Topic: trade-in vehicle question

[nohup]

Naive question around trading in my vehicle to a dealership.  I have an '02 Protege with 52K kms on it. Honda dealership offered me $6800. Mazda offered me $9200. Mazda said their appraisal includes tax. Honda made no mention of tax (I can only assume their offer includes tax). But is there anything else I need to consider when trading in my car? I didn't even think of the dealership paying tax on my trade-in until the Mazda sales person just mentioned it.

By the way, Mazda 3 GS Auto $25000.
Mazda 3 GS 5spd - $24000
Honda Fit Sport 5spd was approx $23000 I think. 

Mazda's financing rates for 48 months on the 3 is currently 1.9%, Honda is at 3.9%. The 3 is looking like the better deal at the moment...

Also wanted to mention that I was at a Suzuki dealership. Talked to the knowledgeable and friendly sales guy about the SX4. He actually sent me away without letting me take a test drive because they were closing in 15 minutes. I couldn't believe it; usually sales people are eager as all hell to get you into a test drive. Is this normal for Suzuki as a whole?

[Craig]

Impossible for me to tell what your car is worth without more info.  Here's a link to the Black Book so you can check yourself:

http://www.canadianblackbook.com/prv/auth.cfm?token=AB04DC39ZKL01

The tax is not tax they pay, but tax you save on your new car purchase.  Yes, some dealers will add PST and GST to their trade-in allowance to make it look better.  Always find out if the offer is before or after tax.

I haven't foggiest if the deals you've listed are good or not.  As always, I'd say get your hands on the invoice pricing from CCC, or if you live in Montreal or Toronto, use the APA.

[nohup]

Impossible for me to tell what your car is worth without more info.  Here's a link to the Black Book so you can check yourself:

understood; my car is worth just about what Mazda offered me. Honda tried telling me that it needs 4 new tires @ $200 each (who the hell wants $800 tires on a 5 year old Protege is beyond me...) + buff out some minor marks on the paint for a total of $1200 in deductions.

The tax is not tax they pay, but tax you save on your new car purchase. 

excuse my slowness, but I'm not sure I understand this.  Do you mean if I sell it privately, I pay tax, hence a tax savings?

[wing]

No if you sell it to the dealer when you buy your new car the trade in price is subtracted from the sale price of the new vehicle before tax, so you are only taxed on the remainder of the new vehicles price.

IE: 30,000 car  10,000 trade in, you pay tax on 20,000 not $30,000, a savings of $1400

[Craig]

excuse my slowness, but I'm not sure I understand this.  Do you mean if I sell it privately, I pay tax, hence a tax savings?

You're not slow at all.  I should have provided an example like Wing did.

Honda is trying to steal your trade.  If you like the new Honda Fit more, just sell the Protege privately.  That car will sell quickly if you ask for the right price.  I'm guessing the $9200 offered by Mazda included your tax savings.  By the range I see on Trader.ca, I bet that would fly out of your hands if you listed it for ~$10K.

[articsteve]

understood; my car is worth just about what Mazda offered me. Honda tried telling me that it needs 4 new tires @ $200 each (who the hell wants $800 tires on a 5 year old Protege is beyond me...) + buff out some minor marks on the paint for a total of $1200 in deductions.

The tax is not tax they pay, but tax you save on your new car purchase. 

excuse my slowness, but I'm not sure I understand this.  Do you mean if I sell it privately, I pay tax, hence a tax savings?

Honda tried telling me that it needs 4 new tires @ $200 each (who the hell wants $800 tires on a 5 year old Protege is beyond me...) + buff out some minor marks on the paint for a total of $1200 in deductions.

Your not bargaining properly.  Until you demonstrate to any salesperson in any dealership that you are not a mark you will be treated as such.  When a dealership gives you a number on a trade and it is low and then they try and justify the number by picking apart your trade vehicle you simply put up your hand in front of you, palm facing them, and tell them politely to STFU.  It's oh so simple.

The way to bargain, particularly if your neutral on what your buying, is to tell them to give you the very bottom line with all fees and taxes in and if it is suitable then they have a deal otherwise your going to get a Mazda or whatever and do show them the numbers from the Mazda dealer.

Regarding dealers who include the "tax savings" in their trade quote; they are treating you as an idiot.  It is also a sign that they are attempting to get full pop for the new vehicle and hence inflating the trade in price.   

Mazda moves the 3 by low financing which is attractive, but it is a different class of car than the FIT.  $23,000 for a Fit Sport sans fees and taxes is pushing it unless you absolutely love what the car has to offer.

 

[tpl]

That $23,000 for a FIT must include taxes.

[articsteve]

That $23,000 for a FIT must include taxes.

I think the poster's problem/challenge is his/her's lack of organization and resolve.

Honda Fit Sport 5spd was approx $23000 I think.

"I think".  Well it is or it isn't. 

You remember those spinning top things; where you wrap a string around this pear shaped object and you whip it forward and the things spins around in the same spot for a minute or so.  Well the majority of car buyers are just like those spinning tops.  The dealership ppl wrap a string around the customer and pull it as hard as the customer allows and even after the deal is done the customer is still spinning; clutching all those legal documents in hand that they signed without reading. 

Note to poster:  Give it another go.  This time with a pen, notebook and calculator.  And wear sun glasses even at night. 

[mmret]

You will probably get more for your car selling it privately, in any case. It may seem fairly bland but inexpensive family transpo is always in high demand. Especially for a car with very low kms like yours.

Case in point: It took me exactly 2 days to sell my 2001 Grand Am with 75k on it (and it was a base model!), for $300 under asking price. I got something like 3-4 phone calls a day for a week after I had sold it even.

[articsteve]

I got something like 3-4 phone calls a day for a week after I had sold it even.

Ya, but that's Hamilton; the preferred car of choice, with deep tint of course

[Cord]

It took me exactly 2 days to sell my 2001 Grand Am with 75k on it (and it was a base model!), for $300 under asking price. I got something like 3-4 phone calls a day for a week after I had sold it even.

All that means is that you could've sold it for more. I see lots of people driving around with sun-faded For Sale signs taped to their windows. For them it means they need to ask less.

[nohup]

Your not bargaining properly.  Until you demonstrate to any salesperson in any dealership that you are not a mark you will be treated as such.  When a dealership gives you a number on a trade and it is low and then they try and justify the number by picking apart your trade vehicle you simply put up your hand in front of you, palm facing them, and tell them politely to STFU.  It's oh so simple.

I wasn't bargaining at all. I told them I wanted their price on the Fit Sport 5spd + fees + tax and they returned w/ $23K and some change .. then they appraised my vehicle at $6800.  I know the $6800 is a ripoff.

Anyway, I'm trying to build a shortlist of 2 or 3 cars, then take them out for second test drives and go back for the "bottom line" price.

Thanks for everyones advice.

[mmret]

It took me exactly 2 days to sell my 2001 Grand Am with 75k on it (and it was a base model!), for $300 under asking price. I got something like 3-4 phone calls a day for a week after I had sold it even.

All that means is that you could've sold it for more. I see lots of people driving around with sun-faded For Sale signs taped to their windows. For them it means they need to ask less.

Ah, but a month before that I had it listed in the same manner, with an asking price $400 higher, and I got 2 calls in 2 weeks.

$400 made a difference between tons of interest and hardly any. It confused me

[DoubleClutch]

That $23,000 for a FIT must include taxes.

I think the poster's problem/challenge is his/her's lack of organization and resolve.

Honda Fit Sport 5spd was approx $23000 I think.

"I think".  Well it is or it isn't. 

Why bother asking what the prices of the car is anyways ... you can get all the info off the manufacturer's web-site. I'm never bothered by the prices until I'm ready to buy. At which point I'm only interested in what BS fees the dealer wants to add on top of the sticker price.

[DoubleClutch]

Your not bargaining properly.  Until you demonstrate to any salesperson in any dealership that you are not a mark you will be treated as such.  When a dealership gives you a number on a trade and it is low and then they try and justify the number by picking apart your trade vehicle you simply put up your hand in front of you, palm facing them, and tell them politely to STFU.  It's oh so simple.

I wasn't bargaining at all. I told them I wanted their price on the Fit Sport 5spd + fees + tax and they returned w/ $23K and some change .. then they appraised my vehicle at $6800.  I know the $6800 is a ripoff.

Anyway, I'm trying to build a shortlist of 2 or 3 cars, then take them out for second test drives and go back for the "bottom line" price.

Thanks for everyones advice.

I recommend you pick the car that you LIKE best, not the one that has the best deal (unless the prices difference is a lot ... you have to decide what a lot is to you). The price diff between the Fit and Mazda3 is nominal. It's more important to get the car that you'll like and want to keep for a long time. And like another poster had suggested, go to APA if available in your area or get a Car Cost Canada price report.

[articsteve]

I wasn't bargaining at all. I told them I wanted their price on the Fit Sport 5spd + fees + tax and they returned w/ $23K and some change .. then they appraised my vehicle at $6800.  I know the $6800 is a ripoff.

Anyway, I'm trying to build a shortlist of 2 or 3 cars, then take them out for second test drives and go back for the "bottom line" price.

Thanks for everyones advice.

Ok, I was a little critical perhaps, but you are very vague in your details.  What model of Protege is it?  Auto, AC?  Your car in Ontario, providing there are no dings, and it being an ES standard shift without AC would fetch 7K - 7.5K. Trade price depends on whether there is a discount being offered on the new model.  The market is gushing with Mazda 3s, but I think Fits are holding their price.  Give the Suzuki another go.

Beware of dealers who include tax savings in the price of the trade.  That's real BS.   

[nohup]

Ok, I was a little critical perhaps, but you are very vague in your details.  What model of Protege is it?  Auto, AC?  Your car in Ontario, providing there are no dings, and it being an ES standard shift without AC would fetch 7K - 7.5K. Trade price depends on whether there is a discount being offered on the new model.  The market is gushing with Mazda 3s, but I think Fits are holding their price.  Give the Suzuki another go.

It's the Protege ES GT (GT pkg is the psunroof, spoiler, 16" alloy wheels) automatic with AC. On trader.ca similar cars are listed @$10K in Halifax.

http://canadatrader.com/result/detailinfo.aspx?ID=26472949&pgno=2&srt=1
is at the high end.

I think I'll try it on the private market for around $10K and see how it goes.

[articsteve]

In light that it is a loaded model in auto I think that's the way to go.  Always be prepared to drop a max. of $500. as a matter of course.  List for $9995. or BO and see what happens.

[syin]

Ah, but a month before that I had it listed in the same manner, with an asking price $400 higher, and I got 2 calls in 2 weeks.

$400 made a difference between tons of interest and hardly any. It confused me

Where did you post?  Did you edit your post or did you make a new one with a lower price (hence people can see that you lowered your price)?  I'm also trying to sell one privately (www.digital-sky.ca/sky/ml320e) and am setting the price around the prices I found for similar models online.  Not many responses though.  If I don't get much more than what dealers offer for a trade-in, i might not bother with private...

[mmret]

Ah, but a month before that I had it listed in the same manner, with an asking price $400 higher, and I got 2 calls in 2 weeks.

$400 made a difference between tons of interest and hardly any. It confused me

Where did you post?  Did you edit your post or did you make a new one with a lower price (hence people can see that you lowered your price)?  I'm also trying to sell one privately (www.digital-sky.ca/sky/ml320e) and am setting the price around the prices I found for similar models online.  Not many responses though.  If I don't get much more than what dealers offer for a trade-in, i might not bother with private...

Did it on autotrader...so essentially I made a new post. Exactly the same but with a lowered price.