Topic: Vee Dubya

[Snowman]

When Is VW going to get it together?
 
The Volkswagen brand sales are sinking fast and are  down 16% from  a year ago. With Audi added in, the company total in the U.S. is 254,035, down 14% from last year. This is sad, what happened to the VW comeback that started in March 1998 with the introduction of the New Beetle. VW sales went from 136,000 in 1997 to 356,000 in 2001, but have been falling since that time. For all of 2004, sales of VW vehicles will probably drop to 260,000 in the U.S.
 
VW missed the boat on the big American sport-utility market with nearly 5 million vehicles sold. Why did VW not develop a small low-priced model to cpmpete with the CR-V, RAV,  or Jeep Liberty. What about a reasonable pricedlarger SUV with three rows of seats. All VW offers is the fairly expensive Touareg.

Volkswagen's specialty has been small cars……like the Golf, the Jetta and New Beetle. But small cars are a hard sell in America and itt is tough to succeed in a market when you don't offer the vehicles the customers want. Not only does VW lack a low-priced sport-utility vehicle, it also lacks a minivan or a pickup. This means that the company is not operating in nearly half the American market.
 
Another problem is it also takes forever for VW to get its new cars to America. That new Golf went on sale in Europe in the fall of 2003. Although the sporty Golf GTI will arrive here next fall, it will be another year before the next generation Golf models are ready for the U.S. That's fack’n retarded. Unfortunately none of these updated automobiles will solve VW's problems in the U.S. and I don't think that Volkswagen's diesel cars will be much help either.  

Piech’s grandiose plan of moving up-market with the Passat oddball W-8 cylinder configuration and the  high-priced Phaeton car were a complete failure. Valuabe company resources are tied up developing a $1 million Bugatti supercar…..WTF.  VW has ignored the American customer and is now paying the price.
 
VW needs direction…….will Wolfgang Bernhard be the man? VW has hired Wolfgang who was chief operating officer of Chrysler in Detroit. Bernard gets credit for the new Chrysler 300, the hottest car in the U.S. He was sent Germany to head Mercedes-Benz. But the unions thought he was too tough and punted him out…..he quit and was snagged up by VW.

What will be next for VW…will Bernard take his knowledge of the U.S. market and start the slow turnaround and make VW the people’s car again?

[slove]

All the above and the fact that VW targeted themselves to young urbans and those with no money. Quite a few of my friends, myself included, always wanted a VW of some sort coming out of school (I almost bought a Scirocco). But, they were always just out of reach for what they really were. Which is what probably misled the company to attempt upmarket - at a time when SUV's rule and the small car market is buying value in Kia and Hyundai.  

There seems to be no one auto manufacturer carving a niche these days. It's all about horsepower and model turnaround. The 'finesse' of what was once a VW has fallen wayside to what's hot at the moment. Bang out more products like the R32.  

Good perspectives Snowman.

[Sir Osis of Liver]

As long as VW sells at a premium relative to Japanese competition, they are destined to loose out. The whole attempt to move upmarket was destined to fail. Never before has a value brand successfully gone upmarket. In the past new divisions were created in order to do this. VW already has a number of upmarket brands, so why in the name of god did they try to push upmarket? Baffles me completely!

They need to focus on good quality and reasonable value with 4-5 year max product cycles. If they can’t do that they will join FIAT, Renault, Peugeot on the list of failed European brands in the N.A. market.  

[Shnak]

Say what you want, but a 25000$ VW is better value than a 20000$ Honda to my eyes. After driving a VW, let alone a diesel!, I have serious doubts that I'll ever go back to Honda or Toyota. It's simply worlds beyond in terms of driving dynamics and like S60 says about his Volvos, just like Volvos, VWs feel vault-like. That's what I love most about it, how solid it feels.

[Snowman]

I think you need to visit an optometrist Shnak. Your retina has detached from all the slaps in the back of you head.

Nobody here has said VW’s are bad cars…..they have just lost their way.

[quadzilla]

I've read that almost 50% of Jetta/Golf sales are diesel in Canada.  If there was another choice (Honda, Toyota, Mazda or even the Ford Focus) how many sales would they loose here?  I think it would be a lot.  

The base prices of Jettas range from 24 to 32 grand which I think is a lot of money for a small car.  They may feel more 'vault' like but does this really matter to the mass consumer?  They all look at price and reliability.

No sport cutes as mentioned above is also another reason.  Put the 2.0 diesel in a cute and it would sell, well if they priced it right.

I thought it was going to be great when I heard about the diesel Touareg but at base price of 85 grand, I'll have to pass on that one.

I think VW makes great looking/driving cars but not nice enough to get me extra dollars.

[ovr50]

The '05 Jeep Liberty will be available w diesel.

[Shnak]

I know Quadzilla... I never said the VWs appeal to everyone... they don't. Most people will see a Civic at 18-19k, and a Jetta at 25-26k, and automatically they'll go for the Civic for the price and the exceptional reputation Honda has.

Those who purchase VWs are VW fans. And I guess VW is losing their way with their VW fans as they sell less and less cars every year that passes...

[Snowman]

VW Could Lose A Billion
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7683

[Sir Osis of Liver]

I know that VW has a hardcore following, but are they enough to float the company? Looking at their sales, I’d say not. In order to survive, companies must have at least a few products that can garner a broad following, save the niche vehicle for the cognoscenti.

If Toyota put a diesel in the Corolla( or Honda in the Civic etc), what would happen to Golf/Jetta sales? Right in the crapper. So far they have been lucky because the Japanese companies don't favour diesels.

[safristi]

Interesting thread.VW from Peachy to Piechy almost self destructive,has he too much power or a personality disorder??Hmmm.... and BT why aren't the Japanese deiselworthy???...local pollution worries,high sulphur deisel any thoughts...I too lost a BILLION...forgot to take my empties back....

[WW]

I agree that VW has lost their way. They want to move to luxury territory but I think they'd do better if they stayed in the same markey they were in. As for the Jetta, I always saw it as a notch above Civics. Or at least a high end Civic.

[saint_satan]

I don't really follow VW but what I do know of them I find the fit and finish to be excellent, the steering and handling tight and a high maintenance vehicle.  Pricing is out of sink for thier market, though. $25,000 for a fully loaded Golf hatchback - think of what $25K buys you - Honda Accord, Subaru Impreza, Toyota Camry.  For much less money you can get into a Matrix or Mazda hatch, etc.  You might get some people to pony up the extra scratch if the ugly spectre of sub-par reliability didn't rear its head.  I think there are better choices out there for the dollar - and apparently so do a lot of people.  VW shop rates/maintenace schedule border on robbery

[mrthompson]

The '05 Liberty diesel will be factory filled with B5 biodiesel.  

[asdf]

I agree with SS.  Other than the TDI, there is no reason to buy a VW.  Across the board, the competition has better offerings at a lower price and, in most cases, better reliability.

I hope they enforce stricter standards on diesel emissions before our streets become filled with diesel cars.  Otherwise, I can't imagine what it would be like to be stuck in rush our traffic on the 401 with hundreds of diesel cars.

[Shnak]

Saint_satan, you know, I considered the Vibe/Matrix and Mazda hatch... quickly stratched the 3 from my list, just too small, couldn't find a good driving position. And the Matrix, well I did fit in it, but I really don't like that engine, and when I drove my friend's Vibe, I really didn't like how it acted on the highway... power takes a long time to come, so passing is like it was in my CR-V... shaky... and just the way it feels on the road... wind affects it a lot, LOTS of wind/road noise. It just doesn't feel solid!

After driving a 1991 VW Passat for more than a year, the CR-V was a huge disapointment in a lot of aspects. In fact, the ONLY car which felt as/more solid than my '91 Passat was my girlfriend's parents' 1998 Mercedes C240 (that's the model I think). Anything else, Accord, Camry, Intrepid, whatever.

I'm a firm believer that the europeans (esp. germans) simply build better, more solid cars!

I considered other cars like the Suzuki Aerio Fastback (Lots of space, funky styling, but I like the format. Too bad for the digital dashboard in the up to 2004 models), and the Hyundai Elantra GT (slightly too small for me).

Sure, with 0% financing, lower MSRP and a lot more bargaining possible for 2004 models, I'm sure in the end, I would've saved easily 8-10000$ had I gone with an Elantra or Aerio instead of the Golf.

But after driving the little Golf TDI, everything else didn't feel "right". So, in the end, it was either going with the 04 VW Golf TDI, or keeping the CR-V for another year.

So I guess you could call me a "VW fan". Of course, my next car will be something european also... in decent sized sedans, somewhat cheap, the choices will be limited... Passat, some kind of BMW, Volvo S60/V70, Saab 9-5 (if not too bastardized by GM). We'll see.

[Shnak]

Asdf, from what I read, diesel cars pollute less than normal engines... and even if they did pollute a little more, you burn A LOT less fuel with a diesel engine than a gas engine! So in the end, you used less carburant.

[asdf]

The pollutants I am talking about is soot/particulate matter and not "green house" emissions.  Drive behind a truck and you will understand what I am talking about.  

[S60]

Poor European Test Standards Understate Air Pollution From Cars  
10/26/2004    


Current test cycles for new vehicles do not reflect how cars are used under real driving conditions and so underestimate their actual emissions. This may help to explain why urban air quality is not improving as fast as vehicle data suggest it should, the report says.  

The shortcomings of the test standards also mean that, while Europe's motor industry is on track to meet a commitment to reduce CO2 emissions from new cars by one quarter between 1995 and 2008, greenhouse gas emissions from air conditioning and other in-car equipment not covered could in reality cancel out around half of the improvement.  

Even with the car industry's commitment, overall CO2 emissions from transport are projected to increase by 25% between 1990 and 2010, but without it the rise would be 35%.  

Some 15% of the CO2 improvement achieved so far has been due to the increasing market share of diesel cars, which are more fuel-efficient than petrol vehicles.  
On a brighter note, strong growth under way in the use of biofuels – transport fuels made from crops and other organic material – should help the transport sector to limit increases in its CO2 emissions. However, it is important that the biofuels are produced in ways that minimise other potentially negative impacts on the environment.  

http://www.pollutiononline.com/content/news/article.asp?DocID={8161195A-8D74-4 E84-92A2-7724111EFA63}&Bucket=Current+Headlines&VNETCOOKIE=NO



(Message edited by S60 on October 27, 2004)

[Shnak]

In any case, I'm not a pollution expert, so you might be right... all I know is that my car doesn't smell anything or doesn't produce smoke other than the first maybe 10-15 seconds it runs on the morning.

But you might very well be right... there has to be a reason why VW stopped selling their TDIs in some states in the US like California and New York... I guess they don't pass the stricter laws there... but from what I read, VW blames terrible diesel quality over here in north america... in 2006, we'll be getting the same diesel quality as they have over in europe. Maybe then diesel vehicles will polute less than gazoline ones. I don't know.