Official: Gas Guzzler Tax Discussion

[Titanium48]

And every Police Force in Canada will have their budgets made worse; less money for enforcement.  This federal gas guzzler tax is not refundable like the GST. 

According to the numbers I found on Ford's US website, the Crown Victoria's fuel consumption (17 MPG city and 26 MPG highway, or 13.8 and 9.0 L/100km) is not high enough to trigger a fee.

[EV Dan]

How on earth Impala and Monte Carlo get a grand in rebate  Did u ever see an E85 in Toronto for sale to public?

[Seafoam]

 I think the government's list for fuel efficient cars is too low.Meaning not enough fuel misers on their list. Some of GM's cars such as the cobalt and pursuit get good fuel economy but aren't included in the list. It's not broad enough and the government would go broke anyway.   

[Seafoam]

How on earth and Impala and Monte Carlo get a grand in rebate  Did u ever see an E85 in Toronto for sale to public?

Yeah none out here either. When they interviewed the finance minister
last night the interviewer asked if he would buy a hybrid. He said he would buy an Impala built in Oshawa trading in his little Caddy CTS.He is really giving up a lot.

[99 Silver]

From Acticsteve:

"All for the sake of the "green vote", pure politics"   

Yes just like the Liberals ratifying Kyoto knowing full well that there isn't a snowballs chance in hell that we will make the targets and then hiring a comedian to sell it to us!

Save your off topic rantings for the political forum.

This is going to cost the BIG 3 in Canada plenty in lost sales/money.  It's going to further assist Japanese makers that don't need it.  That and the hypocrisy about taxing SUVs while passing on 1/2 ton pleasure only crew cabs is bad government tax policy.   

You are accusing me of ranting?  Look in the mirror my friend!  You are the master!

[Wheeled]

forgive my ignorance,Is this tax in effect now or does it have a upcoming start date.

Looked at the tax site (dubdubdub.budget.gc.ca/2007/bp/bptoce.html) but all i got was   Yadda Yadda Yadda 

[Mitlov]

You are accusing me of ranting?  Look in the mirror my friend!  You are the master!

He's not just accusing you of ranting, but he's accusing you of ranting about politics.  This is from a guy who brought up the Vietnam War in a thread about a girl killed by a power window, and George W Bush/the Iraq War in a thread about ethanol-compatible vehicles.

Reply #29:
http://www.canadiandriver.com/forum/index.php/topic,51112.20.html

Reply #30:
http://www.canadiandriver.com/forum/index.php?topic=47353.20

[rrocket]

It's hardly the governments fault this will hurt the Big 3.  It's the Big 3's fault...they've forgotten how to build cars!!  Is it the governments fault that Ford chose to invest hundreds of millions in the F-150 rather than a car project?  The Big 3 have staked their existence on the sales of SUVs and trucks.  They've nearly forgotten how to make a decent car.  And it's not like this is a shock.  The whole green thing and fuel conservation in autodom has been talked about for the last 5 years at least. 

So while the Imports "get it" and start developing greener, cleaner cars and hybrids, the Big 3 invest the lion's share of their budgets on truck products.  The Imports continue to evolve with the market.  The Domestics don't have a clue.  There is no reason that the Big 3 can't build cars as good or better than the imports, and there's no reason the Big 3 can't leap-frog over the imports as far as hybrids go.  The have the engineering people, the work force and the prowess to do it...IF they wanted to.  But they don't want to put the work in.  Let's put the blame where it really belongs: The Big 3 have been asleep at the wheel FOR YEARS.  I say GOOD...maybe this is the kick in the a$$ the Big 3 need to start developing some exciting new cars and to set them on a better business model.

[airbalancer]

How on earth and Impala and Monte Carlo get a grand in rebate  Did u ever see an E85 in Toronto for sale to public?

Yeah none out here either. When they interviewed the finance minister
last night the interviewer asked if he would buy a hybrid. He said he would buy an Impala built in Oshawa trading in his little Caddy CTS.He is really giving up a lot.

His riding is in Oshawa what do you want him to say. The Impala and MC are built in Oshawa

[johngenx]

For everyone that is posting "why isn't blah blah car on the government list?

THE LIST IS A SAMPLE AND NOT COMPREHENSIVE OR COMPLETE.

[Allen]

Drop in the bucket makes a lot of waves
GREG KEENAN

From Thursday's Globe and Mail

Unhappy auto companies that sell subcompact cars are revising marketing plans and sales forecasts now that Ottawa has provided a competitive advantage to Toyota Canada Inc. with environmental provisions in the new federal budget.

The provisions will affect virtually every auto maker in the country, but the most significant impact will come in the subcompact segment of the market, where Toyota's Yaris gets a fraction better fuel economy than cars offered by competitors.

Under the government's plan, Yaris buyers will receive a $1,000 rebate from Ottawa, while people who drive off dealers' lots in competing cars such as the Chevrolet Aveo, Honda Fit, Hyundai Accent, Nissan Versa and Suzuki Swift are out of luck. “What we're concerned about is letting one [model] in a very price-sensitive segment of the market receive the rebate when all the vehicles in that segment of the market are fuel efficient,” Hyundai Auto Canada president Steve Kelleher said yesterday.

Hyundai's Accent uses 6.9 litres of gas to travel 100 kilometres, which means it misses by just four-tenths of a litre in qualifying for the new federal rebate for fuel-efficient vehicles introduced in the budget on Monday.

Buyers of cars that use less than 6.5 litres of gas to go 100 kilometres will receive a rebate of at least $1,000. The Toyota Yaris, rated by Natural Resources Canada at 6.4 litres, qualifies for the $1,000.

The Honda Fit, which has a rating of 6.6 litres for every 100 kilometres, doesn't make the grade.

“The Honda guys are fit to be tied,” a source at another auto maker said yesterday.

Honda Canada Inc. refused to comment.

“We're not going to negotiate with the government through the media,” spokeswoman Sandy Di Felice said.

A rebate of $1,000 is a major advantage in a segment of the market where the vehicles sell in the $12,000 to $14,000 range.

“It's huge,” said one auto industry president.

Mr. Kelleher said he agrees that promoting more fuel-efficient vehicles is a good idea on the part of the federal government.

But trying to compensate for an instant and unexpected $1,000 cost disadvantage on a vehicle that represented 40 per cent of Hyundai's passenger car sales last year is “going to be an uphill battle,” he acknowledged yesterday.

The Accent has one of the best warranties available, he said, at five years or 100,000 kilometres, and offers what he argues is the best content and value in the segment.

“We're really going to have to play up on those attributes and try to hit those attributes home with Canadians,” he said.

At Nissan Canada Inc., president Mark Grimm figures his company will start marketing Versa's larger interior size and superior crash performance.

“That's a lot of money at that end,” Mr. Grimm said of the $1,000 rebate. “You're talking $14,000 cars – $1,000 is a lot of money.”

Ottawa's new “feebate” scheme smacks Nissan at both ends of the market. Versa misses the fuel-efficiency rebate by about six-tenths of a litre of gas. The Pathfinder mid-sized sport utility vehicle is subject to the new federal gas guzzler tax because it uses 13.1 litres to travel 100 kilometres.

The penalty line for what the federal government considers gas guzzlers starts at 13 litres.

“It's a change in the competitive landscape and we're just going to have to adjust and move forward,” Mr. Grimm said.

Industry sources said the fuel-efficiency line of 6.5 litres was chosen because at higher levels, such as seven litres, too many vehicles would be eligible for the credit.

“What we're looking at is fuel-efficient cars,” federal Transport Minister Lawrence Cannon told reporters yesterday when asked why 6.5 litres was established as the benchmark.

“We have to start at some level,” Mr. Cannon said. “We're going to be monitoring this quite closely. We will see how this goes.”

Toyota managing director Stephen Beatty applauded the government again yesterday for taking what he said is necessary action.

“If you take climate change as a real, serious threat, then it isn't about doing something 20 years from now,” Mr. Beatty said after a speech to the Economic Club of Toronto. “We applaud them for taking concerted, comprehensive action.”

He said Toyota did not lobby for the incentive scheme for fuel-efficient cars – most of which are hybrid models – noting that the auto maker brought the Prius to North America in the 1990s without any incentives.

But it stands to benefit immensely. Yaris was the fourth best-selling passenger car in Canada last year with 34,202 sales.

None of the other vehicles eligible for the rebate came close to that level of sales.

[tpl]

"Industry sources said the fuel-efficiency line of 6.5 litres was chosen because at higher levels, such as seven litres, too many vehicles would be eligible for the credit.
"
well why would they care how many qualify... if the idea is to get people to drive cars with good fuel economy.  Easy to compensate financially, just move the levy numbers down a bit to balance it out... or add trucks sold to the public into the list.

[tpl]

Here is a question... does this only apply to 2007 and later my cars?   What happens if one buys a NEW undriven 2006 Golf/Jetta diesel, assuming that meets the standard. My local dealer had 4 Golf diesels on the lot a couple of weeks back.
 Interesting that VW.ca no longer lists the economy ratings for the Jetta Diesels...must be some weird gov reg or marketing thing.

[Allen]

It's hardly the governments fault this will hurt the Big 3.  It's the Big 3's fault...they've forgotten how to build cars!! 

That's why they are not the Big 3 anymore, just the Detroit 3

[UmroAyyar]

Here is a question... does this only apply to 2007 and later my cars?   What happens if one buys a NEW undriven 2006 Golf/Jetta diesel, assuming that meets the standard. My local dealer had 4 Golf diesels on the lot a couple of weeks back.
 Interesting that VW.ca no longer lists the economy ratings for the Jetta Diesels...must be some weird gov reg or marketing thing.

2006 model year cars which have not been on the road, registered, bought as new qualify, IIRC. I'll try to find the correct reference and wording.

Here it is.
New 2006 vehicles that have never been registered for use in Canada, and meet the program’s fuel consumption criteria will be eligible. A complete list of eligible 2006 vehicles will be posted in the near future.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/programs/environment/ecotransport/ecoauto.htm

[Snowman]

  We have 4 threads on this subject….time for a mind meld. Brig?

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Here is a question... does this only apply to 2007 and later my cars?   What happens if one buys a NEW undriven 2006 Golf/Jetta diesel, assuming that meets the standard. My local dealer had 4 Golf diesels on the lot a couple of weeks back.
 Interesting that VW.ca no longer lists the economy ratings for the Jetta Diesels...must be some weird gov reg or marketing thing.

2006 model year cars which have not been on the road, registered, bought as new qualify, IIRC. I'll try to find the correct reference and wording.

Here it is.
New 2006 vehicles that have never been registered for use in Canada, and meet the program’s fuel consumption criteria will be eligible. A complete list of eligible 2006 vehicles will be posted in the near future.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/programs/environment/ecotransport/ecoauto.htm

 

What I find interesting is cargo/cube vans (which are essentially work 'tool' vehicles) don't appear to be exempt like trucks, which are often used more for personal use.

[mwqa]

Wow, it looks like everyone, even at the subcompact end, are shaken up by this new policy. Exciting times.

No doubt the Conservatives will be 'tweaking' things a little.

[Wheeled]

Anyone know when this guzzler tax comes into effect or a Url to the info please.

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Has already, the 20th.