Author Topic: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.  (Read 17769 times)

Offline JSCC

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Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« on: November 01, 2005, 10:11:05 pm »
I agree on pretty much everything they say in this "unbiased" article.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Comparos/articleId=107677
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Offline footlong58

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2005, 11:03:57 pm »
"But for our $28K we want more personality, and more torque."

I didn't know torque was linked to price...

Acording to Edmunds, a 1989 Camaro IROC is a better car than the 2005 GLI because it offers more torque for a cheaper price, is more fun to drive, and the shifter knob is bigger...    ::)


Why are they comparing a VW to an Acura?  Because the GLI and TSX are similar?  Whats next, a comparo test with a Mustang V6 coupe pitted against a BMW 3 series coupe, all becuase they are both rear drivers with 2 doors and 6 cyl engines with similar power output?







« Last Edit: November 01, 2005, 11:13:27 pm by footlong58 »

Offline JSCC

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2005, 12:26:36 am »
Because they think VW is at the same level as Acura.  :D

Offline avif

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2005, 01:12:55 am »
Well no review is "unbiased" ;) It is just kind of strange that they put the Nav on the TSX and use this price to compare with the GLI. On the other hand, they could use that "money" to get the A-spec suspension instead to even out with Jetta's "sports package". It is kind of not fair to use Jetta with "sport pack" against a TSX without one.

Offline footlong58

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2005, 08:56:49 am »
I'll do a little test...  I'll suggest to the next TSX owner that walks in if they would consider a VW Jetta over their TSX...


Offline mark

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2005, 09:58:11 am »
Footlong, its not an absurd comparison in many people's eyes.  Within the younger demographic especially, the sportier versions of the Jetta do compete with the TSX.

You are in the car business right?  I suggest you don't tell people what they should or should not compare in their selection process.  This always drove me nuts. Some people are actually looking to satisfy a variety of needs and wants in a car, not buy a badge.  To this end, comparisons may take on forms you've not personally considered. 

Knowing your own product and being proud of it is commendable.  What is more commendable is also knowing and appreciating the qualities of other products so you can inform the shopper of the relative benefits of YOUR product.

Quote
On the other hand, they could use that "money" to get the A-spec suspension instead to even out with Jetta's "sports package".

Isn't the A-Spec package cosmetic only?  I actually didn't know it was available on TSX's - I thought it was a TL-S appearance package.

Oil obsessed...

Offline JD

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2005, 10:08:32 am »
"But for our $28K we want more personality, and more torque."

I didn't know torque was linked to price...

Acording to Edmunds, a 1989 Camaro IROC is a better car than the 2005 GLI because it offers more torque for a cheaper price, is more fun to drive, and the shifter knob is bigger...    ::)


Why are they comparing a VW to an Acura?  Because the GLI and TSX are similar?  Whats next, a comparo test with a Mustang V6 coupe pitted against a BMW 3 series coupe, all becuase they are both rear drivers with 2 doors and 6 cyl engines with similar power output?

It sounds to me like someone is stinging from VW taking sales from Acura...

Offline quadzilla

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2005, 10:18:44 am »
I can actually see people cross shopping these two cars.  Today people start with many choices on their list.  We cross shopped the Forester and Mazda6, two cars that are not the same.  There are so many good choices out there the starting lists are only greater than they use to be.

Offline footlong58

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2005, 10:19:00 am »
Footlong, its not an absurd comparison in many people's eyes.  Within the younger demographic especially, the sportier versions of the Jetta do compete with the TSX.

You are in the car business right?  I suggest you don't tell people what they should or should not compare in their selection process.  This always drove me nuts. Some people are actually looking to satisfy a variety of needs and wants in a car, not buy a badge.  To this end, comparisons may take on forms you've not personally considered. 

Knowing your own product and being proud of it is commendable.  What is more commendable is also knowing and appreciating the qualities of other products so you can inform the shopper of the relative benefits of YOUR product.

Quote
On the other hand, they could use that "money" to get the A-spec suspension instead to even out with Jetta's "sports package".

Isn't the A-Spec package cosmetic only?  I actually didn't know it was available on TSX's - I thought it was a TL-S appearance package.




I agree with you 100%, never sell anything buy knocking someone else's product... I don't mean to come across that way, but I'm not in sales, I'm in fixed ops... :)  I just find Edmunds is saying the TSX is a piece compared to the VW...  Tech wise, the cars are very similar, but is a VW customer generally the same as an Acura customer?  I'm not sure...

As for the A-Spec packages... On the TSX, the A-Spec gives you a body kit, Ebony 17" wheels, A-Spec badging, and a lower, sport suspension...  Same goes for the TL, RSX... But the TL gives you 18's...

Offline footlong58

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2005, 10:20:53 am »
"But for our $28K we want more personality, and more torque."

I didn't know torque was linked to price...

Acording to Edmunds, a 1989 Camaro IROC is a better car than the 2005 GLI because it offers more torque for a cheaper price, is more fun to drive, and the shifter knob is bigger...    ::)


Why are they comparing a VW to an Acura?  Because the GLI and TSX are similar?  Whats next, a comparo test with a Mustang V6 coupe pitted against a BMW 3 series coupe, all becuase they are both rear drivers with 2 doors and 6 cyl engines with similar power output?

It sounds to me like someone is stinging from VW taking sales from Acura...

I assure you, Honda/Acura isn't scared of VW taking away their sales...


Offline sirAQUAMAN64

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2005, 10:55:00 am »
No comparable? How NOT?  :think:

Dimensions are nearly identical inside and out - save for the trunk where the Jetta is about 3 cubic feet larger.

Engine size and HP are the same - except where the Jetta has around 40lb-ft more torque at thousands less rpm.

Fuel efficiency is nearly the same - this one goes to the TSX, amazingly. Honda knows how to build a good, solid, rev-happy, fuel-efficient-when-you-don't engine.

Equipment levels can be optioned nearly the same.

Price is completely comparable - you can get yourself into a Jetta GLI for less money for those who don't need all the bells and whistles or don't want to stretch to $35Gs, but since the option packages are more expensive on GLI it probably will cost a bit more than TSX loaded, or about the same (hard to know as pricing hasn't been announced - compared to the US, Canadian pricing is a tad lower).

And for the final point, the TSX is a European Honda Accord. An Acura here, but 'just a great product' in my mind. Not super luxurious, although it comes loaded for the value price. Acura is a value luxury brand in Canada anyhow (save for the new RL). VW's aren't dirt cheap, are somewhat of a premium brand within the categories they compete, and are rarely compared to Chevrolets either.

To me, they're both fantastic vehicles. TSX is probably better for most people as it is slightly more luxurious and is an easy car to drive fluidly, the GLI is probably better for those who want to stand-out just a bit and appreciate the extra punch of power.

Really, this is a really appropriate comparison. One many were waiting to see.
AQUAMAN64 also posts on DriverBlogs.com!

Offline lebowski

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2005, 11:08:12 am »
hell yes, Aquaman, well put. i agree, the TSX vs. GLI is, as the edmunds article stated, as closely matched a comparison as they've had. i shoud know, as i own a 2004 tsx, and would have seriously considered the GLI had it been available when i was looking. had it been available, i still would have chosen the TSX, if only for price: i bought my tsx used, and since the GLI would have been new, there would have been about a $7000 price difference. price independent, i would have gone for the GLI - much as i love my TSX and how smooth it is - best gearbox i've ever tried - i wouldn't have minded some extra low-end thrust and a sportier suspension, as well as a tighter/heavier steering feel, as reported in the GLI. bottom line is that these cars are very comparable, and people are seriously misinformed if they don't think they're being cross-shopped.

L

Offline sirAQUAMAN64

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2005, 11:29:57 am »
Of course, the DSG availability in the GLI might turn up the fun quotient even more!  :D
Plus, it's a great no-compromise for a family with one shared vehicle, or when going on trips, where one spouse likes a manual and the other doesn't know how/doesn't want to drive manual.

Welcome to the forum L  :cheers:

Offline lebowski

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2005, 12:06:29 pm »
thanks for the welcome, aquaman. the DSG sounds great.  i've never read so many positive reviews of a manu-matic transmission. i guess if vw is willing to offer the DSG  in a 1000hp bugatti, it can't be all that bad  :)

Offline sirAQUAMAN64

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2005, 12:26:21 pm »
Bienvenue on the welcome  :D

And yeah, DSG really is a definiting feature and advantage of the VWs and Audis. The VW Group as far as I know has a few years exclusive use of it from Borg-Warner before they market it to other automakers, while BMW tries to redesign their SMG system to come up to par. Still, DSG gets glowing remarks from nearly everybody. And while I used to think I wouldn't want to replace two clutches when that time comes, I realize now that since you're not physically activating the clutch and the system does it electronically, it'll probably be more accurate and shift faster meaning it'll have ultra-long life before wearing.

http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000057066056/
The first and last lines really say a lot :P, but the comments (which I can't relate to myself) less so  :-[
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 12:35:00 pm by sirAQUAMAN64 »

Offline lebowski

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2005, 02:21:49 pm »
yeah, i can't wait to try the DSG. reliability issues aside, my next car could be a GTI or an A3 DSG (i like the smaller profile of the hatchbacks). the article seems to hit the nail on the head. VW's got a killer engine in the 2.0t, and it contributes to an overall package that competes well with the TSX, but brand identity is apparently invaluable to selling cars in NA.

the comments were way harsh on VW, but that's always been the general consensus with VW ownership - if you're going play, prepare to pay (more than you should have to). problem is VW likes to shag you both ways: you pay a lot up front for what appears to be a premium quality compact car, and then you pay a lot in repairs and maintenance, too much of it unscheduled.

it shouldn' have to be this way: subaru's impreza line (both the base and the wrx) is an example of how you can build a premium small car with minimal maintenance nightmares for the owner down the road. they pay a lot up front and very little down the road. for the record, i owned a '98 jetta wolfsburg that did very well for 7 years and 115 000 km, and then the electrical gremlins started. i followed my mechanic's advice and ditched her shortly thereafter - as such i have few complaints with my VW ownership experience, but had i held on to it i'm sure i'd be singing a different tune today.

Lebowski
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 02:27:09 pm by lebowski »

Offline sirAQUAMAN64

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2005, 02:35:03 pm »
Yeah, I hear the horror stories too.

I have 288K on my German built '01 Golf TDI with very few issues. RFront wheel bearing, left strut mount (hit the curb twice in winter on that side), and a day after delivery my check airbag light was on. No squeeks or rattles at all still. But, on my last servicing they said my tie rods were loose so I'll have to get that fixed when I get the timing belt changed shortly. And there was a hole in my exhaust to the rear of the catalytic converter that I had Midas replace for $90 two months ago.

I do believe that generally they are a higher maintenance car you should care more for (my '97 Hyundai Accent was pretty much indestructable save for a computer module which was covered under goodwill at 120K no questions asked) but I wouldn't consider myself a babier of a car. My friends mostly are, but still they haven't had many issues (in friends and family there are a '92 Jetta, '01 Jetta 1.8T Wolfsburg, '00 Golf GL, '02 GTI 337, '99 Passat 1.8T sedan, and '04 Passat 1.8T wagon). Since I haven't experienced issues, and I honestly believe people have blown the VW quality thing out of proportion (other German makes I'm sure have just as many issues, except that usually those are luxury buyers who can more easily pay for the servicing and also - more importantly - get treated and pampered more by those luxury franchise dealerships) I will probably buy another Volkswagen Golf, GTI, Golf Plus, Polo, or Touran if/when available. I'll scope out the market and have an open mind (Hyundais and the Nissan Versa look attractive feature/quality/engine/price-wise), but really like the VWs - engines, fuel economy, roominess, design, solidity, safety, features. That all does come at a price tho.

EDIT: LOVE the A3 in the Murano Green, Venetian Violet, Blues, and white, but the roofline I like so much on the outside compromises head room far too much for me. I'm 6'4" and larger framed. I sat in an A3 and thought "my goodness this is small"... the doors are narrow, back seat short on legroom, and the trunk too. Got in the Jetta and it felt much better, so I'm sure I'll like the Golf/GTI.

I'm pretty sure VW Group realizes there's a concern over quality, and public perception has elevated that to atmospheric heights. They're working on it though - and losing $2B in America alone prompts swift action. The newer cars seem to have more durable interior plastics (less peeling), better electricals, and are still built solidly and have character. But the Mk V Golf and Jetta are still vehicles largely under Piech's reign of uncompromising design... I'm kind of not looking forward to reduced perceived quality products which will likely come from Bernhard. But I'm crossing my fingers.

Overall tho, new VAG products are showing as being more reliable. The Audi A6, for example, marks a huge improvement over the older one and is ranking near the top in initial quality within the luxury market.   
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 02:54:02 pm by sirAQUAMAN64 »

Offline lebowski

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2005, 02:52:29 pm »
well it's good to hear that not all is dark and gloomy for VW owners. if all of those cars in your family, aquaman, have experienced such few problems, then perhaps VW's quality woes are  bit exaggerated. you make an excellent point about what people expect from VW versus what they would if they were buying a BMW 3er or a Mini - cars that have greater prestige, even if the prices are similar (for a base bimmer vs. a loaded GLI, at least). but i guess those other dealers are bit better at coddling their customers.  it will be interesting to see how VW will address their quality control and customer service issues. As for the cars themselves, i will gladly trade some chrome here and a few soft-touch plastics there for a more reliable car that remains fun to drive.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 03:00:05 pm by lebowski »

Offline Shnak

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2005, 02:53:48 pm »
it shouldn' have to be this way: subaru's impreza line (both the base and the wrx) is an example of how you can build a premium small car with minimal maintenance nightmares for the owner down the road. they pay a lot up front and very little down the road.

The words Impreza and premium should NEVER be in the same sentence, especially not when a less expensive '06 Civic puts it to shame in terms of interior materials and design quality.

Offline footlong58

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Re: Acura TSX vs VW Jetta GLI review.
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2005, 03:01:21 pm »
it shouldn' have to be this way: subaru's impreza line (both the base and the wrx) is an example of how you can build a premium small car with minimal maintenance nightmares for the owner down the road. they pay a lot up front and very little down the road.

The words Impreza and premium should NEVER be in the same sentence, especially not when a less expensive '06 Civic puts it to shame in terms of interior materials and design quality.


Agreed... Everytime I read an Impreza review, they always comment on how dull the interior is...