might well be quoting MSRP  ???The rates are set by the manufacturer so what you need to work from is the selling price and any add-on fees.

Good point Sailor723, I just sent an e-mail asking for the MSRP.
Thank you for the tip, much appreciated.

[JSCC]

If you ask for MSRP, that's what you're going to get.
You should ask for final selling price:
final selling price = MSRP - discount + admin + PDI + air tax + gas tax + tire levy + this fee + that fee + whatever fee

[sailor723]

JSCC is right. What you need to ask is..."What selling prices are these payment quotes based on and what additional charges are included?" (I'd be willing to bet it's MSRP)....That's a very old car selling trick ...get the buyer focusing on the payment so he doesn't notice how much you're charging for the car.

[TT]

JSCC is right. What you need to ask is..."What selling prices are these payment quotes based on and what additional charges are included?" (I'd be willing to bet it's MSRP)....That's a very old car selling trick ...get the buyer focusing on the payment so he doesn't notice how much you're charging for the car.

Thanks JSCC and Sailor723 for the info.
I have received a response from the dealer just now and below are the MSRP:

Passat MSRP: 28565$
Rabbit MSRP:  21675$

[dorin]

Good, now have you gone back and asked them for their best on-the-road price?

[PJungnitsch]

I would have just asked for the whole price the payments were based on, let the dealer fiddle with how he makes it up.

Then work it out yourself, based on the VW Canada website list prices, PDI, admin fees, etc to see what discount (if any, they are giving you).

When I bought my motorcycle last year I did that, and the discount over MSRP + admin was substantial. I didn't care where they took the discount from to keep their own books happy.

[JBrill]

Guys,

I received a call yesterday from one of the VW dealers in Ottawa, informing me that they have dropped their prices and had "great" finance rates and deals 

Curious as to which dealer you're dealing with... 

[TT]

Good, now have you gone back and asked them for their best on-the-road price?

Best on-the-road price?

[JSCC]

JSCC is right. What you need to ask is..."What selling prices are these payment quotes based on and what additional charges are included?" (I'd be willing to bet it's MSRP)....That's a very old car selling trick ...get the buyer focusing on the payment so he doesn't notice how much you're charging for the car.

Thanks JSCC and Sailor723 for the info.
I have received a response from the dealer just now and below are the MSRP:

Passat MSRP: 28565$
Rabbit MSRP:  21675$

Told you, you were only going to get "1" number, the MSRP which is easily found onthe www.vw.ca website.  

[airbalancer]

Good, now have you gone back and asked them for their best on-the-road price?

Best on-the-road price?

the price with everything include, 
the amout of money you need to drive it off the lot

[TT]

Thanks for the advice guys, I appreciate it.

Here's the latest info that I got from them:

                Rabbit          Passat
Old MSRP         $21,675       $30,975
New discounted MSRP     $20,975     $27,475
Finance %(For 60 Months) 3.90%        2.90%
Admin Fees          $499       $499
PDI                $600       $600
Air Tax                $100          $100
Gas Tax              $75        $75
Tire Levy            $15          $15
Freight               $735         $735
Other fees                  -                 -
        
Total Final Selling Price   $22,999    $29,499

What do you guys think?

Note: Total Final sellling price is without tax 
   

[airbalancer]

That price is for a base 5 door Rabbit,
I would need the   
Cold Weather Package 
Heatable Front Seats
Front Heatable Windshield Washer Nozzles
which is $275

I would offer them $20,000 including cold weather package + pst & gst
 
 

[sailor723]

Unless it's a red hot new model in very short supply you never,never,never pay MSRP

[2latecrew]

Admin Fees          $499     
 

[dorin]

Admin Fees          $499     
 

 

TT, what you need to do is sit down and come up with your own on-the-road (OTR) price.  Based on what you listed there I would aim for $21,000-21,500 (+ PST and GST) for the Rabbit and $27,500 (+ PST and GST) for the Passat.

[2latecrew]

Any dealer "quotes" are no more useful than going to the VW website when updated and looking at the MSRP.

As much as a reduction in MSRP might be good right now is probably the trickiest time to buy the vehicle. Services like CCC may not yet have caught up with the reduced invoice prices that go along with these price reductions. In the big scheme of things who really cares about MSRP. Its just an artificially derived number that builds a healthy profit margin in for the dealer. The ACTUAL retail price changes for every customer. The invoice price does not change. The dealer pays what he pays for the car . The incentives can change but you only know those by researching.

The fact that they tack a $500 admin fee onto their "quote" should just emphasize this. What's your best on road price ? Dealer $22,999 but if you come in we can probably knock it down a bit. You come in and they tell you special Deal $22 499. Guess what they just offered you full MSRP. It looks like they offered $500 off but all they did was remove that unnecessary extra profit padding Admin fee. Even if they paid their secretary a healthy 30 K a year that's 15 an hour. What kind of admin work take 33 HOURS of time to do? That's what a $499 admin fee gets you.

Find out when you can get the update invoice pricing and then subtract any incentives. Then add on appropriate fees and TeXes that you HAVE to pay. Negotiate UP from there not down from MSRP. On the road price is a good a idea I think too. Its a similar trick as to what dealers use. On the road includes taxes that the dealer doesn't get. But it makes the numbers sound bigger. It sends the sales person scrambling for their calculator to back out the taxes so they can figure out what their true margin is.

BTW that 500 admin fee that gets you nothing (you have to do the paperwork to sell the car its overhead) is really $565 of your heard earned dollars because it gets TAXED.

[TT]

Thank you very much guys for all the responses and help, much appreciated.

I drove to the dealer after work today and took the VW Rabbit 08 Base model - Manual (4 dr) for a spin and I really did enjoy the ride (overall), it felt very solid and responsive.

Once done with the test drive we started talking numbers, and I ended up with a final quote of $488.66/Month (60 months finance @ 3.9%).

The only option that I did opt for was the 18 inch wheels (pic below), which the sales rep said they were offering the wheels  to me at a bargain price @ 750$ (tires included).



The Sales rep said that there was no way to drop the Admin fee charge, and that was mainly due to the paper work, car preparation,etc...(plenty of BS followed).

Based on the quote above,the on the road price is getting me up to $29319, which I think isn't a steal 

Do you guys think it is a good deal or am I being ripped off?

Anybody knows what's the Dealer's invoice price for a VW Rabbit 4 doors manual?

Thanks guys for any info or thoughts that you can share with me.

[rsxca]

Seems like alot of money for a base rabbit.  I guess that's what it cost.