Author Topic: Please settle this debate with my spouse (Read 3018 times)

fhw · « **on:** March 06, 2006, 08:42:01 am »

I'm no technical whiz, so I hope one of you out there can answer this for me.

Yesterday, I was driving my wife's RX330, and we were 4th in line at a drive-through car wash. I turned the engine off. When asked what I was doing, I argued that idling is a complete waste of gas. My wife asserted that frequent shutting off and restarting of the engine damages the starter system. Setting aside the car is a 2005, and any repairs would be under warranty, I argued that modern fuel injection/starter systems are highly efficient (and in a Lexus, well-made and reliable), and there shouldn't be any untoward effects on the car.

Who's right on this one?

wing · « **Reply #1 on:** March 06, 2006, 08:44:54 am »

Meh, if you are idleing for more than 10 secs just shut it off. Sure there will be wear on the starter but it's minimal.

Panzer · « **Reply #2 on:** March 06, 2006, 08:47:36 am »

Unless you do this 20 times a day all year round, I doubt it'll be a problem. But if you know you'll be only idling for 3-4 seconds, I wouldn't shut it off as you'll be using whatever gas you saved by starting the car.

Snowman · « **Reply #3 on:** March 06, 2006, 08:54:46 am »

An average car wash time is 7 minutes as I use this number to calculate my wait time to determine if I have sufficient time to wash the car. So if you fourth in line that is 28 minutes of unnecessary idling.

ericthejet · « **Reply #4 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:00:09 am »

fhw · « **Reply #5 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:03:43 am »

Many thanks.

airbalancer · « **Reply #6 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:10:32 am »

A debate with your wife, you have already lost even if you are right.

The hybrid GM truck will turn off even if it is stopped at a light and restart when you start to give some gas

'The hybrid pickups achieve extra fuel savings because they automatically stop and restart the engine under different operating circumstances. Instead of a conventional starter motor and alternator, the hybrid pickups use a compact 14-kW electric induction motor or starter generator integrated in a patented, space-efficient manner between the engine and transmission. The starter generator provides fast, quiet starting power and allows automatic engine stops/starts to conserve fuel. It also smoothes out any driveline surges and generates electrical current to charge the batteries. "

This many not appy to your vechule but she will never know

Giant Dwarf · « **Reply #7 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:19:07 am »

When starting a car from cold, there is increased wear and tear on the engine's innards. If the engine is already warm, by shutting off the car, you're not only polluting less, you're saving fuel (idling is among the least efficient operating zones of the engine). True, it's increased wear on the starter, but look at it this way, if the engine is running, it's increased wear on all those reciprocating parts in the engine while it's running.

Good luck showing your wife she's wrong.

tortoise · « **Reply #8 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:37:13 am »

Thank-you for not idling you car!

I was at the car wash yesterday and couldn't believe how many people kept their cars going.

Giant Dwarf · « **Reply #9 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:43:37 am »

I was at the car wash too and got in trouble from the attendant for hand-washing with my own bucket whilst others lined up waiting.

Ended up rushing the job and cursed myself for choosing a black car.

Can't wait for this coming weekend. Sunny and temps into the teens. FINALLY a good wash and then goin' topless (cue Saffy's pics).

Shnak · « **Reply #10 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:52:15 am »

That's a great post as I was wondering about this too!

I was wondering if it was too hard on the battery to start the engine every 4-5 minutes like that, but hadn't thought about the wear on the starter system...

I kind of figured that it wasn't so bad as I only wash my car maybe once a month, so it's not like I do this every day...

UmroAyyar · « **Reply #11 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:56:51 am »

Ditto fhw and Shnak. I had this same discussion with my wife. We were 5th in line and every car took 4 minutes going through the car wash. Everyone was idling, I turned the engine off instead of waiting 4 minutes everytime and then had to start to move ahead.

Once a month is good enough for a beige Corolla.

(yes, its beige, blasphemy on a car nut forum

)

airbalancer · « **Reply #12 on:** March 06, 2006, 10:07:01 am »

Quote from: Giant Dwarf on March 06, 2006, 09:43:37 am

I was at the car wash too and got in trouble from the attendant for hand-washing with my own bucket whilst others lined up waiting. Ended up rushing the job and cursed myself for choosing a black car.

Can't wait for this coming weekend. Sunny and temps into the teens. FINALLY a good wash and then goin' topless (cue Saffy's pics).

Saw someone with a 350Z, and they used the brush on the the car

, and they started with their wheels

ovr50 · « **Reply #13 on:** March 06, 2006, 10:10:02 am »

I agree with the majority of the comments above - turning it off is the best route to go.

And Jeff - you know you're not supposed to bucket wash at those car washes - shame on you....

Giant Dwarf · « **Reply #14 on:** March 06, 2006, 10:26:15 am »

Yeah, I know... I hoped that by being there at 9AM on a Sunday, I'd beat the rush... no such luck though. The guy was really nice about it. He politely asked me after I had already taken 20 minutes.

and said that he had no problem at all with me doing so when it's not busy.

The facility is fairly new and always clean -- plus, they've got a machine that takes credit cards too so I don't need to worry about having real money. It's the best thing in Stoney Creek as far as I know.

si · « **Reply #15 on:** March 06, 2006, 10:33:38 am »

wing is right.

10 SECONDS of idling equals the amount of fuel your vehicle takes to start up.

sirAQUAMAN64 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:08:17 am »

I personally would not bother unless it was 3 minutes or more of idling. Too much engine wear upon startup, and I don't see the benefit (besides emissions reduction, which is noteworthy but not worth it to me). I think it would use more gas than 10 seconds of idling, but if warm still perhaps not.

03_ap1 · « **Reply #17 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:15:04 am »

When you're idling, you're getting 0 mpg - that's worse than an M1A2 Abrams tank.

Shnak · « **Reply #18 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:20:31 am »

Quote from: sirAQUAMAN64 on March 06, 2006, 11:08:17 am

I personally would not bother unless it was 3 minutes or more of idling. Too much engine wear upon startup, and I don't see the benefit (besides emissions reduction, which is noteworthy but not worth it to me). I think it would use more gas than 10 seconds of idling, but if warm still perhaps not.

I'd agree with you if I was 1st in line, shutting down the engine to save 3-4 minutes of idling wouldn't be worth it... but if you're 6-7-8th in line... you'll easily save 20-25 minutes of idling.

exJunkie · « **Reply #19 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:31:25 am »

Quote from: 03_ap1 on March 06, 2006, 11:15:04 am

When you're idling, you're getting 0 mpg - that's worse than an M1A2 Abrams tank.

I dont't know, my Audi dash board screen would calculate the fuel consumption and always displayed, "0 L/km" while I was idling.