« previous next »
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Down

Author Topic: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan  (Read 20054 times)

Offline Cord

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Posts: 3532
  • Carma: +11/-13
  • member
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #60 on: November 10, 2007, 02:13:32 pm »
Quote from: MD on November 10, 2007, 03:42:08 am
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 02:09:11 am
Even for sporty cars, efficiency is important to me.  However, I don't really care about how much I pay at the pump.

Is the engine operating at top efficiency when it's being lugged around at 50kph while in 6th gear?

Yes, max fuel efficiency is at lowest rpm with largest throttle opening.
Report to moderator   Logged

mdxtasy

  • Guest
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #61 on: November 10, 2007, 02:52:35 pm »
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 01:35:40 pm
Quote from: MD on November 10, 2007, 03:42:08 am
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 02:09:11 am
Even for sporty cars, efficiency is important to me.  However, I don't really care about how much I pay at the pump.

Is the engine operating at top efficiency when it's being lugged around at 50kph while in 6th gear?

Who ever said the engine is being lugged?

If you were to floor it at this engine speed - of course yes.  But just having a 1 mm push on the gas pedal (DBW civics have a wide on/off gap on the throttle) surely does not.

I'd much rather hold a speed at 2000RPM, barely touching the throttle and keeping the engine calm, than holding 3000RPM and holding my right foot further probed in.

At 50kph in 6th gear, you're at 2000rpm?  But if you had to goose it, you're left with nothing in the power tap.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2007, 02:54:52 pm by MD »
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline si

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: West Coast
  • Posts: 3907
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #62 on: November 10, 2007, 04:30:45 pm »
Quote from: MD on November 10, 2007, 02:52:35 pm
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 01:35:40 pm
Quote from: MD on November 10, 2007, 03:42:08 am
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 02:09:11 am
Even for sporty cars, efficiency is important to me.  However, I don't really care about how much I pay at the pump.

Is the engine operating at top efficiency when it's being lugged around at 50kph while in 6th gear?

Who ever said the engine is being lugged?

If you were to floor it at this engine speed - of course yes.  But just having a 1 mm push on the gas pedal (DBW civics have a wide on/off gap on the throttle) surely does not.

I'd much rather hold a speed at 2000RPM, barely touching the throttle and keeping the engine calm, than holding 3000RPM and holding my right foot further probed in.

At 50kph in 6th gear, you're at 2000rpm?  But if you had to goose it, you're left with nothing in the power tap.

I'll get back to you about the exact RPM at 50kph.. 

Anyway the car does have close ratio gears - so this is NOT a car for people who do not like to row.  I'm just comfortable knowing power is just a half second 2 or 3 gear change rev-matched shift away..  ;)
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Snowman

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Oakville
  • Posts: 21600
  • Carma: +45/-34
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2012 Audi TT-RS. 2011 Toyota Venza AWD. 2004 Honda S2000
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #63 on: November 10, 2007, 05:02:01 pm »
In 5th gear at 2600 RPM I'm at 110kph.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2007, 07:16:00 pm by Snowman »
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline G35X

  • Enthusiast
  • **
  • Location: W. Vancouver, BC
  • Posts: 313
  • Carma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #64 on: November 10, 2007, 06:50:03 pm »
Cord wrote:
“Yes, max fuel efficiency is at lowest rpm with largest throttle opening.”

Yes, you are very right, but many people do not know this…

Rpm is directly related to fuel consumption simply because it represents number of ignitions (fuel burning occasions) within a given time.

Fully open throttle means engine needs less power to suck air in from the outside (less pumping loss).

Now, fully open throttle usually means high rpm.  So, the best way to minimise gas consumption is to put a small displacement (power) gas engine in a car and let it drive with the throttle wide open most of the time.  Honda did this with its Insight model. (Hybrid helped but real reason for its good mileage is its small I-3 engine, slippery body design and low rolling-resistance tyres.)  This, however, leaves little reserve power for passing or going up hill. 
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Snowman

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Oakville
  • Posts: 21600
  • Carma: +45/-34
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2012 Audi TT-RS. 2011 Toyota Venza AWD. 2004 Honda S2000
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #65 on: November 10, 2007, 07:17:46 pm »
Quote from: G35X on November 10, 2007, 06:50:03 pm
Cord wrote:
“Yes, max fuel efficiency is at lowest rpm with largest throttle opening.”

Yes, you are very right, but many people do not know this…

Rpm is directly related to fuel consumption simply because it represents number of ignitions (fuel burning occasions) within a given time.

Fully open throttle means engine needs less power to suck air in from the outside (less pumping loss).

Now, fully open throttle usually means high rpm.  So, the best way to minimise gas consumption is to put a small displacement (power) gas engine in a car and let it drive with the throttle wide open most of the time.  Honda did this with its Insight model. (Hybrid helped but real reason for its good mileage is its small I-3 engine, slippery body design and low rolling-resistance tyres.)  This, however, leaves little reserve power for passing or going up hill. 

Yes!....that’s great in a lab but I drive in the real world.

Report to moderator   Logged

mdxtasy

  • Guest
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #66 on: November 10, 2007, 09:35:09 pm »
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 04:30:45 pm
I'm just comfortable knowing power is just a half second 2 or 3 gear change rev-matched shift away..  ;)

I prefer to wait less than that if I need some juice.
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline si

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: West Coast
  • Posts: 3907
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #67 on: November 10, 2007, 10:09:41 pm »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eToFmoi6xOY

btw:
@ 50kph:
1st gear = 6850RPM
2nd gear = 4400RPM
3rd gear = 3300RPM
4th gear = 2400RPM
5th gear = 1900RPM
6th gear = 1400RPM  (2000RPM at 72kph)
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline The Mighty Duck

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Kingston, ON
  • Posts: 7194
  • Carma: +14/-8
  • Gender: Male
  • f*** that duck
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2009 Honda Fit
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #68 on: November 10, 2007, 10:26:20 pm »
Quote from: Snowman on November 10, 2007, 07:17:46 pm
Yes!....that’s great in a lab but I drive in the real world.

Because these cars don't have multiple gears one can switch into to pass or go uphill...  Hell, most Hybrids have CVTs, so you don't even need to change gears.  You just need to press the go button and the car does all the work.
Report to moderator   Logged

mdxtasy

  • Guest
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #69 on: November 10, 2007, 10:52:52 pm »
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 10:09:41 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eToFmoi6xOY

btw:
@ 50kph:
1st gear = 6850RPM
2nd gear = 4400RPM
3rd gear = 3300RPM
4th gear = 2400RPM
5th gear = 1900RPM
6th gear = 1400RPM  (2000RPM at 72kph)

Geez that's awfully low in 6th.  I'm at 3k in 2nd gear when at 50kph.  I like it there.  Because right beside that is where the meat of the power is.
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline wing

  • Big Wig
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Location: Ottawa, On, Canada
  • Posts: 18103
  • Carma: +101/-61
  • Gender: Male
  • If you ain't first ... you're last!
    • View Profile
    • Drivesideways
  • Cars: 2001 Honda S2000; 2005 Nissan Titan
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #70 on: November 10, 2007, 10:57:58 pm »
I find that's a little low I haven't been putting it into 6th until about 70kph
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline si

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: West Coast
  • Posts: 3907
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #71 on: November 11, 2007, 01:10:37 am »
maybe it's just because I live in a slow city..

I do, however, get 500kms/tank. (about 8 L/100km)
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Snowman

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Oakville
  • Posts: 21600
  • Carma: +45/-34
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2012 Audi TT-RS. 2011 Toyota Venza AWD. 2004 Honda S2000
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #72 on: November 11, 2007, 08:27:31 am »
Adding a half second reaction time to a panic situation for the sake of a few drops of fuel is unsafe.
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Arctic_White

  • Auto Obsessed
  • ***
  • Location: Burnaby, BC
  • Posts: 865
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #73 on: November 12, 2007, 12:06:19 am »
Quote from: Mitlov on November 06, 2007, 10:05:15 pm
The chassis is, by all accounts, fantastic.  And the car is so shockingly ugly inside and out that you might be distracted from the total lack of torque.

#s can be misleading.  Have you driven one?  ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0XuDIXx_5A
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Arctic_White

  • Auto Obsessed
  • ***
  • Location: Burnaby, BC
  • Posts: 865
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #74 on: November 12, 2007, 12:10:34 am »
Quote from: wing on November 07, 2007, 02:39:38 pm
Many never understand, it has nothing to do with high revving even.  Torque is ONLY a NUMBER.  Everyone constantly forgets to factor in gear ratio, final drive and weight.


Precisely.

As a future Si/Type S owner, and a current Mazda3 owner, I'd like to ask you how the Si compares to your Mazda3 Sport in everyday driving. 
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Arctic_White

  • Auto Obsessed
  • ***
  • Location: Burnaby, BC
  • Posts: 865
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #75 on: November 12, 2007, 12:34:44 am »
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 01:35:40 pm
Quote from: MD on November 10, 2007, 03:42:08 am
Quote from: SIVIC on November 10, 2007, 02:09:11 am
Even for sporty cars, efficiency is important to me.  However, I don't really care about how much I pay at the pump.

Is the engine operating at top efficiency when it's being lugged around at 50kph while in 6th gear?

Who ever said the engine is being lugged?

If you were to floor it at this engine speed - of course yes.  But just having a 1 mm push on the gas pedal (DBW civics have a wide on/off gap on the throttle) surely does not.

I'd much rather hold a speed at 2000RPM, barely touching the throttle and keeping the engine calm, than holding 3000RPM and holding my right foot further probed in.

I'm with Sivic.  One thing I really like about Si is it's dual personality: keep the revs low and enjoy awesome fuel economy; want to have some fun then rev it past 5,800 rpm and enjoy.   :-*

Report to moderator   Logged

Offline airbalancer

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Cobourg Ontario
  • Posts: 15974
  • Carma: +92/-89
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Cars: 2000 BMW 323, 2010 Toyota Prius, 2011Chevy Silverado LTZ
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #76 on: November 12, 2007, 07:30:01 am »
Quote from: Arctic_White on November 12, 2007, 12:10:34 am
Quote from: wing on November 07, 2007, 02:39:38 pm
Many never understand, it has nothing to do with high revving even.  Torque is ONLY a NUMBER.  Everyone constantly forgets to factor in gear ratio, final drive and weight.


Precisely.

As a future Si/Type S owner, and a current Mazda3 owner, I'd like to ask you how the Si compares to your Mazda3 Sport in everyday driving. 

How Wing know, has he driven is Mazda 3 more then 5000km since he got it :rofl2:
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline wing

  • Big Wig
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Location: Ottawa, On, Canada
  • Posts: 18103
  • Carma: +101/-61
  • Gender: Male
  • If you ain't first ... you're last!
    • View Profile
    • Drivesideways
  • Cars: 2001 Honda S2000; 2005 Nissan Titan
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #77 on: November 12, 2007, 08:57:56 am »
Hey I have over 8000km now -- and drove it 600+ last week.

In comparison the regular Mazda3 has a nicer interior than the Civic IMO, although the civic has more cubby holes and such if you require that.  The Mazda is also more comfortable and quiet than the civic on the road as the civic (even in 6th gear) revs rather high and sounds buzzy.

But the Civic is faster so that does offset it.  In term for daily driving they are fairly equal for power output and driveability / fun factor.
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline r3cc0s

  • Learner's Permit
  • *
  • Location: Calgary
  • Posts: 6
  • Carma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #78 on: November 20, 2007, 06:32:51 pm »
IMO the new Sentra Spec-V is worth looking at as well
apparently slightly faster 1/4 and 0-60 and slightly better on gas
likely due to more torque from a 2.5

I think it looks badder assed too
Report to moderator   Logged

Offline Mitlov

  • Car Crazy
  • *****
  • Location: Oregon, Obamaland
  • Posts: 9151
  • Carma: +0/-0
  • Gender: Male
  • James May thinks I'm cool
    • View Profile
Re: CTC Review: 2008 Honda Civic Si Sedan
« Reply #79 on: November 20, 2007, 06:54:19 pm »
Quote from: r3cc0s on November 20, 2007, 06:32:51 pm
IMO the new Sentra Spec-V is worth looking at as well
apparently slightly faster 1/4 and 0-60 and slightly better on gas
likely due to more torque from a 2.5

I think it looks badder assed too

Read this comparison review involving the Spec V before you buy.

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/12635/2007-volkswagen-gti-vs-2007-subaru-impreza-wrx-tr-vs-2007-mini-cooper-s-vs-2007-nissan-sentra-se-r-spec-v-vs-2007-mazdaspeed-3-grand-touring.html
Report to moderator   Logged
"Geography has made us neighbors. History has made us friends. Economics has made us partners. And necessity has made us allies. Those whom nature hath so joined together, let no man put asunder. What unites us is far greater than what divides us." -- John F. Kennedy, addressing Canadian Parliament.
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Up
« previous next »