Re: Etching and Nitrogen Fees

[Wheelboy]

It's been many years since my last "new" car purchase and I had never even heard of this etching/nitrogen fee until yesterday.  I just want to share my brief experience on the subject.

My wife and I are ready to purchase a new Hyundai and happened to come across the colour we want at an out of town dealer yesterday afternoon.  We made an offer to buy the vehicle.  The salesperson came back with a reasonable counter-offer but also informed us of an additional $500 charge, not shown on their website, for nitrogen filled tires and vehicle etching.  We just looked at each other... nitrowhat? 
Thanks to the regular posters on this site.  Awesome information here.
 

Just imagine the poor devils who DON'T read this site and the first time they ever hear about those two scams are when they are *this* close to signing.  I make a point of looking for those little green, round window decals that show just how many people get sucked in.  Those things are on the vast majority of cars out on the streets.

NO salesperson ever says "We like to sell this but it's against OMVIC'S rules for me to say that it's compulsory.  You have complete freedom of choice."  My Acura dealer was the closest to saying this.  He mentioned its existence but when I announced that I was quite aware of its existence and the rules that governed its sales he backed right off.  He got my business.  Others in the preceding months didn't.

[tpl]

The nitrogen thing is particularly funny.   As every tire already has 80% nitrogen in it anyway it should be good fun to negotiate that  price down to 1/5 of that which they are asking...with a straight face if you can do it.    Or insist that they let all the gas out of the tires and refill them from a regular compressor.

[Wheelboy]

insist that they let all the gas out of the tires and refill them from a regular compressor.

They might play you at your own game and try to charge you for the bit that they can't remove without creating a vacuum.   

I had to laugh when I visited my local VW dealer - Leavens in London Ont - ALL the cars on their lot had lime green valve caps indicating that all their cars (new, used) had nitrogen already installed.  I guess they know what's good for their customers. 

[Gardiner Westbound]

I'm pretty certain that we will still buy this car somewhere but more than likely from another dealer.  Our next offer will start $500 lower than yesterday's in anticipation of this happening again.

It's the salesman's job to make the offers. Don't respond to, “How much do you want to spend?” Negotiate up from true dealer cost, not down from MSRP. Let him do the talking. Control, but don't dominate the negotiation. Never suggest a number. Ask him for his best price.

[Turbo Bob]

TyWebb, just refuse to pay it, don't negotiate it in. Mine came etched etc, I just said I didn't want it and wouldn't pay, they were fine with that. Be strong.

[johngenx]

I bet they just install those green caps and add $$ to the invoice.

[safristi]

..they should forget the etching B/S and offer free BODY ETCHINGS..aka Tattoos.....someone told me they are catching on these days!!!! ..........don't think iv'e seen an Under 30 something piece of skin Tat FREE now that SKOOLS OUT FER SUMMER  ....are they all joining the Marines or Merchant Navy .... ....


 yeah Tat the dealership LOGO on the customers upper arse fer FREE...........advertising in BED   Bath and BEYOND the BEACH.... ..............

[TyWebb]

TB... now that I've read all about the subject in this forum you can rest assured that I'm not paying $500 for inflated tires or useless etching.  By the way I tried to talk my wife into the Genesis 2.0T but this will be her primary car and she has her mind set on the Tucson.

GW... thanks for the advice.  MSRP is currently the only price I have to work with, but I'm seriously thinking about paying for the CCC report.  I'm just not sure if it will make a difference in the end result.

I once swapped out the black plastic valve caps on the Mustang for gray plastic caps ($0.99 mod).  They looked pretty good too, but were stolen inside of a week.

[safristi]

  Must be a Hamilton "Thang"..........grey Cup fever....

[Gardiner Westbound]

GW... thanks for the advice.  MSRP is currently the only price I have to work with, but I'm seriously thinking about paying for the CCC report.  I'm just not sure if it will make a difference in the end result.

The Consumer Reports New Car Price Report provides the buyer with true Canadian dealer cost, holdback, rebate and incentive information at US$30 a report, less for multiple reports. Apply a reasonable mark-up and let the games begin. Alternately hand it to the salesman and invite him to add the minimum mark-up required for dealer profit telling him you will buy if the price is right.

Never negotiate from MSRP or dealer invoice. Both are fictitious, designed to flimflam naïve consumers. Establish a fair target price beforehand by calculating true dealer cost from buying service data, applying a reasonable 4-percent markup for profit and adding $750 for actual freight cost. Enter zero for PDI. Refuse up-sells and add-ons. Reject non-statutory charges and fees. Do not discuss your budget, financing, monthly payments, leasing vs. buying, or trade-in before receiving an acceptable bottom line price.

A salesman cannot close the sale until the customer is open to buy. The knowledge buyer is not open to buy until his target price is met. The most powerful tool in a buyer’s arsenal is the “walk away,” a strategic exit that leaves the door open for further discussion. Transferring the onus to the salesman shifts the psychological advantage to the buyer. Always ponder a deal overnight. If you have shopped several dealers one may be hungrier than the rest. Wait for a call with an improved offer. Test for a fallback position. Say it still isn’t good enough. Absent a call return to the dealership and pick up where you left off. Most folks can tolerate two rounds in a negotiation. After that patience may wear thin.

http://crcanadacars.org/

[Wheelboy]

I bet they just install those green caps and add $$ to the invoice.

Oh John that's VERY cynical of you!  No-one would ever do that would they?  I mean it's easy to tell if you tires contain 20% more nitrogen than your neighbor's old Buick isn't it?   

[Turbo Bob]

Ask them to prove what the gas is in the tires! LOL

[richink]

TyWebb, just refuse to pay it, don't negotiate it in. Mine came etched etc, I just said I didn't want it and wouldn't pay, they were fine with that. Be strong.

In my day in the industry every car that came off the truck got etched even though I strongly disagreed with the practise, we never paid the company until it was sold with the car. It's far from thorough, only major components and no more than 10 minutes work. Snakeoilus supremus! Come to think of it, I'd refuse to buy a new car that even had it done. I'm not interested in those kinds of forced sales tactics.

Apply a reasonable mark-up and let the games begin. Alternately hand it to the salesman and invite him to add the minimum mark-up required for dealer profit telling him you will buy if the price is right.

$750 for actual freight cost.

I wouldn't give them a penny of profit to start! Freight cost is $500 on the outside for a large SUV. Small cars are no more than $350. Refuse to give a deposit of any kind until you can agree on price. Start offers at cost, that sends a strong message that you know what it is and move up in increments of $100 bucks. Walk away at ANY time if you feel you aren't getting the deal OR treatment you deserve.

Nitrogen in tires is a falacy. No real benefit for those of us who check their tire pressures reguarly but then who wouldn't? Dealerships charging $200 to consumers to do that is downright criminal. Maybe I am reposting a repost here, but an article written by Jim Kerr completely debunks everything about nitrogen in this article right on our favourite website!

http://www.autos.ca/auto-tech/auto-tech-tips-on-tire-inflation