Topic: Best and worst car dealers

[Xman]

As mentioned in my previous post, my experience in buying with Carstairs Ford was amazing, especially compared to CMP Classic.
We had shopped around for a new 4 x 4 Quad Cab truck, and had looked at this one on the lot in Carstairs twice.  Finally we went in a third time & I drove it, really liked it, and made a deal.  Part of the deal was the additional accessory package Ford was offering at the time, which I chose a bug deflector, mud flaps, and a spray in box liner.
We made the deal on a Tuesday @ 1800, and by the time we both got done work the following day and back to the dealership (1700 by that time), what do I find when we drive up?  My new truck parked front & center right at the front door, all shined up, bug deflector on, mud flaps on, & box liner installed (they had the installation company come from Calgary that morning, pick it up, drive it to Calgary, spray in the box liner, and return it to the dealership later in the morning).
Also, they had arranged insurance, purchased the new plates, and everything.  All I had to do was get in it & drive away.
Very positive experience.  No pressure whatsoever from the salesman (Brian), and very informative as to the features of the truck (they have even offered that if it is ever in for service, they will give me another car or truck off the lot to use in the interim @ no charge).

Just the way a buying experience should be.  Never again dealing with a high volume city dealership, when I can get customer service like this.

[JBrill]

The worst I have dealt with was Tony Graham Toyota in Ottawa.

I was recently in the need for a minivan and was doing tons of research (including following the still on-going Minivan Challenge  ) and narrowed down my needs: it had to have leather, power sliding doors, power tailgate, and movable 2nd row seats to allow greater side access to the back.  This narrowed the field down to the Toyota Sienna and Honda Odyssey.  I also had a mental ceiling of $40k before taxes and financing.  Unfortunately, that took the Honda Odyssey out of the running as only the Touring model at $48k met the need.

Anyways, now having narrowed it down to the Toyota Sienna, time to go see it in person, try it out, make an offer.

I arrive at Tony Graham at 12:00 noon on a Thursday.  Sorry, all sales reps are on their lunch break.  Odd but ok, can I make an appointment for 6:00 p.m. then.  I want to take a look at a Toyota Sienna LE with "C Package".

Show up at 6:00 p.m., sorry, all of our 08 Sienna's are locked up in the body shop for the night, would an 07 CE be ok?  No, I want to drive the car I might buy.  Can we book an appointment for the next day at noon?  During the salesman lunch hour?  Ok, guess they can do that 

12:00 noon the next day.  Sorry, we don't have any 08 Sienna's with leather.  Would you like to see an 08 with fabric just to get a feel?  I said "a feel for what?  How good the leather quality is?"

Anyways, said they could have one shipped from T.O. if I leave a deposit.   Asked them what their best price was.  Salesman writes up an offer sheet.  MSRP.  I laugh and asked if he was kidding.  Nope, selling like hot cakes.  I said fine, off to the U.S.A. I go then.  Must of hit a nerve.  Tells me to wait while he checks with the manager.  New offer, $2.5k off MSRP.  I counter offer with $8k off of MSRP.  Salesman leaves and come back with an angry manager.  Manager proceeds to berate me in front of salesman    I told him, $8k off of CDN MSRP is still $4k more than US MSRP which shows I'm not unreasonable, want to keep my business in Canada but don't want to get hosed.  He told me to get the #$%@ out of his dealership.

That evening I get an email rant from the manager about becoming the 51st state, how unpatriotic I was, and how it should be US prices that go up, not CDN prices that go down.  I fire off an email back, copying the dealership owner, letting them know that such behaviour is very unprofessional and they would never see me again.

Now, thoroughly pissed off, I look for Sienna's in the US.  Unfortunately, Toyota USA is protecting their CDN brothers, won't sell to Canadians.  Low and behold, Honda will (at the time they still did  ).  I find a fully loaded Honda Odyssey Touring for less than my offer on a Toyota Sienna LE.  Not only do I get the options I want, I also get DVD and NAV for less!

Felt really good to go back to Tony Graham and showing the dealer my new wheels.  Thought the manager was going to pop a vein when 6 clients left the dealership to ask me how easy it was to import from US. 

JB

[2latecrew]

I'm not surprised at the poor service from the service Dept in Calgary. Just be thankful your were not in a collision. Many body shops are booked 4 to 6 MONTHS out now. There was already a shortage of body shop technicians and now any joe can get a job with no skills out west paying MORE than a Master Body Technician makes. Shops are closing down all over the place becuse they can't get people. Insurance companies are paying bonuses just to get a shop to work on their cars.

I can only imagine that mechanics are not easy to come by.

[1TSX]

I'm not surprised at the poor service from the service Dept in Calgary. Just be thankful your were not in a collision. Many body shops are booked 4 to 6 MONTHS out now. There was already a shortage of body shop technicians and now any joe can get a job with no skills out west paying MORE than a Master Body Technician makes. Shops are closing down all over the place becuse they can't get people. Insurance companies are paying bonuses just to get a shop to work on their cars.

I can only imagine that mechanics are not easy to come by.

 

[Cord]

That evening I get an email rant from the manager about becoming the 51st state, how unpatriotic I was, and how it should be US prices that go up, not CDN prices that go down.  I fire off an email back, copying the dealership owner, letting them know that such behaviour is very unprofessional and they would never see me again.

Just curious - at what point in the process did you give them your email address?

[JBrill]

That evening I get an email rant from the manager about becoming the 51st state, how unpatriotic I was, and how it should be US prices that go up, not CDN prices that go down.  I fire off an email back, copying the dealership owner, letting them know that such behaviour is very unprofessional and they would never see me again.

Just curious - at what point in the process did you give them your email address?

I gave the sales rep my business card the night before when the Sienna's were "in the body shop" so that he could begin crunching some numbers to email me a quote (which, of course, they never did) or to contact me should they need to reschedule (again, which they never did knowing they didn't have the vehicle I wanted to view).

[Careener]

Changsta - I bought a car there too. The sales manager at the time I bought was a real piece of work. I ended up losing it on the phone which never ever happens with me.
Needless to say but I haven't set foot back in there since..not even for warranty work.
Hint..its owned by the same folks as Markham Honda...

[TVTar]

Bad:
After our Mazda Protege 2002 got totaled, we were ready to buy Toyota Corolla 2008 (CE, Enhanced Convenience package) and so we went to Toyotatown in London, Ontario. Told a salesman about our intentions and also that we wanted to do it quickly and were looking for a good bottom line price (i.e. don't care what "administration" fees they include into the price and don't care about "good" monthly payments).

The salesman showed us the car, talked through the options, etc so far so good. Then he tried to up-sell us 20th Anniversary Edition instead of CE saying that it'd be cheaper for us; I've noticed it was actually $300 or so more expensive and when asked about it he explained he meant it'd be cheaper if compared price of all the features included (??). Yeah, right... but whatever - just sell me a car. So, he started talking monthly payments. I mentioned once again monthly payments were irrelevant - just give me a good price. So off he goes to talk to his Sales Manager. They were talking in their fishbowl for 10 minutes, the guy comes back and starts talking.... monthly payments. I had to ask for the bottom line price three or four times, it was as if he was deaf.

Anyway, the Salesman and Sales Manager put on a show for two hours, using all the infamous car dealership theatrics, and in all that time they gave us just $200 discount from overblown price. My wife got enough of them and so we left. I was planning to come back and plow through it again but luckily she got a better idea - and here comes the good.

Good:
My wife decided to give a call to two-three dealerships in smaller towns around London. Surprisingly for me, all of them were willing to quote over the phone and were quite interested in our business. The best (i.e. the best price and the quickest response) came from Woodstock Toyota, so we decided to drive there (50 km on 401) and take a look. It had to be after 5 pm and the salesman there, Mark Frias, was working till 2 pm that day. So he gave us his cell phone number and offered to come to work and deal with us if we were coming that day. Quite impressive.

So we drove to Woodstock, I was ready for the usual car sale tricks but instead the actual price was $50 LESS than quoted over the phone. I guess they've been thinking new license plates and we didn't need them.
So Mark brought me cup of coffee (I sure appreciated it at the end of my long day), went through minor additional details, took deposit, and escorted us to Harry's office (who is the financing guy there). Harry went through usual spiel about extended warranty and undercoating and actually was quite convincing. He took my "no, thanks" from the first time and without any problem. No pressure, no pushing, again quite surprising.

I came by couple days later to pick up the car. Mark and Harry put through the paperwork, the car was ready, we chit-chatted a bit about Canadian history and that was it! No nasty surprises, no delays, no more $$$ here and there; just great respectful attitude, quick work, and professionalism. It looked like they actually appreciated our business. All in all, just the thing I was looking for and didn't expect to come by.

So now I am thinking about servicing in Woodstock Toyota as well. Sure it is a 50 km drive but I won't be questioning the necessity of every repair/charge they are making. Well, at least if they preserve that same great feel about them.

[1TSX]

Thanks for your experience. We too, had a s***** experience at ToyotaTown. Never stepping into that dealership again.

[Greg B.]

Worst experience by far was at Colonial Honda in Halifax. All went well at first; sales guy let me drive a Civic Si and then an Accord, seemed to know the cars reasonably well, etc. Then we get back to the dealership and it goes downhill fast. The usual "are you willing to buy today?" treatment. Actually, I was, and told him that, assuming we could agree on a price, since that hadn't been discussed yet. "I don't want to give you a price until I know you're willing to buy" was his response. Huh? He was asking me to sign what amounts to a blank cheque. We went back and forth for a while, with me getting more and more incredulous, and with him still not willing to give me a price even as a starting point, until I walked away.

Went from there to Hillcrest VW up the street. Looked at a couple of new GTIs, liked them, and they made me two offers, one on a brand-new one in the color I liked best, the other on a dealer demo in black with a sunroof, which wasn't on my list of options. After some very minor back-and-forth on price I ended buying the black one and it was the best car I ever owned.   

Second-best was Forbes Chev in Dartmouth. My Intrigue was on their used lot a a Certifed used car. They gave me the keys and let me go off alone. Came back, they gave me a price, I countered, they accepted. Service department has been iffy, but no real horror stories. Dealer service stories are never good.

My worst was at Towne Toyota (now O'Regan's Toyota) in the late 80s with my MR2. It developed a hesitation. Took it in, they diagnosed a coolant leak into one of the spark plug wells. Did the repair. A few days later the car pegs the temp gauge suddenly. Shut it down, have it taken in. Days go by, they never call, my calls never get the answers I ask for. Finally I get a call that it is ready.

I get presented with a bill for $2300. They basically redid the top end of the engine along with mucho coolant system work. I laugh, tell them that car worked great until they got their hands on it. I hear heated argument in office between service manager and someone else. Finally I am given the keys and told to drive away, no charge. This is the same dealer that had to replace my stereo 3 times before I got one that worked. Maybe they're better now, I dunno.

[RollaXRS10]

My nomination for the worst dealer comes from Winnipeg - Birchwood Pontiac Buick GMC in the Birchwood Auto Mall, part of the Birchwood Automobile Group, owned by the Chipman family here in Winnipeg.

I see Mr. Christie:


Which one is Doogie? 
http://birchwoodpontiac.ca/team_sales.php

[Wetson]

Scarborough Lexus Toyota.  I was looking at the Lexus 250 and 350 series and not ONE sales person approached or greeted after 10 minutes of looking.  I was thoroughly disgusted and walked out.  (Hey Brig... remember that magical moment we had in a 350 at the auto show in 07?... too bad it didn't carry over to the stealership). 

[Highlander60]

Roussel Toyota, Mirimachi, NB
Had a really bad experience at Roussel Toyota in Mirimachi the past week. Tried to deal on a truck they had on the internet and the sale of my existing truck did not go as planned. I had made a deposit of $500.00 on their truck subject to my selling my truck as planned, which fell through at the price originally agreed. Roussel Toyota then refused to refund my deposit, after only holding the truck 2 days. Pretty bad customer relations in my mind. I had not signed anything or even seen their truck yet, but I guess that's how they deal with customers in Mirimachi. Fred Roussel was then arrogant and smug with me on the phone when he finally did get back to me. I am just retiring after 25 years in the military, and just finished my last tour in Afghanistan. I have owned Toyota's the entire journey, and planned to buy my dream truck with my severence pay. I plan on contacting the BBB in NB, Visa, and Toyota Regional Customer Service. Any other suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.

[quadzilla]

I had made a deposit of $500.00 on their truck subject to my selling my truck as planned, which fell through at the price originally agreed.

<snip>

I had not signed anything or even seen their truck yet, but I guess that's how they deal with customers in Mirimachi.

Why did you give them any money if you didn't have any deal on paper yet?  That doesn't make any sense.

[Gardiner Westbound]

Good
Infiniti FX: Excellent salesman. Did my strategic “walk away". He followed up by telephone and came in $500 under my target price. Pleasant surprise! Told the salesman I would not meet with the heat merchant, up-selling is a deal breaker. Salesman introduced us to the service manager assigned to look after our car. Terrific car. Good people. Thinking about buying an Infiniti M.

Good
Toyota Camry: Fantastic salesman! Telephone deal. Price agreed. Appointment for Saturday. Car was on the ramp ready to go. Signed the paperwork and handed over the check. No up-selling. On the road in an hour. Good car. Good people. Unfortunate dealer is too far away for routine maintenance.

Bad
Toyota Camry: Saleslady thought she was Angelina Jolie. Not hardly. She had more hard miles on her than most of the used cars on the back lot. She priced options by the monthly payment amount, as in "X" is only $15 a month, notwithstanding we had said nothing about financing. Couldn't pry a straight answer out of her. Finally told her she has five minutes to provide a firm written price quotation else we will leave. Five minutes later we were outta there.

Ugly
Acura MDX: Salesman wanted to photocopy my driver’s license, said it's obligatory. Not gonna happen, unnecessary and risky. Sales manager eyeballed us and told him to skip it. Too many alternate car choices out there to mess with a buyer. The now sullen salesman rode shotgun. Made for an uncomfortable test drive. He brightened up toward the end to tout a "demonstrator" with 16,000 km. Wanted Freight/PDI on top of the unrealistic asking price. Either he was nuts or he thought we were. We walked.

Ugly
Honda Pilot: Salesman said photocopying my driver's license is a police requirement. Told him it's dealer nonsense. He dropped it with a thud. The demonstrator was a rolling pigsty, ski gear, baby seats, garbage and a smelly gym bag. Salesman wanted Mrs. W. to ride in the back. Told him he could sit his scrawny ass back there beside the gym bag. The demonstration drive was once around the block. Then crazy talk! He wanted a $1,000 “good faith” credit card charge before he would grace us with a price quotation. Our feet did the talking.

Ugly
Acura RL: Telephone deal. Price agreed. Appointment for Saturday. Salesman an hour late. Said he got held up at soccer practice! Car not ready. He squeezed us for another $200. PO'd, but the deal was still too good to walk. We split the difference. No up-selling. Delivery set for Tuesday.

Tuesday. Salesman a “no show”. An office clerk was drafted to do the handover. He couldn't find the file or keys. Eventually located everything but the owner's manual. Knew little about the car's features. Called the dealer for two months requesting an owner's manual.

Asked Acura Canada to send me an owner's manual. Said they don't have any, it's not what they do. Referred me back to the dealer. Ya, that's gonna work! Got bounced from person to person some of them unpleasant, like walking through hell wearing gasoline-soaked shorts! Reached a supervisor. She said dealers are independent businesses. Acura doesn't interfere. But I just want my owner's manual! "Nice" wasn't working so I kicked it up a notch. She promised a Vice President would call me that afternoon. The owner's manual came in the mail a couple of weeks later. Still waiting for the VP's call. It's a good car but we won't buy another.

[saint_satan]

Good:  Honda.  Have had many things fixed after warranty is up, generally fixed right the first time.  Very positive.

Bad:  GM (work fleet vehicles).  Usually fixed right but prices are nuts and lots of extra, unbargained for repairs.  “We decided to do all your rear brakes too – there was over 50% wear on the pads”.  My mother's experience with the local Nissan dealer is very similiar.

Ugly:  Chyco.  Despite my positive experience with my Cherokee, a Chryco dealer is to be avoided at all costs.  When under warranty, lots of excuses like “its supposed to do that”, “ you should see what happens to Caravans”  and my favourite “you’re the only person who has that problem” – I should tell them about this thing called the internet.  The last straw was a routine service where the dealer told me that my transmission pan was leaking badly.  When I told the manager I had the transmission serviced at that dealership 2 months ago and was still under the 1 year service warranty, they checked it again and it wasn’t leaking anymore.

[calguy98]

Many dealers take your license etc for a test drive which I don't like.

Some of the acura dealers in Calgary were very pushy and wanting to make a deal on the spot, even though I had just test drove the mdx for the first time.  Felt too much pressure so I bailed. 

Crowfoot Honda was good - but I felt like I knew more about the cars than they did.  But the salesman was no pressure.

[Gardiner Westbound]

Many dealers take your license etc for a test drive which I don't like.

Some of the acura dealers in Calgary were very pushy and wanting to make a deal on the spot, even though I had just test drove the mdx for the first time.  Felt too much pressure so I bailed. 

Crowfoot Honda was good - but I felt like I knew more about the cars than they did.  But the salesman was no pressure.

At least two dealer visits are required, one for a demonstration drive, the other for negotiating. Some salesmen ask to photocopy a shopper's SIN, driver’s license, or to swipe his credit card. All are unnecessary, carry undue risk, violate federal and provincial privacy legislation and are contrary to police identity theft warnings. Identity thefts have been traced to car dealers. The salesman may verify your entitlement to drive and write down your name and address. He is not legally permitted to record license or other numbers or make a photocopy.

Do not present identification or sign anything that will enable the dealer to surreptitiously run a credit check unless you are applying for a loan, and then only after you have hammered out the deal. The better your credit rating the more you will pay, because you can! Multiple credit checks will negatively affect your FICO credit score.

Tell him you are there solely to drive and compare cars, you'll decide which to buy later. Do not negotiate price at this stage. This should reduce the sales pressure during the test drive. Drive the trim version, powertrain and options you want to buy. Spend at least 30 minutes in each car and drive a variety of road conditions. Small variations in seat comfort and ergonomics can make a big difference in how a car “fits” you. Do not tolerate inadequate demonstration drive time or restrictive routing. Shop elsewhere if the dealer is unaccommodating. Consider renting one for a weekend so you can give it an extensive test drive.

See attachment.

[Highlander60]

I had made a deposit of $500.00 on their truck subject to my selling my truck as planned, which fell through at the price originally agreed.

<snip>

I had not signed anything or even seen their truck yet, but I guess that's how they deal with customers in Mirimachi.

Why did you give them any money if you didn't have any deal on paper yet?  That doesn't make any sense.

They said they required a deposit over the phone. Guess you live and learn.

[Wetson]

Acura Sherway.  AVOID LIKE THE PLAGUE