The hype over VW's quality problems

[initial_D]

I'm very happy that you have found a brand that you love so enthusiastically, but the simple fact is that many of us have owned both VWs (and other European cars) and also Japanese cars. While VWs have much to recommend them, for too many us, our personal experiences tend to indicate that reliability is NOT a strong point. I MIGHT consider driving another ONLY if: 1) I did not intend to own it past warranty coverage; 2) had a conveniently local dealer (I don't); 3) that dealer was set up for wireless internet so I could post while waiting for my car - yet again.

Again, whatever numbers you use, it turns out that the difference between the best and the worst manufacturers after three or five years is one or two problems. If you’ve had considerably more than the average of 3.35 (actually 2.99 according to the latest JD Power long-term survey) problems with your VW, then statistically, a lot of people have had less than the average number of problems to make the average what it is.

I’m looking at the 2006 JD Power long-term quality survey and there are 9 Asian manufacturers that finish below average. Mazda is 0.56 problems per car better than VW but Suzuki is 0.19 problems worse! Suzuki owners must have some real horror stories to tell if their cars are less reliable than VWs!

At least three other people have presented three different ideas, yet you failed to reply to any of them.

What gives?

For a university-educated student, shouldn't one strive to learn and understand?  Listen, think, and appreciate other people's ideas/opinions?  I'm not positive, but it appears that you're very narrow-focused.  Shouldn't you have an open-mind?  If you want a discussion, we're all up for it.  But please, respect first.

BTW... Did you even read other people's comments? 

I doubt very much he has read the comments of those who refuse to bow down to his superior intellect.  He strikes me as the type who can only hear the sound of his own voice - and never ever gets tired of it.

Jaeger

What up with that?  Didn't the Prof taught anything useful in class? Or is everything just multiple choice ... point and click ... then shoot - OFF -- thy mouth? 

No worries ... we have solutions for all problems. 

[sirAQUAMAN64]

http://www.baileycar.com/CReliability.html

 

"The new Hyundai Azera tops the large-sedan category, with excellent predicted reliability. The V6 model of the Volkswagen Passat (the model Wing tested),
which was redesigned for 2006, rated above average, while four-cylinder version of the Passat is below average."

For me, I believe the Mk V Jetta and Rabbit/Golf/GTI are tracking vastly improved reliability-wise than the Mk IV cars (the '99.5-'02s in particular are notorious) and are the most reliable VWs currently or recently available. I would have zero difficulty recommending them to someone in the market, whereas I would have hesitated on the IV's for anyone but the few who appreciate the VW's strong points. The Beetle and City Golf + Jetta have their quirks, but I think mechanically and major components are sound. New Passat started with some niggles, but not terribly so. Some Eos owners are reporting roof leak issues - will have to see how that goes, and I haven't compared with C70, G6 'vert, or MX-5 PRHT owner issues where the same might be true. Touareg has improved 1,000% since '03-04 intro, but still would rank it average at best. So much friggin' technology and heft in that beast.

[Snowman]

Fellow members,

James has warned us that this thread will be shut down if we don’t move on. The intent of this thread and of the person who started it was to provoke the exact responses which you are posting. I could understand if the individual in question was making positive contributions elsewhere on this site but he or she has not.

Trolls drop bombs and wait for reactions to feed their need for attention. I highly doubt that the individual is an automobile enthusiast and it would be best not to escalate this further. I see no sign of intelligent life here; let’s move on to realistic automotive discussions.

Cheers,

Rob

[AVToller]

  but what did you do with the real Snowy??  You sound so reasonable, controlled, dispassionate. 

[safristi]

why can't we feed the pet troll till he BLOWS UP REAL GOOD??

[Snowman]

but what did you do with the real Snowy??  You sound so reasonable, controlled, dispassionate. 

I won’t let this happen again, I promise.

[Careener]

For me, I believe the Mk V Jetta and Rabbit/Golf/GTI are tracking vastly improved reliability-wise than the Mk IV cars (the '99.5-'02s in particular are notorious) and are the most reliable VWs currently or recently available. I would have zero difficulty recommending them to someone in the market, whereas I would have hesitated on the IV's for anyone but the few who appreciate the VW's strong points. The Beetle and City Golf + Jetta have their quirks, but I think mechanically and major components are sound. New Passat started with some niggles, but not terribly so. Some Eos owners are reporting roof leak issues - will have to see how that goes, and I haven't compared with C70, G6 'vert, or MX-5 PRHT owner issues where the same might be true. Touareg has improved 1,000% since '03-04 intro, but still would rank it average at best. So much friggin' technology and heft in that beast.

I'd have to agree that things are looking up. I don't hesitate to recommend people to look at the GTI as an alternative to a CSX or Civic SI etc.
I have read some complaints about the Eos already including no-start, leaks, and electrical gremlins. Hopefully those will be worked out but I've always wondered whether VWs electrical issues stem from some bad engineering that they can't seem to get beyond.

[safristi]

Wot Wifey released yer "jewels"?

[2latecrew]

I want VW's issues to be over so badly.

I really like the GTI 5 door and I even don't find the GLI ugly as I do the chrome nosed Jetta. I had a German built 86 GLI. Lowered suspension, koni shocks, spoilers and a stebro exhaust (long before coffee can exhausts were popular). very fond memories of the body hugging sports seats, the heavy but direct manual steering AND THE GENERAL WELL BUILT FEEL OF THE CAR.


I even have a close friend who is an F and I manger at VW. I want to believe I could buy a VW and be happy.

but even .5 more problems than average is too much for me. Yes you could have one car with 900problems and 1 with 0 . I'm not willing to take the chance I'd get the one with  900.

the NUMBER of problems is largely irrelevant. Its the nature of the problems and also the repeatability OF THE PROBLEM.

My Volvo has had about 7 "problems". But if one of the problems ends up making you have the car aligned 10 times and eats a set of tires its far worse than 2 problems where you take it back to the dealer ONCE and have a part replaced.

I place no faith in that survey or the numbers extracted from something. It doesn't prove Vw reliability is good or bad.

A survey of unscheduled maintenance. A survey of $s spent to repair or days off the road. these matter to people.

There are lies. there are damm lies and then there are statistics.

[safristi]

WOTS an " F and I  Manger!!!!"..(sic) ............I'm scared to arsk? ..NO I'm NOT what is an EFF and Eye Manager?

[VW_Enthusiast]

Oh, and BTW, almost anyone who has graduated from a high school with a Math 11 minimum could follow your simple math in your first post. 

I used to believe that that was true until I started communicating with people on various forums about these types of things (basic statistics). It turns out that according to the U.S. government’s National Assessment of Adult Literacy survey only 13% of the adult population can show quantitative literacy proficiency

 http://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/index.asp?file=KeyFindings/Demographics/Overall.asp&PageId=16

and according to the American Institutes for Research, only 34% of four year college grads can show quantitative literacy proficiency (look at Fig. 2.2 on page 19 in the link below)

http://www.air.org/news/documents/The%20Literacy%20of%20Americas%20College%20Students_final%20report.pdf

Quantitative literacy is defined on page 4 of the above document as: “The knowledge and skills required to perform quantitative literacy tasks, that is, to identify and perform computations, either alone or sequentially, using numbers embedded in printed material. Quantitative examples include balancing a checkbook, figuring out a tip, completing an order form, or determining the amount of interest on a loan from an advertisement.”


See also http://www2.literacy.bc.ca/facts/inCanada.htm

[VW_Enthusiast]

At least three other people have presented three different ideas, yet you failed to reply to any of them.

What gives?

For a university-educated student, shouldn't one strive to learn and understand?  Listen, think, and appreciate other people's ideas/opinions?  I'm not positive, but it appears that you're very narrow-focused.  Shouldn't you have an open-mind?  If you want a discussion, we're all up for it.  But please, respect first.

BTW... Did you even read other people's comments? 

I would love to see someone state their case by doing the math using the JD Powers or CR numbers. I’m not interested in the subjective or peoples’ opinions I want to see some valid mathematical reasoning.

[wing]

^ More math?  (Sigh) I thought this thread was on the move when SAM posted something else..... unfortunately....