Author Topic: Winter Problems?? (Read 3596 times)

22angel · « **on:** March 15, 2006, 04:43:23 am »

Hello Everyone!

I am new to this site, and find it rather interesting, actually! I'm not a super huge car fan, but as my vehicle hates me and does stuff only to me, I'm more into learning what may be causing it.

I have a 2000 Cavalier that has been giving me grief since about the day I bought it. More recently, it's just been getting worse.

Since about November/early December (when it first started getting cold out), it has been jerking/chugging a lot. So I figured that b/c I had lent it to my friend, and she put gas in it (at the cheapest place in town), that there may have been a bit of water in the tank. So I diligently put gas line antifreeze in it every single time I put gas in it (which was about 3 times a week). Did help to begin with. By the beginning of January, it's still chugging/jerking. I took it to my mechanic, and of course, it doesn't do it to him. (I tell you, my car hates me!!

) So I told him to keep it until it was fixed. Well, turns out he can't find anything wrong with it at all, so we take it back (b/c we needed another vehicle), and I refused to drive it until about a week ago. We figured out (kind of) that it needs methyl hydrate A LOT. I was talking with a co-worker (who used to work in a garage) and he said his vehicle was doing the same thing, and he said to keep adding the methyl hydrate to every tank of gas, and to get gas at Petro-Canada, rather than Esso. Ok, so I can do that. He also said something about "Engine Frost". I've never heard of it, but it sounds (by his description) like what my car is doing.

What is the difference btwn methyl hydrate, and gas line antifreeze? How do they work? Why does my car keep chugging and jerking? Is it b/c now we have stupid weather variances where it's +5C then goes down to -15C at night time? What can I do to make it not do this??

I am seriously ready to say bye bye to vehicles forever!! It is driving me crazy and causing such stress!! This is the first winter (since I bought it 3 years ago) that it has caused so much problems. Anyone else have this problem lately?? It's not like I can just NOT have a vehicle either, b/c I have to drive 20 miles to work.

Thanks for your answers and opinions!

mrthompson · « **Reply #1 on:** March 15, 2006, 08:23:12 am »

I'm surprised your 'mechanic' didn't think to change the fuel filter. At 6 years old, it's probably due for a change. That's my guess.

22angel · « **Reply #2 on:** March 15, 2006, 12:51:15 pm »

That was the first thing we changed back in late December/early January. So it's all good. I had the spark plugs changed last year also. Can't remember anything else off the top of my head that I've had done.

barrie1 · « **Reply #3 on:** March 15, 2006, 02:06:28 pm »

Angel Welcome to the Forum, A few tanks of premium Fuel will help your car somewhat. Menthyl Hydrate is the wrong stuff to be putting in your engine as it is not all that good for it. I can't think of the ingredients that are in the gasline anti-freeze but its a different formula. By going to a few tanks of Premium Fuel you automatically get the Anti-freeze in the fuel and possibly better milage as well. Once the summer is here you should be able to revert back to Reg Fuel. How old are the spark plug wires on this engine as well? They may be getting close to replacement as well. Make sure your air filter is in good shape as well. The Menthyl Hydrate can do damage to some of the small seals and gaskets so don't add any more.

articsteve · « **Reply #4 on:** March 15, 2006, 02:30:53 pm »

More info is needed such as mileage and type of transmission (auto or standard)

Personally, I don't think your problem is associated with water in the fuel. Its normal to hope for a simple cause.

For your info methyl hydrate aka methanol or wood alcohol is great for passing emission tests. Add a gallon to your full gas tank and run that thru your motor prior to the test.

Ethanol is actually better in absorbing moisture which is found in all Sunoco, Pioneer and UPI gas. I also I believe Shell is 10% Ethanol and maybe Esso is now too.

However, Isopropyl alcohol is even better. Stay clear of PetroCanada because the driver simply dumps one of these above-mentioned chemicals into the storage tank when he fills it up. Very rank and I'm sure very flawed.

Questions:

Does this car chug and jerk all the time regardless of temp, how long it's been running and at any speed?

mrthompson · « **Reply #5 on:** March 15, 2006, 02:38:08 pm »

Artic, are you thinking something transmission (auto) or emissions related?

articsteve · « **Reply #6 on:** March 15, 2006, 02:52:26 pm »

Yes, I doubt very much it's water in the fuel. I'm waiting for more info.

22angel · « **Reply #7 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:10:42 pm »

Barrie1: I have no idea how old the spark plug wires are. I had the spark plugs changed about this time last year...is that the same? I'll tell my mechanic about the spark plug wires and the air filter when I get the oil changed on friday.

Ok, ArticSteve, my mileage is about 145,000 kms. I have automatic transmission.

"Personally, I don't think your problem is associated with water in the fuel. Its normal to hope for a simple cause."

I don't know what else it would be, b/c as I said earlier, it never does anything for my mechanic. And since I explained it to my co-worker (the one who worked in a garage) and my mechanic, they both said to add methyl hydrate (mechanic), or gasline antifreeze (co-worker).

Is Ethanol in Petro Canada gas? We only have 3 gas stations locally (small small town, where you have to drive at least 10 miles to get gas)...Esso (which is the one I have been using 99% of the time), Petro Canada, or Co-op. I was told by my co-worker that since he started using Esso gas, he's had the same problem I've had. So I'm kind of wary of sticking with Esso for right now. I always thought Petro Canada gas was one of the best gasses out there.....

Is Isoproply alcohol the same as gas line antifreeze? (Can you tell I don't know what I'm doing??

)

My car has been doing this since about the end of November/early December when it started getting cold here in MB. Since we've had such a stupid winter (no winter to speak of really, temperature wise), it's been doing it since about then, regardless of the temperature. It can be +5C or -20C and it still does it. I have been letting it warm up for about 20 min to half an hour each night for about the past week (b/c at night time it's been getting to about -20C, give or take a few degrees). It's usually good for about 5 miles, then it starts to jerk. Usually does it at higher speeds, from about 90 kms, to 110 kms. Since I rarely go slower (I do a lot of highway travelling), I don't notice it when I'm driving in town. And if I'm going up and down hills, it seems to do it then too. Even little hills.

Hope that helps you guys out.

22angel · « **Reply #8 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:12:54 pm »

Quote from: articsteve on March 15, 2006, 02:52:26 pm

Yes, I doubt very much it's water in the fuel. I'm waiting for more info.

Oh dear.

You're not making me feel very safe!!

Any ideas what else it could be? Nothing too major, I'm hoping!

yugrus · « **Reply #9 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:16:33 pm »

Quote from: 22angel on March 15, 2006, 03:10:42 pm

It's usually good for about 5 miles, then it starts to jerk. Usually does it at higher speeds, from about 90 kms, to 110 kms.

Doesn't sound like water in fuel at all. I'd pull plugs to check for fouling...

articsteve · « **Reply #10 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:34:38 pm »

Quote from: 22angel on March 15, 2006, 03:10:42 pm

Barrie1: I have no idea how old the spark plug wires are. I had the spark plugs changed about this time last year...is that the same? I'll tell my mechanic about the spark plug wires and the air filter when I get the oil changed on friday.

Ok, ArticSteve, my mileage is about 145,000 kms. I have automatic transmission.

"Personally, I don't think your problem is associated with water in the fuel. Its normal to hope for a simple cause."

I don't know what else it would be, b/c as I said earlier, it never does anything for my mechanic. And since I explained it to my co-worker (the one who worked in a garage) and my mechanic, they both said to add methyl hydrate (mechanic), or gasline antifreeze (co-worker).

Is Ethanol in Petro Canada gas? We only have 3 gas stations locally (small small town, where you have to drive at least 10 miles to get gas)...Esso (which is the one I have been using 99% of the time), Petro Canada, or Co-op. I was told by my co-worker that since he started using Esso gas, he's had the same problem I've had. So I'm kind of wary of sticking with Esso for right now. I always thought Petro Canada gas was one of the best gasses out there.....

Is Isoproply alcohol the same as gas line antifreeze? (Can you tell I don't know what I'm doing?? )

My car has been doing this since about the end of November/early December when it started getting cold here in MB. Since we've had such a stupid winter (no winter to speak of really, temperature wise), it's been doing it since about then, regardless of the temperature. It can be +5C or -20C and it still does it. I have been letting it warm up for about 20 min to half an hour each night for about the past week (b/c at night time it's been getting to about -20C, give or take a few degrees). It's usually good for about 5 miles, then it starts to jerk. Usually does it at higher speeds, from about 90 kms, to 110 kms. Since I rarely go slower (I do a lot of highway travelling), I don't notice it when I'm driving in town. And if I'm going up and down hills, it seems to do it then too. Even little hills.

Hope that helps you guys out.

Is Ethanol in Petro Canada gas?

No, but I only know the gas situation in Ontario. Just for your info gas companies trade gas between themselves. So it is quite possible that all 3 gas stations in your town are supplied by the same bulk gas supplier. That is why most of the big gas tankers that deliver gas are not marked. In the case of PetroCanada the delivery guy just dumps an additive into the storage tank when he delivers the gas to the station. That way PetroCanada can advertise "winter gas".

I'm sure your mechanic would have identified the fact that the motor was missing. That is the very first basic test/examination.

Your car is hesitating under load. It could be the transmission. Has the transmission filter and fluid ever been changed?

22angel · « **Reply #11 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:44:54 pm »

Hmm. I didn't know that. Ok, well I'll talk to the mechanic soon and see what he says....He usually says "start with the little things and see if that fixes it, then if it doesn't go to the bigger things". So I'll tell him, and go from there.

mrthompson · « **Reply #12 on:** March 15, 2006, 03:50:49 pm »

Did you get my PM?

curls · « **Reply #13 on:** March 15, 2006, 10:05:02 pm »

It almost sounds to me like your injectors are partially clogged, as it seems that whenever you demand more fuel (stomp the pedal), it starts acting up on you. Have you tried a good injector cleaner in your gas? Run the tank to a low level (under 1/4 tank), add one bottle of a good concentrated injector cleaner, and then fill up to about 1/2 a tank. Run that tank to near empty... and then after filling again (to full this time), see if it helps. For $4 to $6, its worth a try.

Also as mentioned, check your plug wires, distributor (cap and rotor?), and see if your mechanic can test your fuel pressure.

articsteve · « **Reply #14 on:** March 16, 2006, 08:34:19 pm »

Quote from: curls on March 15, 2006, 10:05:02 pm

It almost sounds to me like your injectors are partially clogged, as it seems that whenever you demand more fuel (stomp the pedal), it starts acting up on you. Have you tried a good injector cleaner in your gas? Run the tank to a low level (under 1/4 tank), add one bottle of a good concentrated injector cleaner, and then fill up to about 1/2 a tank. Run that tank to near empty... and then after filling again (to full this time), see if it helps. For $4 to $6, its worth a try.

Also as mentioned, check your plug wires, distributor (cap and rotor?), and see if your mechanic can test your fuel pressure.

It almost sounds to me like your injectors are partially clogged

That's a good possibility at your mileage. However, the only thing that will clean an injector is either remove it or run a high pressurized can of super concentrate directly thru the fuel rail after disconnecting the main gas line. Most small garages have this kit.

The injector cleaner in the bottle for $5.00 is for maintenance only. It won't unclog an injector as it is too weak.

curls · « **Reply #15 on:** March 17, 2006, 08:52:02 am »

Quote from: articsteve on March 16, 2006, 08:34:19 pm

It almost sounds to me like your injectors are partially clogged

That's a good possibility at your mileage. However, the only thing that will clean an injector is either remove it or run a high pressurized can of super concentrate directly thru the fuel rail after disconnecting the main gas line. Most small garages have this kit.

The injector cleaner in the bottle for $5.00 is for maintenance only. It won't unclog an injector as it is too weak.

True, if they're FULLY clogged, then the concentrate gas additive stuff won't work, but since his car runs, just a bit rough at high-fuel demand, then my guess was that they're partially clogged/dirty, as low-fuel demands it runs fine. I'd suggest going my emthod first, as its only $5-$10, and if that doesn't clear it up, bring it to your mechanic and have them clean the injectors as arcticsteve suggests.

22angel · « **Reply #16 on:** March 29, 2006, 10:00:28 pm »

Hi guys....I've been meaning to update this just to let you all know what's going on, and so far, it's nothing!

I made a list of all the stuff everyone suggested, and gave it to my mechanic. He looked at everything, and said it was all A-OK. He said if it keeps doing it, to take it to a GM dealership where they can hook it up to their most recent computer and find out what's going on. But he said that it won't likely do any harm to it. If anything changes, then I am to take it back in, or go to the dealership.

Grrr.

(OT: Btw, I like all the smilies available on this site! Very neat!)

22angel · « **Reply #17 on:** April 23, 2006, 04:54:54 am »

Hello All!:hello:

Well, I'm guessing my car is unlike me in the fact that it doesn't like winter! Since I've been driving it again (since about a week into April, if that), it hasn't done ONE THING.

Nothing. So I'm not sure what it was. Let's just hope it stays away! Maybe it was my little ghost that likes to follow me......

Thanks for your help though! And I will definitely come back here when I need more help!

barrie1 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 23, 2006, 09:43:14 pm »

Glad to hear the Bugs cleared up which now says possibly you ignition wires were drawing moisture and giving you the hard start condition you had. As a suggestion I would ask the mechanic fellow to spray the spark plug wires in a sealer for you to keep moisture out. Its a very quick thing for him to do and won't cost very much at all. Just another way of looking after it and not having these problems. Glad its running better for you.

22angel · « **Reply #19 on:** April 23, 2006, 10:58:39 pm »

I'll do that next time I'm in for an oil change....Thanks