Topic: CD Article: 2006 Honda Civic DX Coupe

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Besides the 1-2 shift question and 1 second acceleration difference between coupe vs sedan comment which I highly suspect of being inaccurate, the rest of the article seems on the mark.

[mdxtasy]

I'll point Greg to this thread and see if he wants to respond. Cool?

Thanks Chris.  The article left me with more questions than answers.  Informative reviews give me good insight as to what the tester was doing and a good understanding of what the product is all about.  There was just too many sentences left hanging.

[AVToller]

I'll point Greg to this thread and see if he wants to respond. Cool?

Very!! 

[Rupert]

What does passenger volume have to do with acceleration and passing power, if no one is sitting in it. If all else is equal it is only weight that affects accelleration and passing power. Frankly I think the weight differential between the sedan and coup is questionable. I have seen these figures in print but...shorter wheelbase...lower hmmm. Maybe it's right.

[soj]

I have to agree with the majority of commentary as it relates to shifting and the 0 - 60 times.  Having test driven two Civics there is definitely a knack to shifting these cars smoothly.  However, it didn't take me long to figure it out (timing and a light touch).  Although we can only speculate as to what Greg did but before commenting, I for one would have tried another car and then if the problem persisted, I would have let a friend have a go.  This so that I could say with some certainty that it was the car and not the driver.  As it stands those of us who have driven the car are left with the definite impression that Greg was shifting challenged perhaps as a result of driving primarily slush boxes.

As for the 0 - 60 times; Motor Trend reports the 0 - 60 mph times for a 5 speed sedan as being 8 seconds whereas AJAC reports the 0 - 100 km/h (62 mph) as being 8.6 seconds for the same car.  Thus where the 9.5 second time comes from, who knows but that's the point, references please if you're going to introduce the information.  But to then jump to the conclusion that a 42 lb weight saving will result in a full 1 second reduction in 0 - 60 time is an even greater leap in faith.  Consider for the moment the following: Civic sedan - 19.1 lbs/hp = 8 sec, 0 - 60;  Civic Si Sedan - 14.6 lbs/hp = 6.7 sec, 0 - 60;  Civic Coupe - 18.6 lbs/hp = sec, 0 - 60.  Thus if 4.5 lbs/hp = a 1.3 sec to a 1.8 sec (AJAC) difference in 0 - 60 times, how can a 0.5 lb/hp = a 1 sec difference?

A more realistic estimate might be that 42 lbs could result in a high out 0.2 - 0.3 sec improvement in 0 - 60 times but I guess that's the difference between a journalistic training versus a scientific one.   

[Julie]

"Rear legroom is tighter than in the sedan, and getting into the rear seat is a chore because the right front passenger seat doesn't slide forwards automatically when the seatback is lowered."

Stupid Honda....they had it in all other previous coupes.


"The driver's visibility to the front and sides is very good, but the high rear trunklid makes reversing into a parking space difficult."

Nah....just get out and do a walkaround...and use your mirrors...right fellas?   

Getting into back seat. It sounds a little "cheap-ish" the sound it makes when you manually push the right passenger seat forward. That, and the truck lid not being lined. That looks cheap too. Only 2 things that look cheap though; rest  in looking upscale for a Civic.

Rear visibility? I think it's good actually.    I find it easy backing up.  And again, I'm short, so....  his observation.

Front visibility is hampered by thick A-pillars however.

[Julie]

He reviewed the DX-G actually.

Might find some DXs in northern areas of provinces, etc.

Where I came from (Quebec City), percentage of cars without A/C isn't that low, like in Southern Ontario. Colder climate.

He reviewed the DX-G actually

He said he tested the DXG, but makes many more references to the DX. 

You're right.

[prufrock]

Having come from driving an automatic for 5 years, and having an automatic now, I found the manual to be very smooth with short throws and the clutch easy to engage. My wife felt the same way. Perhaps this test vehicle had been driven a little roughly by others before him?

[articsteve]

He said he tested the DXG, but makes many more references to the DX.  The photo is a pic of the DX.  Overall a poor review IMO.

   The DX-G is not considered a trim line in its own right.  It adds features to the DX trim (G, I believe, standing for Group, just like the old Si-G cars?).  The things he mentions about the DX also apply to the DX-G, so how does this make it a poor review?

Also, the pics sho a DX-G.  Take a look at the interior shot - it has A/C.

The DX-G is not considered a trim line in its own right

The 06 Honda DXG is a MODEL.  For those that have ACTUALLY OWNED one the  the ownership states "DXG". It is not an option to the DX or a "trim line" of the DX.

Consequently, this review is not a review of the DX.  It is a review of the DXG and the photo's are incorrectly named.   

The shifter is certainly econobox Japanese about the same as my 92 Talon, however it shifted normally without any "lurching".  The motor does rev at the slightest input of the gas so that might take getting used for some newbies. 

Change the title of the review to DXG otherwise the review is confusing to novice buyers, IMO. 

 

[Hal]

Fun with nomenclature    If you go to www.honda.ca and build a Civic coupe, the Model is Civic Coupe, the Trim is DX-G.

Not that I have actually owned one or anything! 

[articsteve]

Fun with nomenclature    If you go to www.honda.ca and build a Civic coupe, the Model is Civic Coupe, the Trim is DX-G.

Not that I have actually owned one or anything!  

At least your honest Hal.   

I know this is perfectly meaningless to the "trim" debate and the fact that it appears on the Honda.ca site under "Model Overview", but Honda Canada does say this "The big news for 2007 is the new 140-hp, 1.8-litre i-VTEC® engine that's standard in all Civic DX, DX-G, LX and EX models".

Then again they are back to calling it "TRIM" in the "Build It" section.   

[Hal]

Yah, Honda wackiness in using model/trim interchangeably. More important is the confusion in the review - the DX vs DX-G distinction should be made clear.

[articsteve]

What's really wackie about Honda Canada or really Honda North America is that the Canadian models don't include a remote trunk release in the key, but the American models have.  This is a major PIA with the Canadian car.  Why manufacturer 2 different keys or key fobs for basically the same car made in the same plant.  What is the business model behind that one?

[Julie]

I did miss the remote trunk release on my Civic.    It comes in handy when you have it.

I didn't know they had it in the States. Strange logic alright, it's not like there's a market reason not to offer it in Canada.

[editorgreg]

Let me address all these comments one at a time: first the car I drove was a DX-G model. I explained what the DX-G includes in the review. Second, the jerky motion I referred to wasn't the shifter, but the fore-aft motion of the car while shifting.  Some cars are tight in this respect, but this one wasn't.  I've driven more than a thousand different cars since my first test drive in 1988, and I stand by my impression. And like all AJAC journalist members, I take a high performance driving course every three years. Thirdly, the 9.5 second 0-100 km/h time of the sedan was my recollection of a test which I forgot was in car with an automatic transmission. Sorry about that.  I speculated the difference in acceleration was due to the Coupe's lighter curb weight because they have the same horsepower. Fourth, rear visibility is lousy if you're parallel parking - the car behind you is barely visible. You can always ask me questions by e-mailing greg@canadiandriver.com  I try to answer them all.  Greg Wilson

[mdxtasy]

Thanks Greg for clarifying some of the points you made in the article.  In the jerky motions, are you referring to the jerkiness when the clutch pedal is pressed and when it is released or the time the clutch pedal is on the floor?  Were you able to sample more than one specimen of the Civic or was it only the one car you had access to?  Did any of your other colleagues notice this as well?

The necessity of the stability control and traction control systems, can you explain why they are not required on this car?  In your opinion, is it better to have active safety systems or the passive ones like the air bags as standard equipment?

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Thanks for taking time to explain a bit more Greg, even if it leads to more questions 

[Greg Wilson]

The jerky motion in the Civic Coupe occurs when you accelerate hard, let in the clutch, change gears and again when you let out the clutch. Its mostly the enagagement of the clutch and the 'thump' that accompanies the drivetrain engagement when you resume accelerating.  I don't recall this on the Civic Si I drove some time ago. If you didn't compare this to other cars, you might think it was normal, and in fact, it's not that difficult to live with if you try hard to shift smoothly.  But it's still there, and I call them as I see them.  I haven't tried other base Civic Coupes, and I haven't asked my colleagues if they experienced it.  Frankly, I don't like to be influenced by what other writers think - it leads to a herd mentality.

Regarding traction and stability control, I indicated that they weren't really necessary because the car only has 140 horsepower, so there's not a lot of torque steer, and as a front-wheel drive car, it understeers gently when cornering limits are reached and is easy to control.  With 60% of the car's weight over the front wheels, plus a good set of tires, traction control isn't really necessary if you use your right foot judiciously.  Stability control is best on torquey, rear-drive cars that tend to 'spin out' easily on slippery roads.  For example, I would highly recommend stability control on a car like a V8 Mustang (too bad they only offer traction control).   In terms of passive safety equipment, I recommend side airbags and curtain airbags wherever they're available because there's very little protection from the side if you're T-boned, and statistics indicate that side airbags make a big difference in injury reduction. I'd also highly recommend ABS for extra steering control under panic braking, and a very good set of tires, winter tires where it snows (in Vancouver you can get away with all-seasons).

Thanks for keeping me on my toes.

Greg Wilson

[mrthompson]

 

[mdxtasy]

Thanks Greg.  I too call it like I see it and appreciate the answers you've given.  I understand your point of view and the answers you've provided can clarify your opinion on the Civic and also clears the questions I had about the article.