Topic: Are Echo rusting out?

[Seafoam]

VW's are otherwise very desirable cars.  A friend has a Golf TDI, she loves it but the electrical repairs, sensors etc. are just to much.

I would agree with you on all accounts but for the price of them they should be more durable.With the TDI you have to put miles on them to get the fuel benefits.They are great driving cars.

Andrew

I get the benefits of my TDI every single time I push the accelerator, thank you very much.

Oh the Torque thing I forgot about that.

Andrew

[Seafoam]

Does it mention how the water enters the car to this?

Andrew

On people's boots, shoes, etc in the form of snow which then melts. 

Please note that Toytech said that the only bad ones he's seen have been Ontario cars - lots of salt. The Sak cars show little or no rust even after 5 years.

If that was the case it would make sense that all cars would suffer from this problem. The design of the floor or carpet area must somehow hold the moisture or let it get past the carpet to the metal. I would have suspected a leak around windshield or from engine firewall somewhere.

Andrew
 

[AVToller]

Toyota acknowledged that they did not provide adequate rust proofing in the driver's side floor to meet the demands of Ontario winters. They have dealt with the problem. Relatively few cars were seriously affected. They corrected their manufacturing error and all is well in the world. 

[Trainman]

Then I guess you should stay away from any  that are in Ontario. Because they just lay down the salt here

That goes for any old model pickup or car in my region..  Jeeps are really bad for it.  Without fail the driver's side front floor pan is usually the one that has the holes.  Now some cars have plastic floor pan liners.

And has any other manufacture done what Toyota has done to correct their error(s)?

Again, good job Toyota.

[dr_spock]

Toyota could have offered free Pant Saver rubber mats.  It would be cheaper than ripping out the carpet and spraying and putting it back together...

[airbalancer]

Then I guess you should stay away from any  that are in Ontario. Because they just lay down the salt here

That goes for any old model pickup or car in my region..  Jeeps are really bad for it.  Without fail the driver's side front floor pan is usually the one that has the holes.  Now some cars have plastic floor pan liners.

And has any other manufacture done what Toyota has done to correct their error(s)?

Again, good job Toyota.

All my GM's with over 200,000km never had rust on in the first place

[johngenx]

Let's think about what other makes would have done.

GM?  Oh yeah, they stepped up to the plate and fixed all those hundreds of thousands of cars that had "automatically falling off" paint.  And look how they helped customers with failure prone head gaskets and other maladies.  Good one!

Ford?  Windstar owners can tell you about Ford's "commitment to quality" with their failure prone transmissions and head gaskets and so on.  But, Ford stepped up and helped them, RIGHT?

Chrysler?  Tranmissions, rust, and so on?  Yeah, they not only improved the design right away, but helped those that bought the lemons?  Yeah?

I think Toyota got a dose of consumer fury when they tried to avoid the engine sludge problem and saw the potential runiation of their image.  Toyota sells cars ata  premium price based soley on that rep, and they will have to keep it up..

[smainville]

But the sludge issue was a problem with people who did not change their oil.

[Shnak]

Let's think about what other makes would have done.

GM?  Oh yeah, they stepped up to the plate and fixed all those hundreds of thousands of cars that had "automatically falling off" paint.  And look how they helped customers with failure prone head gaskets and other maladies.  Good one!

Ford?  Windstar owners can tell you about Ford's "commitment to quality" with their failure prone transmissions and head gaskets and so on.  But, Ford stepped up and helped them, RIGHT?

Chrysler?  Tranmissions, rust, and so on?  Yeah, they not only improved the design right away, but helped those that bought the lemons?  Yeah?

I think Toyota got a dose of consumer fury when they tried to avoid the engine sludge problem and saw the potential runiation of their image.  Toyota sells cars ata  premium price based soley on that rep, and they will have to keep it up..

I applaud Toyota for how they dealt with it... but what I don't like is that they cut some corners which resulted in this problem. Why is the Echo the only vehicle on the road with floors rotting out? Because they used cheap steel and didn't rust-proof it enough/at all.

[smainville]

 

Here's a supply of bulbs for your VW

[johngenx]

But the sludge issue was a problem with people who did not change their oil.

It effected owners that used Toyota's recommended intervals, introduced in the mid 90's to reduce service costs and compete with other makes going to longer intervals.  Mercedes and other makes have the same problem as they pushed oil change intervals out past 15K, or more.  On the Mercedes models equipped with the service computer, some people saw intervals of 22,500km's.  Crazy.  My car is so equipped, and I ignored the stupid thing from day one, changing Mobil 1 every 7500km.

Mercedes ignored it, but consumers in the US sued and won.  Canadians get the finger.

[ovr50]

Why is the Echo the only vehicle on the road with floors rotting out? Because they used cheap steel and didn't rust-proof it enough/at all.

Where in this world do you get your information from? Is there any substance behind that statement, and if so, provide the link to the "cheap steel" fact? 

[Trainman]

Why is the Echo the only vehicle on the road with floors rotting out? Because they used cheap steel and didn't rust-proof it enough/at all.

Where in this world do you get your information from? Is there any substance behind that statement, and if so, provide the link to the "cheap steel" fact? 

And the "the Echo the only vehicle on the road with floors rotting out" statement.

 

[AVToller]

As my mother used to say, "Consider the source!!"  What other kind of comment would you expect? 

[Trainman]

As my mother used to say, "Consider the source!!"  What other kind of comment would you expect? 

Ah, but I have not been around the board long enough to properly judge some of the sources here, only you and ovr50 (but you are both BC boys so you good to go  ).

[UsedCarAids.com]

Thats some bad rust there..those floors looked pretty bad..im surprised that they rusted out that fast....im sure this is another reason why one should rust proof their cars...i usually grease my frame with thick wheel brearing grease..its messy, but man the stuff is thick and does the job....

[johngenx]

...i usually grease my frame with thick wheel brearing grease..its messy, but man the stuff is thick and does the job....

Too easy.  Saffy, leave it.

[safristi]

which one is "THICKER!!!?"........

[sirAQUAMAN64]

Fact is that while yes, Toyota is being proactive, they had better be. Toyota has a reputation on the line, and this is an issue that most would have thought to have disappeared in the '80's. No company wants to pay hours worth of labour and tie up bay areas for thousands upon thousands of Echos if there wasn't a significant issue. Rust eating out the floor board prematurely IS a significant issue, but if taken care of I'm sure won't turn into a PR fiasco.

Mazda is the model company for me where the customer is taken care of due to warranty issues. They've shown that decades ago when they bought-back all those rotaries, again with the overstated hp (offering free accessories, service dollars, or repurchase), and on the Mazda5 (free loaner for 5-6 weeks, restarting of the warranty period, AND dollars). That said, echoing others (pun intended), the domestics mostly likely wouldn't have stepped up to the plate to recall this issue - they'd instead consider the cost and weigh it against potential lawsuit damages.

In any case, could this be a case of the EH not being 'designed' for Canadian climate? Maybe, maybe not. Sedans are affected too. Man do cars ever look scary when the entire interior is disassembled for something like this. I wouldn't want to be the tech, or get someone on a bad day doing a rush job!