CD Article: Toyota RAV4, 2001-2005

[CD_Editor]

You may discuss our cover story of the day in this thread....
Used Vehicle Review:

With no major trouble spots to look out for and not a single recall, the second-generation Toyota RAV4 has proved to be a very reliable compact SUV, reports Chris Chase.  Downsides? The RAV4 has "a small back seat" and "you'll pay more for a used RAV4," he says.    More...

[Shnak]

Crash safety is a major plus: The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) gave the RAV4 four stars each for driver and front passenger protection in frontal impacts, and five stars for front and rear seat occupant protection in side impacts. In the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety's (IIHS) tougher frontal offset crash test, the RAV4 from 2001 to early 2004 earned an "average" rating. Structural changes made to models built after December 2003 earned later 2004 and 2005 models the IIHS's "good" rating in the frontal offset test. In the IIHS's side impact tests, the RAV4 scored poorly, however (side airbags offered in the U.S., but not in Canada, improved results significantly).

How is "average", "scored poorly" and 4/5 ratings for the front passengers a 'major plus'? I'm sure it's about as safe as other entries in its class... but doesn't it seem odd to somebody else that Chris said safety is a major plus when it's barely average in its segment?

[mrthompson]

Perhaps Chris meant when compared to the previous model?     Compared to others in it's class?

[Howswedeitis]

I had a friend who owned a 2002 and he sold the tin box only a year after owning it.
People think because it has a Toyota badge that it's automatically a well designed
and engineered vehicle...I have to say being around one for a while nothing could
be further from the truth. All one needs to do is slam the door to hear that it's not
a solid piece. You'd think the Japanese were smart but all you need to do is see
where they put the damn oil filter...it's jammed into a nook so close to the exhaust
manifold it makes one wonder what the hell these guys were thinking. This is
a TOY SUV no doubt about it.

[Shnak]

That's what I don't like about the cheaper Toyotas too... they don't feel solid at all... they feel very econobox. A CR-V looks and feels so much more expensive than the RAV4, it's not even funny. Even the new RAV4... I needed all of 2 minutes to realize how cheap it was and how it just didn't feel right. The upper-end Toyotas aren't too bad, but the lower-end ones, I wouldn't want one even if it was given to me. There are much better alternatives than these. And this is just based on the the vehicles themselves, how they are built, the materials, the design inside, how substantial everything feels... things don't improve when you drive them either... the Matrix was a huge disapointment... tons of road/wind/engine noise into the cabin... buzzy and gutless engine. Interior lighted with about 8 different colors... not uniform at all. I haven't driven the Yaris or the RAV4, so I can't comment very much on how they drive... but they are all built similar to one another, so I wouldn't be surprised if I hated all of them equally.

Most Toyotas do NOTHING for me. Only one I'd consider is the Highlander, but then it's growing and getting more expansive soon, so that one won't be as interesting for me, and the Sienna, which is, with the Odyssey, the best minivan on the market IMO. Maybe a Camry when I get older, like 50 years old... but by then, it would probably be a Lexus instead.

I don't to be too hard on the Yaris because it is a small and cheap car, so you can't expect too much out of it... but the RAV4 that can cost upwards of $30k, and the Corolla and Matrix that can get up to the mid-high twenties, that's simply not good enough.

IMO, Toyota is riding the "we're the most-reliable" wave and rely solely on that to increase their market share... look at Honda, they continually innovate and try to improve their interiors with every new generation... and they increase tremendously their level of refinement with every new generation too... the new Civic feels like a million bucks when you sit in it, and inspect it from every angle... you shut a door on that thing and it sounds as good as a Lexus or Audi... it really is an immense improvement over its predecessor... and they even push the safety envoloppe with their safety for everyone campain... 6 airbags in a Fit and Civic, when you don't even get that in a $40k Highlander... Toyota is stuck in a "gotta make the most money we can" mode, and are not working at improving any more. And eventually, short enough, their competitors will catch up, and Toyota will have to start working at it again... and until that happens, no Toyota for me.

EDIT: btw, I have no intention what so ever to bring VW talk into this thread, so don't even try.

[UmroAyyar]

    Toyota is riding the 'reliability' bull because they are the benchmark and they have proven it to be so unlike the other 'unmentionables' AND they're milking the cows. Toyota is providing 'majority' of people what they want from their products, it works for 'majority' of people thats why this large number of people buy it.

[Shnak]

and I agree with that... it works for the majority of people because all they want is a tin box on wheels that won't give them problems...

BUT... I feel as though they have plateau'ed in terms of interiors, materials and overall built quality of their vehicles for a very long time... step into a '95 Corolla and into a '05 Corolla, and you won't notice that big of a difference, in terms of interior, solidness of the vehicle, etc, etc. While their main competitors, namely Honda, is making huge improvements in every aspect of their vehicle-making abilities with each new generation.

[a4_tom]

Except for the fact that RAV4 is a Toyota, none of the area is able to match Forester which I think its the best mini-ute on the market.

[Shnak]

Other than the tight backseat, the Forester is a very interesting vehicle. Good chances that we'll end up replacing the Jetta with a slightly used Forester when we do want to change our vehicle. Either a Forester, or the new CR-V that's coming out next year.

[Seafoam]

That's what I don't like about the cheaper Toyotas too... they don't feel solid at all... they feel very econobox. A CR-V looks and feels so much more expensive than the RAV4, it's not even funny. Even the new RAV4... I needed all of 2 minutes to realize how cheap it was and how it just didn't feel right. The upper-end Toyotas aren't too bad, but the lower-end ones, I wouldn't want one even if it was given to me. There are much better alternatives than these. And this is just based on the the vehicles themselves, how they are built, the materials, the design inside, how substantial everything feels... things don't improve when you drive them either... the Matrix was a huge disapointment... tons of road/wind/engine noise into the cabin... buzzy and gutless engine. Interior lighted with about 8 different colors... not uniform at all. I haven't driven the Yaris or the RAV4, so I can't comment very much on how they drive... but they are all built similar to one another, so I wouldn't be surprised if I hated all of them equally.

Most Toyotas do NOTHING for me. Only one I'd consider is the Highlander, but then it's growing and getting more expansive soon, so that one won't be as interesting for me, and the Sienna, which is, with the Odyssey, the best minivan on the market IMO. Maybe a Camry when I get older, like 50 years old... but by then, it would probably be a Lexus instead.

I don't to be too hard on the Yaris because it is a small and cheap car, so you can't expect too much out of it... but the RAV4 that can cost upwards of $30k, and the Corolla and Matrix that can get up to the mid-high twenties, that's simply not good enough.

IMO, Toyota is riding the "we're the most-reliable" wave and rely solely on that to increase their market share... look at Honda, they continually innovate and try to improve their interiors with every new generation... and they increase tremendously their level of refinement with every new generation too... the new Civic feels like a million bucks when you sit in it, and inspect it from every angle... you shut a door on that thing and it sounds as good as a Lexus or Audi... it really is an immense improvement over its predecessor... and they even push the safety envoloppe with their safety for everyone campain... 6 airbags in a Fit and Civic, when you don't even get that in a $40k Highlander... Toyota is stuck in a "gotta make the most money we can" mode, and are not working at improving any more. And eventually, short enough, their competitors will catch up, and Toyota will have to start working at it again... and until that happens, no Toyota for me.

EDIT: btw, I have no intention what so ever to bring VW talk into this thread, so don't even try.

I think I'm going to puke instead of bringing up VW talk and those $257 block heaters.

Andrew

[Shnak]

I don't blame you... I'd also be puking if I drove a Corolla.

[Seafoam]

I don't blame you... I'd also be puking if I drove a Corolla.

The totally boring, no maintenance required Corolla,yeah that's a terrible car to own.Not everyone needs a drivers car.

Andrew

[locutusx]

agreed, that's one of the reasons so many driving schools go for Corolla's. It's (one of) the easiest car(s) to drive, the perfect choice for the vast majority of the populace...

[ovr50]

Don't worry about it, red and locut - Shnak got tired of bashing Toyota and he's off attacking Subaru now. 

[Shnak]

Don't worry about it, red and locut - Shnak got tired of bashing Toyota and he's off attacking Subaru now. 

I'm not attacking Subaru... I'm replying to ghost's attacks on any brand that isn't Subaru. There's a difference.

[ovr50]

Most of us here can't tell the difference between your "replying" and your "attacking", Shnak. Just a comment, as they feel the same to me. 

[a4_tom]

Are you guys woke up at the wrong side of the beds this morning?

[AVToller]

The "ignore" button is your friend!! 

[mrthompson]

Did someone just say something?  


Just kidding AVtoller. 

[Seafoam]

I was the one that caused all the ruckus when he was crapping all over
low end toyota products like the corolla and rav4. Atleast these "tincans"
are well screwed together and don't require much maintenance to keep them running. Corolla the new " Peoples  Car" This is really a great Canadian automobile forum. I'll shut up now.

Andrew